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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > RB vs. Stock Turbo Dyno



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      10-11-2012, 09:03 AM   #1
Mike@N54Tuning.com
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RB vs. Stock Turbo Dyno

Here is an interesting dyno comparing maxed out OEM turbos to fairly aggressively tuned but not quite maxed out RB turbos. Huge top end gains coupled with lightning fast spool makes for a very fun street car.

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      10-11-2012, 09:05 AM   #2
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Makes me want to turn up my boost.
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      10-11-2012, 09:35 AM   #3
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It looks like the biggest diffrence is when the power hits and ends. Overall, the peak power doesn't appear to be that much of an improvement for the cost of the RB's. Still impressive numbers though!


I'd like to see how a single turbo compares to stock with the G5 board.
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      10-11-2012, 09:44 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n54door View Post
It looks like the biggest diffrence is when the power hits and ends. Overall, the peak power doesn't appear to be that much of an improvement for the cost of the RB's. Still impressive numbers though!
So you mean 70whp for $3000 is not that much of an improvement ? Like 60% more power than what a FBO car can achieve over stock ?

Ah, you are kidding, I get it now.
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      10-11-2012, 10:24 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onebadmofo View Post
Makes me want to turn up my boost.
Why not do it then?
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      10-11-2012, 10:27 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n54door View Post
It looks like the biggest diffrence is when the power hits and ends. Overall, the peak power doesn't appear to be that much of an improvement for the cost of the RB's. Still impressive numbers though!


I'd like to see how a single turbo compares to stock with the G5 board.
One thing Mike should have mentioned is that TErry's car is automatic and and is slipping.

so one 60-70whp over maxed out stock turbos is a lot,but there is a lot more to be had under the curve because Terry doesn't want to shred his transmission.
second, if he had turned up his boost down low, he probably needs a 4 bar sensor for more boost.

For 3000$, this is an amazing plug and play upgrade.
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      10-11-2012, 10:33 AM   #7
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I just love my RBs, they really are worth every penny. Whether I run them on the JB4 or the Cobb, they just pack so much more punch/power. And the car still drives stock-like. The soundtrack is also much, much better, no more rattle but a subtle whistle in stead
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      10-11-2012, 12:16 PM   #8
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Couple of questions Mike...What was the max psi on the stock turbos vs RB?
Was meth used and what octane?
Overall fantastic gains (70+whp) over stock hairdryers is definitely an improvement but I need to consider Mikes answers before making this assumption.
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      10-11-2012, 12:52 PM   #9
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Couple of questions Mike...What was the max psi on the stock turbos vs RB?
Was meth used and what octane?
Overall fantastic gains (70+whp) over stock hairdryers is definitely an improvement but I need to consider Mikes answers before making this assumption.
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      10-11-2012, 12:56 PM   #10
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Damn, with OEM catback!!! I feel like with a straight pipe setup the power will hold a little bit better after 6k? If I could 500whp all the way through 7k with the vargas that would be literally perfect.

Sorry about the thread jack but that is a very pretty dyno. Just needs to hold that power instead of trailing off!!! Gorgeous!!!
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      10-11-2012, 01:02 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cstavaru View Post
So you mean 70whp for $3000 is not that much of an improvement ? Like 60% more power than what a FBO car can achieve over stock ?

Ah, you are kidding, I get it now.
its only 3k for the turbos installed? nah.. lets call it a 5k upgrade, and you have to give them your stock turbos.

For that amount of money, might as well do a single turbo and get more that double the gains you would get with RBs, and keep the stock turbos to sell or put back to stock.

5k for turbo upgrade that nets 70hp tops is a poor investment, period. just my opinion.

Edit: Double-check your math man, 60% over FBO? That would make it +260hp on top of 435hp (peak HP on FBO in dyno above). I think you mean 15% more than FBO.

Last edited by n54door; 10-11-2012 at 01:14 PM.
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      10-11-2012, 01:15 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n54door View Post
its only 3k for the turbos installed? nah.. lets call it a 5k upgrade, and you have to give them your stock turbos.

For that amount of money, might as well do a single turbo and get more that double the gains you would get with RBs, and keep the stock turbos to sell or put back to stock.

5k for turbo upgrade that nets 70hp tops is a poor investment, period. just my opinion.
There are dozens of twin vs single debates already, let's just leave it alone. Different strokes for different folks.
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      10-11-2012, 01:19 PM   #13
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$42 per whp seems good to me.
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      10-11-2012, 01:26 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turb0mike View Post
Damn, with OEM catback!!! I feel like with a straight pipe setup the power will hold a little bit better after 6k? If I could 500whp all the way through 7k with the vargas that would be literally perfect.

