E90Post
 


Bimmer Retrofit
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > BEP Billet Compressor Wheel Install & Results



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-19-2012, 10:03 PM   #45
Dave W.
Lieutenant
 
Drives: Porsche 951, 1992 Eagle Talon
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: SF Bay Area

Posts: 476
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpsimon View Post
+1 you need at the VERY least a clipped turbine, even still at this point in the game a full upgrade is key
Which begs the question; Would stock turbos pick up power with just a clipped turbine wheel when tuned for high boost?
The reason I ask is because there's a lot more exhaust going through the turbine wheel when the boost is cranked up. Maybe just removing a little exhaust restriction will free up some power on the same compressor? Test that first, then test a clipped turbine wheel with the funky bat wing compressor.
Dave W. is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-19-2012, 10:59 PM   #46
Dr. G
Brigadier General
 
Dr. G's Avatar
 
Drives: Black e92 335i
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brampton, Ontario

Posts: 4,946
iTrader: (32)

Garage List
e92 BMW 335i  [4.35]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W. View Post
Which begs the question; Would stock turbos pick up power with just a clipped turbine wheel when tuned for high boost?
The reason I ask is because there's a lot more exhaust going through the turbine wheel when the boost is cranked up. Maybe just removing a little exhaust restriction will free up some power on the same compressor? Test that first, then test a clipped turbine wheel with the funky bat wing compressor.
I've been wondering the same. OP should next pioneer that project since labour cost for installs isn't an issue
__________________
JB4 / OSS Angel Eyes / Downpipes / F1-Racewerks FMIC / Custom Meth Kit / BMS DCI / ER Chargepipe / HKS BOV / BMS Meth Elbow / BMW Performance Exhaust / Carbon Fiber Inlay Quad Tips / 19" Miro 111 / Front Aero Lip / M3 Sides / VRS CSL Trunk / Mtech Rear / DD CF Quad Finned Diffuser / LCI Tails / BBK / Smoked Reflectors / F1 Euphoria LED Interior / License LED's / GT 5000k Corners / 5000k HID Fogs / Air Scoops / LED Turn Signals / FK Silverline Coilovers / HPA endlinks / Vibrant Resonators / Osram CBI 5000k D1S
Dr. G is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-19-2012, 11:23 PM   #47
rader1
Banned
 
Drives: Cobb Stage 2+ 135i
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Roanoke, VA

Posts: 2,197
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W. View Post
Which begs the question; Would stock turbos pick up power with just a clipped turbine wheel when tuned for high boost?
The reason I ask is because there's a lot more exhaust going through the turbine wheel when the boost is cranked up. Maybe just removing a little exhaust restriction will free up some power on the same compressor? Test that first, then test a clipped turbine wheel with the funky bat wing compressor.
I'm fairly certain that's what the Helix turbos are(not the batmowheel part.) I have yet to see any dyno graphs showing results of the Helix turbos on any of the current tunes, despite my attempts to get in touch with Helix through email.

When it comes times for my turbos to be replaced i'd be interested in the Helix units as far as value goes. However, if they lose or just maintain the same power as the stocker then i'd like to know before dumping the extra dough.
rader1 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2012, 12:20 PM   #48
ETS Michael
 
ETS Michael's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, WA

Posts: 1,160
iTrader: (4)

Send a message via AIM to ETS Michael
Quote:
Originally Posted by rader1 View Post
I'm fairly certain that's what the Helix turbos are(not the batmowheel part.) I have yet to see any dyno graphs showing results of the Helix turbos on any of the current tunes, despite my attempts to get in touch with Helix through email.

When it comes times for my turbos to be replaced i'd be interested in the Helix units as far as value goes. However, if they lose or just maintain the same power as the stocker then i'd like to know before dumping the extra dough.
They may be the FP units.

http://store.forcedperformance.net/m...=Turbo-Upgrade

If you scroll to the bottom.

Twin 55HTA TD03 upgraded turbos for BMW 335i & 135i - $2250.00

Thanks for posting this up OP. I noticed the wheel a couple days ago on the TC.com website.
ETS Michael is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2012, 12:27 PM   #49
jpsimon
Team Zissou
 
jpsimon's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 STi
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CT

Posts: 9,003
iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rader1 View Post
I'm fairly certain that's what the Helix turbos are(not the batmowheel part.) I have yet to see any dyno graphs showing results of the Helix turbos on any of the current tunes, despite my attempts to get in touch with Helix through email.

When it comes times for my turbos to be replaced i'd be interested in the Helix units as far as value goes. However, if they lose or just maintain the same power as the stocker then i'd like to know before dumping the extra dough.
Waste of time, the Helix ones are essentially the same as the EPL/Tial ones. If you're going to spend the time and money to replace the turbos you might as well get a full upgrade (asr, rb, single turbo).
__________________
2015 STi / 335xi (solid)
www.datazap.me - fast, free, interactive data log viewing

jpsimon is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-09-2013, 10:52 PM   #50
unoriginal
Private
 
Drives: e92 335i
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Orlando, FL

Posts: 67
iTrader: (1)

How long did the turbo removal and re-install take you?
unoriginal is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-10-2013, 09:49 AM   #51
Vargasturbotech
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Vargasturbotech's Avatar
 
Drives: N54
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA

Posts: 1,127
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by themyst View Post
They are already prebalanced, direct swap and replace. I have experience with this setup.

I will repeat, the stock turbine is your bottleneck. If it's possible to clip the stock turbine wheel, then you MIGHT gain a little power out of these things. Then you have to account for the wastegates.

