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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > n52 most disapointing engine ever?



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      01-19-2011, 07:46 PM   #1
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n52 most disapointing engine ever?

So I am looking at the new line of engines coming out and looking back at the N52 and the engine it replaced and although technically it has some really cool items, functionally it seems like one of the most disapointing engines bmw ever made.

In reality there was very very little performance improvement over the M54 I6 engine producing 225hp. The torque curve and power is very similar up to 6500 where the m54 stopped and the n52 has the advantage but to be honest how often do people drive at 6500 plus RPMS? not often.

I feel the M54 came out and was a HUGE improvement in power over the outgoing engine. Then the N54/55 engine was a HUGE performance output. Now the turbo 4's are another leap of improvement with them being capable of putting out 300hp likely and they have more stock torque and almost equal hp to the N52.

So while there is no doubt the technology is cool in the N52 I am wondering why it never did make a really functional difference. If you have driven an e46 330i and an N52 330i you realize there is very little difference in power.
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      01-19-2011, 08:14 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by 5erman View Post
So I am looking at the new line of engines coming out and looking back at the N52 and the engine it replaced and although technically it has some really cool items, functionally it seems like one of the most disapointing engines bmw ever made.

In reality there was very very little performance improvement over the M54 I6 engine producing 225hp. The torque curve and power is very similar up to 6500 where the m54 stopped and the n52 has the advantage but to be honest how often do people drive at 6500 plus RPMS? not often.

I feel the M54 came out and was a HUGE improvement in power over the outgoing engine. Then the N54/55 engine was a HUGE performance output. Now the turbo 4's are another leap of improvement with them being capable of putting out 300hp likely and they have more stock torque and almost equal hp to the N52.

So while there is no doubt the technology is cool in the N52 I am wondering why it never did make a really functional difference. If you have driven an e46 330i and an N52 330i you realize there is very little difference in power.
What is the performance improvement from N54 to N55? Some test showed there was even a slight downgrade. I guess you should say the N55 is even more disappointing.

You can't compare N54 to N52, can you?
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      01-19-2011, 08:17 PM   #3
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      01-19-2011, 08:42 PM   #4
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      01-19-2011, 09:12 PM   #5
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Your not comparing apples to apples.
You need to compare M52/54 2.5 to n52 and m54 3.0 to n54 for a true assessment of technological advances.

And what about the N52 that was equipped in the e90 330's and z4 3.0si's that is considerable improvement

Unfortunately every 328 is a detuned n52 variant.
With gears, a tune, and some free flow n52 is considerably more respectable at street speeds.
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      01-19-2011, 10:03 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5erman View Post
So I am looking at the new line of engines coming out and looking back at the N52 and the engine it replaced and although technically it has some really cool items, functionally it seems like one of the most disapointing engines bmw ever made.

In reality there was very very little performance improvement over the M54 I6 engine producing 225hp. The torque curve and power is very similar up to 6500 where the m54 stopped and the n52 has the advantage but to be honest how often do people drive at 6500 plus RPMS? not often.

I feel the M54 came out and was a HUGE improvement in power over the outgoing engine. Then the N54/55 engine was a HUGE performance output. Now the turbo 4's are another leap of improvement with them being capable of putting out 300hp likely and they have more stock torque and almost equal hp to the N52.

So while there is no doubt the technology is cool in the N52 I am wondering why it never did make a really functional difference. If you have driven an e46 330i and an N52 330i you realize there is very little difference in power.
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      01-19-2011, 11:27 PM   #7
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the E46 330 doesn't make nearly as much low end torque as the E90 330. The E90 330 is noticeably more powerful, My friend has a '04 330i ZHP 6mt, and said the E90 330i he drove was noticeably faster.

Actually, the E90 328i is on par, if not a tad better than the E46 330i, performance-wise. So the E90 base car is competes with the top of the line (non-M) E46.
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      01-19-2011, 11:35 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike-y View Post
the E46 330 doesn't make nearly as much low end torque as the E90 330. The E90 330 is noticeably more powerful, My friend has a '04 330i ZHP 6mt, and said the E90 330i he drove was noticeably faster.

Actually, the E90 328i is on par, if not a tad better than the E46 330i, performance-wise. So the E90 base car is competes with the top of the line (non-M) E46.
Someone give this man a beer!
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      01-19-2011, 11:40 PM   #9
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      01-20-2011, 11:45 AM   #10
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Dude for what it costs, how reliable it is, and where it stands in the product lineup, I am plenty happy with my n52-powered e92.

