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      11-12-2012, 08:37 AM   #1
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Insane amounts of brake squeal

Hi guys.. I have insane amounts of brake squeal (front) at low speeds and only when the brakes are up to temperature...very embarrassing to say the least. when they are cold they are fine... only starting squealing 10-15mins into journey at traffic lights stops etc..

I got e92 2007 320i, I changed all four corners with pagid Ė pads , disk and sensors, I did the work myself done this many of times.... applied liberal amounts brake paste (pagid) to rear side of the brake pads and any areas where the pads made contact with metal. I have followed the bedding in process with new brakes... yet still squeals at low speeds. I have disassembled brakes and used brake cleaner on the pads and disks... yet no change.... The pads came already chamfered, that eliminates one cure of brake squeal... I have slightly noticed, reversing braking tends to quieten down the squeal some what... which leads me to believe that itís something to do with brake dust... correct me if am wrong.

Am now thinking of the following....

a. Replace brake sensor, as many people are pointing at the sensors fouling the disks..... not really convinced at this solution
b. Take pads out and sand the friction surface lightly on a level surface, clean, re-grease and put everything back and see (hear) what happens.
c. Cough up £130 for new pads OEM front pads from the stealers.

Do any of you guys have any suggestions or ideas????

Thanks in advance.
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      11-12-2012, 08:51 AM   #2
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If it was me, I'd be going with Option C; but try the Textar pads which is what I installed.

Everything else that I was going to suggest sounds like its already been done.
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      11-12-2012, 09:27 AM   #3
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thanks, yeh was thinking the same to be honest, got the pads from europarts. Just had a chat with a rep who said I could go to my local store and get them replaced or refunded... thinking I may go for textar ones and hope for the best!
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      11-12-2012, 09:49 AM   #4
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Pagid are OEM, so option C would be a waste of cash. My vote goes on the sensors. They should be replaced when pads are changed in any case.
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      11-12-2012, 09:58 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil325i View Post
Pagid are OEM, so option C would be a waste of cash. My vote goes on the sensors. They should be replaced when pads are changed in any case.
Rear and front were both swapped out for new ones, when the pads and disks were changed.... however I guess no harm in trying, as itís a inexpensive part.

I still for the life of me cannot see how the sensor could cause sooo much squealing??
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      11-12-2012, 10:08 AM   #6
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Get some new anti-squeal springs, they're only a few quid.
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      11-12-2012, 10:16 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xenon View Post
Get some new anti-squeal springs, they're only a few quid.
Ian,

By anti-squeal springs, do you mean the anti rattle clips that keeps the calliper retained back? i.e the clip that tends to shoots off when removing brake pads??? If so I already did buy them, but no luck....
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      11-12-2012, 10:18 AM   #8
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Yes that's what I meant.
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      11-12-2012, 11:31 AM   #9
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Squealing at low speed sounds like they're not bedded in fully.

Get them hot and then do a few fast hard retardations, i.e. 70-20, brake smooth and firm as hard as you can without activating ABS.

3 or 4 of those should help no end.

Try and see.
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      11-12-2012, 11:42 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paz View Post
Rear and front were both swapped out for new ones, when the pads and disks were changed.... however I guess no harm in trying, as itís a inexpensive part.

I still for the life of me cannot see how the sensor could cause sooo much squealing??
I also had 'insane' squeaking, admittedly from the rear. Changed the sensor, which cured it...for a short time. In the end I took the sensor out, sanded the end that rubs on the disc and coated the rest of the sensor finger with copper grease. Peace restored...
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      11-12-2012, 12:11 PM   #11
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Doughboy Ė I will give it go, when the roads are quite and dry.... as you would expect its bucketing down here in Cardiff.

Phil325i Ė My brake pads are new only have 350 miles on them. Pads are a inch think so I really canít see the sensors fouling on the disks... still going to have a go replacing it.

Getting fed up, with passengers/fellow drivers comments and reactions when am coming to a stop at lights etc.....at one point someone ran out there house with their rubbish expecting a waste disposal lorry.... good times...
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      11-12-2012, 07:50 PM   #12
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I have exactly the same issue as the OP after replacing the original pads, disks and sensors with Pagid (which, as others have said, are also OEM).

I believe Doughboys suggestion is the correct one and that the squealing is caused by a build up of dust on the pads.

I actually removed the front pads/calipers and gave them another thoroughly good clean and this cured the problem for a while. Most of my driving is motorway, I got over 100k from the first set of pads/disks so I think dust build up on the pads is likely to be an ongoing problem. I did not have this problem with the Textar pads fitted originally - just a lot of difficult to shift black brake dust embedded in the alloys. This doesn't happen with the Pagids.
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      11-13-2012, 05:53 AM   #13
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Im interested in this as my M3 squeals a bit after about 10 mins of driving, and this is with moderate driving.
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      11-13-2012, 06:31 AM   #14
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I've had this with Pagid pads and discs on the front of my e90 330i and I've solved it but I'm not 100% sure how, but here goes.