I don't mean to rain on your parade OP, but prepare to be disappointed. You will LOSE power. I showed you my results.
As far as balancing. This is NOT the case at all. If you remove the compressor wheel and do not rebalance you are rolling the dice 100%, some will end up close and be fine others will be way out and end up eating themselves quicker then if you had them balanced. We have a quite a bit of experience with the "batmo" Wheel in the diesel industry, complete and total gimmick, makes no extra power, in most cases makes less power. Its a simple case of, if this "batmo" wheel design is so efficient and so much better then a standard 6x6 blade, or 11 blade wheel, why are none of the big boys, Garrett, BW, Holset, MHI, who spend tens of millions on wheel design and testing using a batmo wheel? That says all you need to know. Anytime you remove a wheel from a turbocharger stack it needs to be rebalanced, period. They are balanced separately from the factory sure, but once they become a set, they are balanced together, then the entire CHRA is balanced, if you disturb any of that, they need to be rebalanced. People can tell you otherwise, any real turbo shop will tell you this. You do speak the truth on the exhaust being the bottle neck, going with the same size comp wheel in the "crapmo" design as a lot of people in the diesel industry have dubbed them, is not going to help you at all.
Vargasturbotech is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-10-2013, 12:03 PM   #52
007_e350
Captain
 
007_e350's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i 2008 <E90>
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Chicago

Posts: 956
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vargasturbotech View Post
As far as balancing. This is NOT the case at all. If you remove the compressor wheel and do not rebalance you are rolling the dice 100%, some will end up close and be fine others will be way out and end up eating themselves quicker then if you had them balanced. We have a quite a bit of experience with the "batmo" Wheel in the diesel industry, complete and total gimmick, makes no extra power, in most cases makes less power. Its a simple case of, if this "batmo" wheel design is so efficient and so much better then a standard 6x6 blade, or 11 blade wheel, why are none of the big boys, Garrett, BW, Holset, MHI, who spend tens of millions on wheel design and testing using a batmo wheel? That says all you need to know. Anytime you remove a wheel from a turbocharger stack it needs to be rebalanced, period. They are balanced separately from the factory sure, but once they become a set, they are balanced together, then the entire CHRA is balanced, if you disturb any of that, they need to be rebalanced. People can tell you otherwise, any real turbo shop will tell you this. You do speak the truth on the exhaust being the bottle neck, going with the same size comp wheel in the "crapmo" design as a lot of people in the diesel industry have dubbed them, is not going to help you at all.
+1 the whole CHRA is supposed to be balanced - but the OP's problem is loss of power, curious if the OP thought abt grinding the inners and putting a bigger wheel, the downside is increased spoolup time
007_e350 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-15-2013, 04:54 PM   #53
M3Tuner44
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: May 2010
Location: long Island

Posts: 255
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 007_e350 View Post
+1 the whole CHRA is supposed to be balanced - but the OP's problem is loss of power, curious if the OP thought abt grinding the inners and putting a bigger wheel, the downside is increased spoolup time
I had the assembly balanced and the turbine wheels were clipped. The car did make more power once they were clipped, and considerably more when I installed the full exhaust after the clipped turbine wheels. Then of course even more when I fed her some Meth. There wasn't a big change in spool-up time since the turbos are considerably small.
M3Tuner44 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-15-2013, 04:59 PM   #54
Vargasturbotech
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Vargasturbotech's Avatar
 
Drives: N54
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA

Posts: 1,127
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Tuner44 View Post
Well it has been on other cars with larger turbos and they worked fine.
We have never seen a Batmo wheel do anything besides make the same power or less, never more, on quite a few different platforms. You did the right thing, taking them back apart, balancing them, and clipping. You basically now have half of a stage 1 set up, clipped turbine wheels but stock sized compressors. The clipping should help with the back pressure, and exhaust flow through the turbo.
Vargasturbotech is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-15-2013, 05:22 PM   #55
M3Tuner44
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: May 2010
Location: long Island

Posts: 255
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vargasturbotech View Post
We have never seen a Batmo wheel do anything besides make the same power or less, never more, on quite a few different platforms. You did the right thing, taking them back apart, balancing them, and clipping. You basically now have half of a stage 1 set up, clipped turbine wheels but stock sized compressors. The clipping should help with the back pressure, and exhaust flow through the turbo.
Yes it definatelly helped especially when combined with the exhaust and the high flow cats.
M3Tuner44 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-15-2013, 09:37 PM   #56
Aerotest
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: 2008 E90 335i 6MT
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Yo mama

Posts: 208
iTrader: (0)

Clipping improves exhaust flow but decreases adiabatic effeciency. It is a penalized improvement. Would like to see a compressor map or turbine map for any of these so called stage upgrades......you know like the "big boys" do.
Aerotest is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-07-2014, 09:40 AM   #57
Stan.mac
Second Lieutenant
 
Stan.mac's Avatar
 
Drives: 135i M-Sport
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: NoVA

Posts: 297
iTrader: (3)

Has there been any update on this from MeTuner44? I'm so glad I found this post because I almost jumped into buying the compressor wheel used by OP for the same exact upgrade. I now have a set of turbos sitting around, also a set of TD04L 14T centers that I'm trying to mate up. Has anyone done/completed this setup before? Vargas you mentioned "half of a stage 1 setup" if you don't mind, can you explain what the other half is?
__________________
"I live my life a quarter mile at a time. Nothing else matters: not the mortgage, not the store, not my team and all their bullshit. For those ten seconds or less, I'm free."
afe DCI/Greddy Oil Catch Can/Catless DP/ Cobb Stage 2+/Berk Axle-Back(Race)/AAW CP w BOV/H&R Springs/ ALPINA Flash/Helix FMIC/
Stan.mac is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:28 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST