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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Exhaust burrbles/gurggles on our platform compared to N55 w/ PPK



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      12-28-2015, 12:15 PM   #1
J. Dub
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Exhaust burrbles/gurggles on our platform compared to N55 w/ PPK

So this discussion came up here for the N55 guys http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...3#post19125073

And I wanted to know why we, (us N54's) can't get the same noise? What is it about that PPK flash available for them that allows this noise?

Example video below of the exact sound I'm looking for: I do have catless DP's, catless exhaust by AE, and I removed the muffles are run straight pipes. No X cross section no H cross section. Straight dual pipes from the turbo's back. And I still can't get the burrbles/gurggles off throttle like the N55 guys w/ PPK have.


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      12-28-2015, 12:18 PM   #2
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Tell them it must be a by-product of all the extra power potential we have that they don't
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      12-28-2015, 12:24 PM   #3
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It's unburnt fuel. It comes down to the tuning.
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      12-28-2015, 12:46 PM   #4
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well gurgle on normal driving or mid rpm, ie letting off the throttle while in a gear +2500 RPM(manual mode or 6MT) would be more due to fuel cut-off or leaning out the low load higher RPM areas, or possibly tweaking timing a bit.

louder pops and back-fires would be more of un-burn fuel in the exhaust that ignites because of heat in there not from the spark plugs, making it richer at mid to higher loads trying to target between gear changes, possibly running less timing in those cells I would assume.

I haven't messed with it yet but I would like a little more fuel cutoff gurgling, my 1st gear does it mildly, but I would like it in other gears as well.
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      12-28-2015, 12:58 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matthewo View Post
well gurgle on normal driving or mid rpm, ie letting off the throttle while in a gear +2500 RPM(manual mode or 6MT) would be more due to fuel cut-off or leaning out the low load higher RPM areas, or possibly tweaking timing a bit.

louder pops and back-fires would be more of un-burn fuel in the exhaust that ignites because of heat in there not from the spark plugs, making it richer at mid to higher loads trying to target between gear changes, possibly running less timing in those cells I would assume.

I haven't messed with it yet but I would like a little more fuel cutoff gurgling, my 1st gear does it mildly, but I would like it in other gears as well.
Yea well all those noises come down to excess fuel/unburnt fuel. Whether during WOT and shifting or during throttle tip in and out.

I can make my bone stock exhaust gurgle with a slight tip in and out of throttle at low speed.

Different exhausts make this more pronounced too.

I know J Dub is looking for an N55 sound and without a single turbo it won't ever sound like one. There are also slight internal differences of the N55 with cam phasing and stuff that to make it sound the way it does.

However, all that gurgle can be had with some slight changes into tuning.

The tuner in me says it's a waste of fuel and not the correct way of tuning though...
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      12-28-2015, 01:04 PM   #6
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My setups pops much more than the video you have posted. If not for the crappy weather I would've mounted a go pro and did some runs for you. It's insane, I can hear the pops and gurgles in my cabin when I play with the throttle while coasting. In fact, it became a habit to blip the throttle when coasting making my exhaust do it all the time. No tuning needed. Lol
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      12-28-2015, 01:24 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock&Roll View Post
My setups pops much more than the video you have posted. If not for the crappy weather I would've mounted a go pro and did some runs for you. It's insane, I can hear the pops and gurgles in my cabin when I play with the throttle while coasting. In fact, it became a habit to blip the throttle when coasting making my exhaust do it all the time. No tuning needed. Lol
Yes but what year is your car? What mods do you have to the exhaust?
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      12-28-2015, 01:25 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions View Post
Yea well all those noises come down to excess fuel/unburnt fuel. Whether during WOT and shifting or during throttle tip in and out.

I can make my bone stock exhaust gurgle with a slight tip in and out of throttle at low speed.

Different exhausts make this more pronounced too.

I know J Dub is looking for an N55 sound and without a single turbo it won't ever sound like one. There are also slight internal differences of the N55 with cam phasing and stuff that to make it sound the way it does.

However, all that gurgle can be had with some slight changes into tuning.