I've done many many disc and pads changes before but I took them apart again and lots of copper grease on EVERYTHING, back of the pads, where the pads touch the carriers, the face of the piston, where the carriers touch the pads, on the touch points of the anti rattle shims, on the top of the pad backing plate. I also put red grease on the slider bolts too. I tried chamfering the top of the pads too. This fixed it for a bit but it did start to return... but a lot better than before

Then I had a blast and got the pads really hot and the noise has disappeared permanently now...

I've read there's a fix where you lube up part of the rear handbrake mechanism that gets a bit rusty / dry but my noise was from the front so I can't comment further. Hope this helps a bit!
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      11-13-2012, 07:00 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paz View Post
Doughboy – I will give it go, when the roads are quite and dry.... as you would expect its bucketing down here in Cardiff.
I'm not suggesting dangerous braking, just positive braking at safe / legal speeds, i.e. 70-20 off an Mway or D/C slip road towards a roundabout. Are you on slicks or soemthing?

What if you had to do an emergency stop in the rain? would you mow down the pedestrians and then tell the officer you didn't want to brake too hard?

Joking aside, if you're taking it even easier due to bad weather, then this could be the reason for not bedding in for sure.


Squealing is where the pad is momentarily grabbing and then losing grip on the disc, but very quickly. If you can imagine grip/slip/grip/slip/grip/slip so fast that it makes a high pitched squeal, about 10khz maybe? ie. 10 thousand time a second.

Strangely enough pads don't grip steel discs very well, you need pad material to transfer onto the disc, then the pads grip the pad material very nicely without squealing.

The only way to do this is heat and pressure, rain or shine you need to do it.
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Last edited by doughboy; 11-13-2012 at 07:06 AM.
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      11-13-2012, 07:48 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
I'm not suggesting dangerous braking, just positive braking at safe / legal speeds, i.e. 70-20 off an Mway or D/C slip road towards a roundabout. Are you on slicks or soemthing?

What if you had to do an emergency stop in the rain? would you mow down the pedestrians and then tell the officer you didn't want to brake too hard?

Joking aside, if you're taking it even easier due to bad weather, then this could be the reason for not bedding in for sure.


Squealing is where the pad is momentarily grabbing and then losing grip on the disc, but very quickly. If you can imagine grip/slip/grip/slip/grip/slip so fast that it makes a high pitched squeal, about 10khz maybe? ie. 10 thousand time a second.

Strangely enough pads don't grip steel discs very well, you need pad material to transfer onto the disc, then the pads grip the pad material very nicely without squealing.

The only way to do this is heat and pressure, rain or shine you need to do it.
Well I tend you use the motorway only 4 miles of it... to and from work, however traffic is very heavy.. no slicks, just new falkens all four corners.
But point taken, will give it blast tonight and report back.
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      11-15-2012, 10:21 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
Squealing at low speed sounds like they're not bedded in fully.

Get them hot and then do a few fast hard retardations, i.e. 70-20, brake smooth and firm as hard as you can without activating ABS.

3 or 4 of those should help no end.

Try and see.
You sir are a gentleman and a scholar!!

granted it took a few goes, but the squealing seems to have gone - for now anyway. At least I don't have to rip apart the brake system again.

I figured I was being way too easy on the brakes because I have always been told to take it easy with new brakes. Doughboy was spot on with his suggestion. I used firm but smooth braking action from 70mph down to 20mph 4 times.

Thank you all for your suggestion!
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      11-17-2012, 02:58 AM   #18
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What would be an easy way of heating up the brakes first?:

-Make your way down an empty multi-story car park at speed.
-Hold the brakes lightly or dab it as you go down a longish hill.
-just keep doing the 70-20mph thing.
-drive normally whilst lightly touching the brakes for a mile or too.
Trying to plan a couple places that I know of where I can try this apparent fix out at night.
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      11-17-2012, 05:40 AM   #19
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You need firm braking to force all of the pad onto the disc and to heat it up evenly.

Light braking is no good as you get hot spots and overheating little patches of the pads which slows bedding in and leads to squealing.

Worst is prolonged light braking, I.e. from speed off away slip.
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      11-18-2012, 10:18 PM   #20
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I'm having exactly the same issue also. Should have stuck with BMW parts. ECP is cheap but terrible.
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      11-19-2012, 11:02 AM   #21
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I'm having exactly the same issue also. Should have stuck with BMW parts. ECP is cheap but terrible.
I agree last time I use them. Although am sure the same could easily happen to parts from BMW too. why don't you give what doughboy recommend a go? worked great for me.
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      11-19-2012, 11:37 AM   #22
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I just fitted new discs and pads to my car and had what could be described as very serious squeal / scraping sound. Turns out as the discs were new the discs stored up a lot more latent heat, that radiating heat actually warmed the sh1t plate that protects the discs from all sorts of crap , warping it slightly which made it contact the disc itself , slightly bending the plate back away from the disc solved my problem
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