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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Turbo Spool Sound III- Attack of the boost target problems



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      10-26-2012, 05:54 PM   #1
KaiserN54
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Exclamation Can some one please look at these logs? Want to be sure I'm not missing something.

data_file1 - Copy.txt



Okay, so I've made a few threads complaining of turbo whine. I was also having some intermittent issues with performance, that most attributed to fueling issues. So I contacted Shiv about that (since I am running flex-fuel). He had me reset adaptations and advised me to stay on map 3 no matter what. Things seemed to improve somewhat, but the car still basically falls flat every once in a while. Basically, I shift into a given gear and give it gas...and nothing happens. During the laggy part, I can
hear what sounds like building air pressure and a very faint squeak, Then boom, the power comes on, but it is grainy at that point.

I even went as far as re-installing the firmware and flex-fuel map. Same problems.

I did some post re-install/ re-adaptation logs and sent them to Shiv. His reply:

Yes, something is going on with boost. Either you have a leak or one of your wastegates is sticking open causing slow/erratic boost build up. It's fairly obvious when you compare boost control setpoint (target) to actual boost. One thing you can try is to adjust your wastegate position with the procede user adjustable menu. If it's a binding wg, this may or may not work but it's worth a try. What is it set to now?



Of course, it may be a bad turbo (or a leak) as they would both cause similar sounding noises under load.


Well, the turbos have about 3000 miles on them, and I haven't played with the WG settings. So I don't think thats it.

I also don't think its a boost leak because (1) No codes to that effect and (2) I had a garage check for leaks and they didn't find anything.

In addition to new turbos, the car also has new boost solenoids, new injectors, and a new lpfp. So unless it truly is an errant WG, I probably need new turbos. Here is a recent log I did demonstrating the issue:


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Last edited by KaiserN54; 11-03-2012 at 10:39 PM.
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      10-26-2012, 06:13 PM   #2
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Subscribed to this yet again. Are you fully catless/open intake? Are those videos when your motor is cold?
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      10-26-2012, 06:40 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E90Company View Post
Subscribed to this yet again. Are you fully catless/open intake? Are those videos when your motor is cold?
Yes, fully catless, open intake. The car was cold, BUT it doesn't sound any better/different when warm.
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      10-26-2012, 06:57 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomos319 View Post
Yes, fully catless, open intake. The car was cold, BUT it doesn't sound any better/different when warm.
Are you using BMW oil? Did they do a change when you got new turbos? Did you tune it with all 4 cats in place, or did you have a catless exhaust and then increase the boost? Sorry for the amount of questions, i'm just trying to see what factors may be influencing the noise.
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      10-26-2012, 07:07 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E90Company View Post
Are you using BMW oil? Did they do a change when you got new turbos? Did you tune it with all 4 cats in place, or did you have a catless exhaust and then increase the boost? Sorry for the amount of questions, i'm just trying to see what factors may be influencing the noise.
I am using BMW oil. No they did not change the oil.

About 500 miles into the new turbos, my bolt-ons went back on. They sounded normal until about 1500 miles ago, when the usual spool sound changed to a whine.
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      10-26-2012, 07:35 PM   #6
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Yes...that's beginning to sound outside of what I would consider normal.

Does sound like one or both of the turbos are distressed and perhaps rubbing on the housing.

Having a laggy boost response would tend to reinforce that.

That sounds more like a screech than a siren sound to me.
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      10-26-2012, 09:42 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomos319 View Post
I am using BMW oil. No they did not change the oil.

About 500 miles into the new turbos, my bolt-ons went back on. They sounded normal until about 1500 miles ago, when the usual spool sound changed to a whine.
I'll bet you it was probably because they didn't change the oil. You should always change oil/flush coolant when you change turbo's (AFAIK)
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      10-26-2012, 10:08 PM   #8
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Oh, and that bang at the end of video 26: backfire out of the exhaust.
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      10-26-2012, 11:20 PM   #9
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All your threads are pointless. The dealer just installed your new turbos and all your problems have been since.
Why wont you just give them the car since they caused it -instead of pissing in the wind?

Your bolt ons should be irrelevant to the dealer ,only the tune can be cause for alarm so just remove that if your worried.

And oil will not make your turbos squeal - unless you have none at all
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      10-26-2012, 11:23 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gugs View Post
All your threads are pointless. The dealer just installed your new turbos and all your problems have been since.
Why wont you just give them the car since they caused it -instead of pissing in the wind?

Your bolt ons should be irrelevant to the dealer ,only the tune can be cause for alarm so just remove that if your worried.
And oil will not make your turbos squeal - unless you have none at all
The troll has made his remark.
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      10-26-2012, 11:24 PM   #11
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Are you upset at the truth?
Or do we need 5 more threads about a whining noise?
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      10-26-2012, 11:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gugs View Post
All your threads are pointless. The dealer just installed your new turbos and all your problems have been since.
Why wont you just give them the car since they caused it -instead of pissing in the wind?

Your bolt ons should be irrelevant to the dealer ,only the tune can be cause for alarm so just remove that if your worried.

And oil will not make your turbos squeal - unless you have none at all
Tell you what, troll, I will take your advise and when the dealer blames the failure on my downpipes, shall I send you the bill? Weren't the guy who yawned at was surely a boost leak early this week? You proved your level of expertise right there.

I will be giving them the car, but not until demodded. And since I have a DME flash that only runs 1-2 lbs of boost without the procede installed, it's going to be a bit more involved than just "removing the tune." Forgive me for hoping for insight from others before wasting my time and money.
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      10-26-2012, 11:50 PM   #13
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Failure of what due to downpipes?
You are so uneducated when it comes to this car its no wonder you created so many threads.