Sorry about the thread jack but that is a very pretty dyno. Just needs to hold that power instead of trailing off!!! Gorgeous!!!
The 135i catback is a bit more restrictive than a 335i catback in theory so he may be leaving a few HP on the table. Who knows. But I would not presume Vargas turbos will even perform in this range of power. You'll have to dyno test them to see! They may be much worse or may be the same.

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      10-11-2012, 01:26 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cstavaru
Quote:
Originally Posted by n54door View Post
It looks like the biggest diffrence is when the power hits and ends. Overall, the peak power doesn't appear to be that much of an improvement for the cost of the RB's. Still impressive numbers though!
So you mean 70whp for $3000 is not that much of an improvement ? Like 60% more power than what a FBO car can achieve over stock ?

Ah, you are kidding, I get it now.
I was gonna say the exact same thing...lol
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      10-11-2012, 01:29 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n54door View Post
its only 3k for the turbos installed? nah.. lets call it a 5k upgrade, and you have to give them your stock turbos.

For that amount of money, might as well do a single turbo and get more that double the gains you would get with RBs, and keep the stock turbos to sell or put back to stock.

5k for turbo upgrade that nets 70hp tops is a poor investment, period. just my opinion.

Edit: Double-check your math man, 60% over FBO? That would make it +260hp on top of 435hp (peak HP on FBO in dyno above). I think you mean 15% more than FBO.
Not to start a pissing match but If the RBs cost 5k installed then the single is closer to 10k. And while you make more power > 5000rpm you make a lot less < 4000rpm. For daily driving that is a HUGE trade off. Not saying it's the end of the world for someone wanting to do 60-130 runs all the time, etc, but it must be considered. Not to mention the RBs look 100% stock, are smoggable, etc. It all depends on your needs.

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      10-11-2012, 01:31 PM   #17
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Mike do you know if anyone exports the RBs to the UK?
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      10-11-2012, 01:41 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com View Post
The 135i catback is a bit more restrictive than a 335i catback in theory so he may be leaving a few HP on the table. Who knows. But I would not presume Vargas turbos will even perform in this range of power. You'll have to dyno test them to see! They may be much worse or may be the same.

Mike
Mike, why you presume Vargas stage 2s would not perform similarly? TD04-15T wheels are TD04-15T wheels and the upgraded components are the same. Let's leave Rob's "opinions" out of this.
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      10-11-2012, 01:47 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com View Post
Not to start a pissing match but If the RBs cost 5k installed then the single is closer to 10k. And while you make more power > 5000rpm you make a lot less < 4000rpm. For daily driving that is a HUGE trade off. Not saying it's the end of the world for someone wanting to do 60-130 runs all the time, etc, but it must be considered. Not to mention the RBs look 100% stock, are smoggable, etc. It all depends on your needs.

Mike
Have you driven a single turbo n54? If not, perhaps you should talk to those who have and they can tell you how much of a trade off it is in the real world. Just saying....
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      10-11-2012, 01:57 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zztwinturbozz View Post
I was gonna say the exact same thing...lol
Again, check the math guys.. the quote of 60% gains over FBO is not accurate at all.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com View Post
Not to start a pissing match but If the RBs cost 5k installed then the single is closer to 10k. And while you make more power > 5000rpm you make a lot less < 4000rpm. For daily driving that is a HUGE trade off. Not saying it's the end of the world for someone wanting to do 60-130 runs all the time, etc, but it must be considered. Not to mention the RBs look 100% stock, are smoggable, etc. It all depends on your needs.

Mike
Good points, I would like to see some real world comparisons. Just for the fans, not to pick sides.

I'm not at all sold on the single just yet. For the $ and current options, and if you must upgrade the turbos right now, RB's seem to be the better deal until the singles become more common than a few cases. I do believe this will change very soon.

And, while RB's are a good option because of limited competition, I still would not to say I feel the ROI is a good deal. I have also been called cheap before... hehe.

Just spectating and playing devils advocate, that's all! Keep up the good work, I'm a HUGE fan believe it or not.
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      10-11-2012, 01:59 PM   #21
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Quote:
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RB's seem to be the better deal until the singles become more common than a few cases.
There are more than a few cases on the road already, just a quick point.
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      10-11-2012, 02:02 PM   #22
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Mike, why you presume Vargas stage 2s would not perform similarly? TD04-15T wheels are TD04-15T wheels and the upgraded components are the same. Let's leave Rob's "opinions" out of this.
I'm looking forward to seeing data on them but why would anyone assume a theoretical product will perform as well as something that has put out similar results for 10s or maybe even a hundred cars? Sounds like you are going for the Vargas turbos? If so do some dyno and durability testing and report back!

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