"most disappointing engine ever" ??

get stuffed.
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      01-20-2011, 11:53 AM   #11
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      01-20-2011, 12:41 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koreez88 View Post
+2

5erman clearly just enjoys trolling the forums to piss everyone off

And for the e46 330i to e90 330i difference, you are very wrong,
I pull ~2 cars on average every time on e46 330i's
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      01-20-2011, 03:27 PM   #13
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Wow a brilliant guy who said to compare the M54 NA 3.0 with a TT n54 engine. Nothing is similar except the numbers. A true comparison is teh N52 3 litre that replaced the M54 3 litre-both NA engines. I am not saying any of the engines discussed are on an "absolute" value better or worse. I am speaking relative to what it replaces.

The N55 is not a huge improvement but it was not a replacement engine, rather just increment change like the N51 is of the N52. They are still in the same generation and thus the same for comparison.

And you can think the M54 e46 had "lot less torque" but look at the numbers and dyno (google it) the fact is the torque is almost no different except for occuring 1k earlier which in reality doesnt matter since you dont spend any time at under 2k rpms.

I am tlaking about the 255hp version too-not the detuned one. Disapointment to say the least
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      01-20-2011, 03:49 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5erman View Post
Wow a brilliant guy who said to compare the M54 NA 3.0 with a TT n54 engine. Nothing is similar except the numbers. A true comparison is teh N52 3 litre that replaced the M54 3 litre-both NA engines. I am not saying any of the engines discussed are on an "absolute" value better or worse. I am speaking relative to what it replaces.

The N55 is not a huge improvement but it was not a replacement engine, rather just increment change like the N51 is of the N52. They are still in the same generation and thus the same for comparison.

And you can think the M54 e46 had "lot less torque" but look at the numbers and dyno (google it) the fact is the torque is almost no different except for occuring 1k earlier which in reality doesnt matter since you dont spend any time at under 2k rpms.

I am tlaking about the 255hp version too-not the detuned one. Disapointment to say the least
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Only disappointment is me not being able to tune my N52 to the ~273 hp our UK brethren output...
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      01-20-2011, 04:03 PM   #15
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You can't buy a NA 3.0L street car motor for a low price and expect it to be very powerful....

Even the top-of-the-line 6 cylinder NA motors, S65, VQ37, VR6, etc are not that powerful. The N52 wasn't even designed to be a top-of-the-line NA performance motor.
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      01-20-2011, 04:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yakev724 View Post
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Only disappointment is me not being able to tune my N52 to the ~273 hp our UK brethren output...
.. gotta love their 12:1 compression vis our 10.7:1
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      01-20-2011, 04:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaLakers91tc View Post
+2

5erman clearly just enjoys trolling the forums to piss everyone off

And for the e46 330i to e90 330i difference, you are very wrong,
I pull ~2 cars on average every time on e46 330i's
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      01-20-2011, 04:27 PM   #18
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.. gotta love their 12:1 compression vis our 10.7:1
....until you try to put some boost through it.....
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      01-20-2011, 04:58 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5erman View Post
And you can think the M54 e46 had "lot less torque" but look at the numbers and dyno

I am tlaking about the 255hp version too-not the detuned one. Disapointment to say the least
The only disappointment is how lame your trolling is. But hey, whatever makes you feel good about yourself.

Anyway, I've looked at the dynos, the E46 M54 barely gets to 200 lb/ft stock, and falls off quickly after it's peak @ 3500 rpm. And modded M54's usually made less power/torque than a stock N52 330:


M54 Dynos

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=86402

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/html...BD_E46_325_330



The N52 routinley shows over 200ft lbs through most of it's rpm range, starting as low as 2000rpm. I spend more than 90% of my time below 3000rpm on my commute to/from work, so having a lower torque peak at 2700rpm is a lot better than 3500 rpm.

N52 dynos









So a much better torque curve, in an engine that makes more power, is more fuel efficient, and gets better mileage than the M54. Yeah, huge disappointment.
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      01-20-2011, 07:40 PM   #20
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      01-20-2011, 07:48 PM   #21
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Lol is that the Fred Durst version?
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      01-20-2011, 08:02 PM   #22
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Lol is that the Fred Durst version?
yes sir! hahaha
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