Take the car to the dealer since you cant diagnose the problem

Lol @ boost leak. Sorry I cant diagnose your problem solely based on your ignorant posts that dont even pertain to the issue.


Btw -please explain how you remove two turbos that are oil and water cooled without losing any fluid?

Lol so You're saying they didnt even add oil when they swapped the turbos?

Maybe you need to step back and think about not going back to that dealer.
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      10-27-2012, 12:40 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gugs View Post
Failure of what due to downpipes?
You are so uneducated when it comes to this car its no wonder you created so many threads.

Take the car to the dealer since you cant diagnose the problem

Lol @ boost leak. Sorry I cant diagnose your problem solely based on your ignorant posts that dont even pertain to the issue.


Btw -please explain how you remove two turbos that are oil and water cooled without losing any fluid?

Lol so You're saying they didnt even add oil when they swapped the turbos?

Maybe you need to step back and think about not going back to that dealer.
Yes, thats right- they did not add any oil after changing the turbos. I know because I asked, and because my oil fullness indicator was down maybe a quart after the change. Does that fact even matter? I don't know, but if you do, you come across a lot less like an asshole by simply saying one way or the other versus lecturing me on how little you think I know.

And of course, I know the DP's didn't cause the failure. And BMW is SO eager to replace turbos that no one with bolt ons, chip or no chip, has EVER been given trouble by a dealer, right?

And what "ignorant post" are you refering to? From day one i suspected a turbo failure, my post said no less.

I'm sorry I lack the formal N54 education you seem so concerned about. I guess my wife, newborn, full time job in large PI firm, and my last year of Law School keep me too busy to be as cool and informed as you seem to be. Congratulations on your BMW forum superiority.

I think the real question is, why do you care? I have right to be kept up late at night by my problems. Whats your excuse? If my post annoy you, there are plenty of other things to read about here, such as Taiwanese new turbo design! and whether your E90 can get you pussy.
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      10-27-2012, 02:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomos319 View Post
Yes, thats right- they did not add any oil after changing the turbos. I know because I asked, and because my oil fullness indicator was down maybe a quart after the change. Does that fact even matter? I don't know, but if you do, you come across a lot less like an asshole by simply saying one way or the other versus lecturing me on how little you think I know.

And of course, I know the DP's didn't cause the failure. And BMW is SO eager to replace turbos that no one with bolt ons, chip or no chip, has EVER been given trouble by a dealer, right?

And what "ignorant post" are you refering to? From day one i suspected a turbo failure, my post said no less.

I'm sorry I lack the formal N54 education you seem so concerned about. I guess my wife, newborn, full time job in large PI firm, and my last year of Law School keep me too busy to be as cool and informed as you seem to be. Congratulations on your BMW forum superiority.

I think the real question is, why do you care? I have right to be kept up late at night by my problems. Whats your excuse? If my post annoy you, there are plenty of other things to read about here, such as Taiwanese new turbo design! and whether your E90 can get you pussy.
I feel like I'm in the misc forums on bodybuilding.com...damn this post turned Me on LMAO haha. However... +1 to taking back to dealer after demodded. Seems like you've gotten feedback from forum members, which have led you to that conclusion. Keep us updated.
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      10-27-2012, 09:24 AM   #16
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What is your WG setting at? The last couple times I've been installing/reinstalling the 9-10 maps, I noticed something different with my exhaust note, noticed that my exhaust was smoking A LOT, and noticed that under cruise my boost would fluctuate in a waveform. Then I looked at the default WG position and for some reason it was at 50%(I thought the maps defaulted at 90%, but apparently not). Turned the WG position back to 90% and all 3 problems were fixed.
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      10-27-2012, 09:28 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomos319 View Post
I'm sorry I lack the formal N54 education you seem so concerned about. I guess my wife, newborn, full time job in large PI firm, and my last year of Law School keep me too busy to be as cool and informed as you seem to be. Congratulations on your BMW forum superiority.
Get your priorities straight. Racecar > all the above.
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      10-27-2012, 11:30 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgiaTech335coupe
What is your WG setting at? The last couple times I've been installing/reinstalling the 9-10 maps, I noticed something different with my exhaust note, noticed that my exhaust was smoking A LOT, and noticed that under cruise my boost would fluctuate in a waveform. Then I looked at the default WG position and for some reason it was at 50%(I thought the maps defaulted at 90%, but apparently not). Turned the WG position back to 90% and all 3 problems were fixed.
Have you gotten any coolant sensor temp gradient codes on the 9-10 maps? If I have my wg set to 90% (which I want instead of rattly 50%) I throw the temp gradient with the coolant sensor and my car loses basically all power without limping, the fans kick on loud, and my oil temps begin to plummet.
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      10-27-2012, 05:49 PM   #19
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Did you install BMS DCIs after getting your turbo replaced? I had that exact same sound when I didn't tighten the clamp enough from the intake tubes to the DCI tubes. Couple turns and the noise went away.

Not sure about the boost target issues.
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      10-28-2012, 11:25 AM   #20
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Those turbos seem to be making more of a whining noise; doesn't sound normal to me. Did they give you new turbos or refurbished ones?
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      10-28-2012, 12:12 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzu View Post
Did you install BMS DCIs after getting your turbo replaced? I had that exact same sound when I didn't tighten the clamp enough from the intake tubes to the DCI tubes. Couple turns and the noise went away.

Not sure about the boost target issues.
Yes, I double checked everything.
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      10-28-2012, 12:15 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfrazie1 View Post
Those turbos seem to be making more of a whining noise; doesn't sound normal to me. Did they give you new turbos or refurbished ones?


As far as I know, they are new. Car is at my mechanic now, first he will pull the DP's, and check the turbos visually to the extent that he can. He will also visually check for WG binding. Otherwise, everything is coming off so I can go back to the dealer and get this looked at.
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