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      11-29-2012, 01:13 PM   #1
makkan00
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Battery Cables and alternator size in E9X

Hi Guys
I have googled about it but could not find any results.

Does anybody know what is the size of battery cables in E9x series?
Is it 4 AWG or 0AWG or something else?

Also what is the specs of alternator?


I am asking this questions as my car has 1.5K audio stuff and my car suffers from voltage drop. It has become apparent since I have added Alpine PDX 1.1000 and 1K sub in my car.

I have gone to hidden menu and found followings:

Voltage when car is on and music off: 14.1-14.6
Voltage when XD600/6 is on: 13-14.6
Voltage when XD600/6 + 1.1000 are on and on max vol: 12.12/20 - 13.9-14
(serious light dimmings)

I have asked few people and suggestions are to go for big3 upgrades.

Wonder, if anybody's car here suffer from voltage drop and what has been done so far with E9x series?
Thanks.
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      11-29-2012, 02:18 PM   #2
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A drop to 12v doesn't sound too bad. I think you're right at the limit though of what the electrical system can do. Big 3 is not going to do much in our cars. You can try doubling up on the battery ground and see if that helps, but I'm not sure it will. If you want my advice, change to an IB setup through the ski hole and run more SPL with better SQ and less rattle on 1/3 the power.
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      11-29-2012, 08:46 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
A drop to 12v doesn't sound too bad. I think you're right at the limit though of what the electrical system can do. Big 3 is not going to do much in our cars. You can try doubling up on the battery ground and see if that helps, but I'm not sure it will. If you want my advice, change to an IB setup through the ski hole and run more SPL with better SQ and less rattle on 1/3 the power.
I am seriously considering the IB setup through my non-fold down seat. I will cut a hole through the hard plastic backing of the seat and make it look nice. You would be able to keep the armrest up right? No need to pull it down while you are playing music right?
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      11-29-2012, 08:52 PM   #4
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I am seriously considering the IB setup through my non-fold down seat. I will cut a hole through the hard plastic backing of the seat and make it look nice. You would be able to keep the armrest up right? No need to pull it down while you are playing music right?
Depends how you do the baffle. I would just screw it against the back seat but for that the armrest would need to be down. If you do a separate baffle behind the seats, you may be able to keep the armrest up, but it would sound much better with it down.
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      11-30-2012, 12:17 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
A drop to 12v doesn't sound too bad. I think you're right at the limit though of what the electrical system can do. Big 3 is not going to do much in our cars. You can try doubling up on the battery ground and see if that helps, but I'm not sure it will. If you want my advice, change to an IB setup through the ski hole and run more SPL with better SQ and less rattle on 1/3 the power.
Kaigoss
Battery ground is going to be 0AWG soon. But as you said, I am not expecting a lot of difference.
Re: IB through ski hole, kaigoss in my experience, IB on speaker shelf always worked better for me. And trust me on this, it works really really good. (and Audi / Merc follows the same method)

I will be updating PDX 1.1000 ---> JL 1000/1 soon and IB driver should sort it out.
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      11-30-2012, 12:35 PM   #6
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If you can fit a 15 on the shelf, go ahead! A single 10 is not going to be able to give you enough SPL, from what it sounds like.
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      11-30-2012, 12:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
If you can fit a 15 on the shelf, go ahead!


No I cannot do it and hence sticking with 10 or max 12 inch driver.
I see what you are saying. Behind the seat, we can fit whatever size we like.

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Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
A single 10 is not going to be able to give you enough SPL, from what it sounds like.

Yes, indeed you are correct. I used to have 2X12 in rear shelf and they were brilliant.

I'll wait till you find a solution for IB behind the rear seats and will follow your installation.
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      12-02-2012, 01:03 PM   #8
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Update:

-Change the -ve wire of battery to 0AWG (earth Cable).
-Added 2F capacitor.

I am not sure which one is working but voltage drop is limited to 13V now on full volume and hardly goes to 12.8 on repeated bass.

Good results achieved by simple mods.

Next is to hunt better subwoofer driver.
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      12-02-2012, 01:10 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
If you can fit a 15 on the shelf, go ahead! A single 10 is not going to be able to give you enough SPL, from what it sounds like.
You guys are very lucky as everything is damn cheap in USA. And at the top of it, you have many companies in your country and most of the orders are fulfilled by local companies.

I was thinking of going for Fi IB3 12 inch or JL 12 W7.
Both of them has to come from USA.