The tuner in me says it's a waste of fuel and not the correct way of tuning though...
You have hit the nail on the head.
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      12-28-2015, 01:35 PM   #9
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My car also gurgles and has done it since day 1 even with the stock exhaust. The stock exhaust was pretty quiet but now it's pretty good and i can hear it in the cabin especially when the engine is still cold. I'm a modified stock exhaust setup. X pipe, vibrant resonators, and PE mod mufflers
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      12-28-2015, 01:41 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psmitty95 View Post
My car also gurgles and has done it since day 1 even with the stock exhaust. The stock exhaust was pretty quiet but now it's pretty good and i can hear it in the cabin especially when the engine is still cold. I'm a modified stock exhaust setup. X pipe, vibrant resonators, and PE mod mufflers
I keep hearing about these pe mufflers. I'm tempted to remove my ae mufflers and install pe mufflers in it's place.
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      12-28-2015, 01:57 PM   #11
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      12-28-2015, 02:15 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. Dub View Post
Yes but what year is your car? What mods do you have to the exhaust?
Mod list in signature but 2010 E92 n54 with VRSF downpipes and PE modded mufflers.
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      12-28-2015, 02:19 PM   #13
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I just went out and unbolted the 3rd and last section of the AE exhaust I have on my car. So now, I have no mufflers or exhaust tips... I have all sorts of burbble on slight throttle tip in. By that I mean if I put my foot down 1% of the way it burbbles all the way to a stop. I love it.

I also have a ton of drone/rasp. I may cut off these AE mufflers and weld in some PE modded mufflers now.
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      12-28-2015, 09:43 PM   #14
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I love that sound as well. Pre-LCI, 6AT, Jb4, otherwise stock for me + I pinched the exhaust valve tube to keep the flap open.

I've got it down to where I can get it to gurgle on demand while coasting in 1st-3rd when I play with the throttle. It just takes a slight depress as it coasts, and it does it a ton while going downhill.
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      12-28-2015, 10:04 PM   #15
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I think it some how can be achieved by go fully cat-less and as they say make tuning do the job.

Personally, I hate the raspy crack and pop sound. They are obnoxious to me.
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      12-28-2015, 11:05 PM   #16
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N54 and N55 engines naturally create that sound. Some mufflers muffle it more than others. I used to have an AE, it is one of the most tame setups on this platform. Adding downpipes and/or having a PE or muffler delete accentuate the crackle and pops
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      03-10-2016, 10:11 PM   #17
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I love this sound. Problem is my car will not do it unless I give a slight throttle tip in on deceleration.
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      03-11-2016, 12:35 AM   #18
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Same story goes with n55 platform. Backfires from unburnt fuel happen only on deceleration. Here's how n54 sounds with backfires at idle:
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      03-11-2016, 12:48 AM   #19
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PNWN54 my N54 with straight pipe no x or h pipe from turbos all the way back (no cats) and no muffler on cold start will gurggle and backfire upon deceleration for 5 minutes each morning. I love it. THEN, after the engine has been on for over 5 minutes. It's gone. But for those 5 minutes, my n54 sounds like an N55 with PPK. HOWEVER, I can "fake" it by applying 1% throttle on deceleration after car is warm. But I don't like doing it. I'd rather have the car naturally do it.

I wish MHD Tuning / WedgePerformance / BuraQ would come out with something to mimmick N55 w/ ppk on the N54 platform.
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      03-11-2016, 01:07 AM   #20
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I totally get what you're saying, it's the only way we can get those gurgles and pops: 2 mins of cold start and on decelerations by playing with the throttle.

Hopefully MHD will develop a PPK exhaust style option in the future. While at it I'm also requesting a NLS feature(no lift shift), a 2STEP option(two step rev limiter), valet mode for my girlfriend and last but not least map changing on the fly. 😁

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      03-11-2016, 01:33 AM   #21
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Once I'm done with couple of projects I'll look into it. If it turns out good on my end Ill put out some beta for exhaust sound only nothing with power. All goes well I'll hand it over to Martial to implement into an option in MHD
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      03-11-2016, 01:36 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuraQ View Post
Once I'm done with couple of projects I'll look into it. If it turns out good on my end Ill put out some beta for exhaust sound only nothing with power. All goes well I'll hand it over to Martial to implement into an option in MHD
Don't fuckin play with my emotions Dimitri. I saw your video (up a couple of posts) my N54 actually has more gurggle and pops than yours does in that video. However, I'm no where NEAR the level of the N55 guys.
I'd pay for this ppk "feature" on the N54. And I truly don't think it's a single turbo thing. I think it's literally just a waist of fuel. And I'm ok with this.
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