Fi IB3 is only $200 there and it is 200-210 here ($350-400). Same goes for 12 W7.

I wish UK and USA can work on mutual delivery servies to bring the prices down.

Rant over!
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      12-02-2012, 01:42 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
You guys are very lucky as everything is damn cheap in USA. And at the top of it, you have many companies in your country and most of the orders are fulfilled by local companies.

I was thinking of going for Fi IB3 12 inch or JL 12 W7.
Both of them has to come from USA.

Fi IB3 is only $200 there and it is 200-210 here ($350-400). Same goes for 12 W7.

I wish UK and USA can work on mutual delivery servies to bring the prices down.

Rant over!
Give it time. When this socialist government machine is done with its master plan, it'll cost the same here as well.
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      12-18-2012, 02:46 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
A drop to 12v doesn't sound too bad. I think you're right at the limit though of what the electrical system can do. Big 3 is not going to do much in our cars. You can try doubling up on the battery ground and see if that helps, but I'm not sure it will. If you want my advice, change to an IB setup through the ski hole and run more SPL with better SQ and less rattle on 1/3 the power.
Kaigoss69: why would the big 3 be ineffective in our cars? is it really not worth doing esp. if you're running 1k-1.5k watts?
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      12-18-2012, 03:04 PM   #12
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Update on this:
12W7 installed as IB with JL 1000/1.

Voltage drops re-appeared especially when bass boost is +12 to +15 dB.

The other thing which comes to my mind is 55 amps battery vs 90 amps battery.

My car is only 320i and comes with 55 amps battery. Whereas 335i cars come with 90 amps batteries.

Would 90 amps battery perform better for sound system compared to 55amps?
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      12-18-2012, 03:07 PM   #13
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Because the OEM wiring between battery, alternator and chassis is already very "beefy" from the factory. I believe 1500w using digital amps if still ok (at least for me) but class a/b it may be too much.
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      12-18-2012, 03:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00
Update on this:
12W7 installed as IB with JL 1000/1.

Voltage drops re-appeared especially when bass boost is +12 to +15 dB.

The other thing which comes to my mind is 55 amps battery vs 90 amps battery.

My car is only 320i and comes with 55 amps battery. Whereas 335i cars come with 90 amps batteries.

Would 90 amps battery perform better for sound system compared to 55amps?
No, unless you like listening with the engine off. When the voltage supply is above 12v the current comes from the alternator. Once it drops into the 11s however you are tapping the battery which is never a good thing. At that point you are drawing more juice than the alternator can supply.

With the BMW's complex charging system it would be unwise in my mind to mess with it by introducing "foreign" components such as additional batteries, batteries or larger alternators. If you do that you're just asking for trouble. My advice would be to go with the most efficient amps and speakers, especially if you want to run above 1000w total.
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      12-18-2012, 03:32 PM   #15
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You need more reserve power or a bigger alt. Unfortunatley the latter is not an option as I have several customers we've had to turn down due to the way in which the charging system works in BMWs.

We should have a AGM battery replacement solution in late Feb 2013 though. We are the UK distributors of XS Power as it happens
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      12-19-2012, 02:14 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
No, unless you like listening with the engine off. When the voltage supply is above 12v the current comes from the alternator. Once it drops into the 11s however you are tapping the battery which is never a good thing. At that point you are drawing more juice than the alternator can supply.

With the BMW's complex charging system it would be unwise in my mind to mess with it by introducing "foreign" components such as additional batteries, batteries or larger alternators. If you do that you're just asking for trouble. My advice would be to go with the most efficient amps and speakers, especially if you want to run above 1000w total.
Thanks.
I am running JL Slash 1000/1 + JL XD 600/6 and if I am not wrong, then both of them are class D amplifiers and very efficient.

so NO to bigger battery as alternator is responsible. I cannot change alternator as suggested by Mr. Singh. So the only option is to have additional battery ....

Where will I have space in my boot?
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      12-19-2012, 02:15 PM   #17
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Quote:
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You need more reserve power or a bigger alt. Unfortunatley the latter is not an option as I have several customers we've had to turn down due to the way in which the charging system works in BMWs.

We should have a AGM battery replacement solution in late Feb 2013 though. We are the UK distributors of XS Power as it happens
Mr Singh
Are these special batteries compared to ordinary batteries?
I am bit worried about the location of other battery...
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