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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > AFE header dyno N51



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      10-23-2015, 02:03 PM   #1
jc5988
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AFE header dyno N51

here is the dyno for my afe header, real nice gain just like AFE advertised with no SES what so ever.

Before: PI + Ess Tune
After: Above + PI + PE + AFE Header

DISA checked, works perfect.




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Last edited by jc5988; 10-26-2015 at 02:33 PM.
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      10-23-2015, 03:23 PM   #2
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If you got a tune, AA should be able to smooth the DISA transitions. I cant imagine wanting to get rid of all that low end torque. Wanna trade for my wife's single stage? :-P
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      10-23-2015, 03:31 PM   #3
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You need a retune, and those are good number for a N51. Kgolf31 was pretty much the same.
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      10-23-2015, 03:45 PM   #4
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Just some off hand thinking here:
1. You have an N51
2. You reinstalled your secondaries I assume?
3. You're not tuned for headers - this is a big one


Before you fiddle with the manifold and do something costly and worse, start with the retune, and double check your DISA valves. I think the problem here is your comparing an N51 powercurve with a N52.
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      10-23-2015, 03:59 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Just some off hand thinking here:
1. You have an N51
2. You reinstalled your secondaries I assume?
3. You're not tuned for headers - this is a big one


Before you fiddle with the manifold and do something costly and worse, start with the retune, and double check your DISA valves. I think the problem here is your comparing an N51 powercurve with a N52.
yea N51, header dyno was with secondary back on until i can get some solution on the rasp.

if you check Kgolf31's header dyno, the 2nd stage is where it made the most TQ, which is similar to my dyno without the header. so thats why i think that could be disa or maybe the tune.

however, ESS insist as long as no SES light, no further tune is needed...

well i guess i need to crack the disa open to really find out whats going on first..


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      10-23-2015, 04:02 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jc5988
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Just some off hand thinking here:
1. You have an N51
2. You reinstalled your secondaries I assume?
3. You're not tuned for headers - this is a big one


Before you fiddle with the manifold and do something costly and worse, start with the retune, and double check your DISA valves. I think the problem here is your comparing an N51 powercurve with a N52.
yea N51, header dyno was with secondary back on until i can get some solution on the rasp.

if you check Kgolf31's header dyno, the 2nd stage is where it made the most TQ, which is similar to my dyno without the header. so thats why i think that could be disa or maybe the tune.

however, ESS insist as long as no SES light, no further tune is needed...

well i guess i need to crack the disa open to really find out whats going on first..


The tune isn't about the SES light, it's about valvetiming and ignition timing changes - probably even top end fueling changes (like EGT and cat protection) that's why you're down on power - technically you could be more powerful with a more optimization.
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      10-23-2015, 04:22 PM   #7
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Exhaust vanos should be retuned for headers at minimum.
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      10-26-2015, 06:52 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hassmaschine View Post
Exhaust vanos should be retuned for headers at minimum.
Yup, proper scavenging and overlap can be tweeked now.
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      10-26-2015, 09:27 AM   #9
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So are you guys then actually feeling these dips through the rev range when accelerating? Always, or mostly when WOT? For quite a while now my 330i has had a rather noticeable 3200 rpm (or there abouts) dip. Interestingly, a few years ago when I foolishly replaced both DISA units suspecting that they were rattling, there was no dip at 3200 rpm, but it was as if there was a shallow wide dip in power between 3500 and 4500 rpm. You would feel mostly as it picked up again, so as annoying as it was and effectively reducing performance, it wasn't quite as annoying as this current 3200 rpm dip that I have. I have had a few local software tunes, but not really focussed on performance or trying to solve this, mostly trying to deal with the pinging that I have been plagued with. At the moment my cars has a slightly tweaked standard BMW tune. Would actually prefer a more linear power delivery though...
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      10-26-2015, 11:53 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Three_thirty_I View Post
So are you guys then actually feeling these dips through the rev range when accelerating? Always, or mostly when WOT? For quite a while now my 330i has had a rather noticeable 3200 rpm (or there abouts) dip. Interestingly, a few years ago when I foolishly replaced both DISA units suspecting that they were rattling, there was no dip at 3200 rpm, but it was as if there was a shallow wide dip in power between 3500 and 4500 rpm. You would feel mostly as it picked up again, so as annoying as it was and effectively reducing performance, it wasn't quite as annoying as this current 3200 rpm dip that I have. I have had a few local software tunes, but not really focussed on performance or trying to solve this, mostly trying to deal with the pinging that I have been plagued with. At the moment my cars has a slightly tweaked standard BMW tune. Would actually prefer a more linear power delivery though...

thats why i hate the first-->second stage also. its not as predictable as
4500rpm switch if you WOT.

DISA is very smooth however, if I dont give it too much throttle, Power
will build up very smoothly.

After checking the DISA its working fine, and i really dont feel anything
switching from 1st-> 2nd now doing WOT. so i guess this tune maybe
just perfect for me, rather then seeking top HP figure.

I was working with ESS for quite a while on this TQ dip issue, they
told me they smoothed it out by adjusting TQ management setting
in the DME, maybe you can have ur tuner check on that setting.
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      10-26-2015, 01:49 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jc5988 View Post
thats why i hate the first-->second stage also. its not as predictable as
4500rpm switch if you WOT.

DISA is very smooth however, if I dont give it too much throttle, Power
will build up very smoothly.

After checking the DISA its working fine, and i really dont feel anything
switching from 1st-> 2nd now doing WOT. so i guess this tune maybe
just perfect for me, rather then seeking top HP figure.

I was working with ESS for quite a while on this TQ dip issue, they
told me they smoothed it out by adjusting TQ management setting
in the DME, maybe you can have ur tuner check on that setting.
I feel it in the taller gears mostly, and in top gear it's annoying, because it is typically around the upper legal cruising speed where I am, so where the engine generally has more than enough low end grunt, it's sitting in this "dull" spot. The other instances where it is sometimes annoying is when going up a pass and you accelerate through this - you can feel the dip until it passes to above that.
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      10-26-2015, 02:24 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Three_thirty_I View Post
I feel it in the taller gears mostly, and in top gear it's annoying, because it is typically around the upper legal cruising speed where I am, so where the engine generally has more than enough low end grunt, it's sitting in this "dull" spot. The other instances where it is sometimes annoying is when going up a pass and you accelerate through this - you can feel the dip until it passes to above that.
yea that "dull" spot is really killing the fun, it felt like the throttle is not connected for brief moment.

but reason why there is 3 stage is for freeway cruising on top gear, the
gearing at 70mph is right at the sweet spot of first stage. without that
extra stage vs e46, it will be much slower at freeway cruising speed.

i guess just have to learn how to live with the 3 stage for now.
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      10-30-2015, 09:23 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
The tune isn't about the SES light, it's about valvetiming and ignition timing changes - probably even top end fueling changes (like EGT and cat protection) that's why you're down on power - technically you could be more powerful with a more optimization.
I'm trying to source someone who can custom tune for me and get some dyno time.

I think AA's tune, while very good, leaves some safety factor in there. I'm sure there is an easy +10hp untapped yet

Replacing the stock box this winter and re-working the exhaust with 100 cell hi-flow cats. Pretty sure eliminating the restrictive secondaries along with a resonator will be more power band with the existing tune.


Also, just thinking...if you have AFE catted headers, you should be getting no SES error regardless
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      10-30-2015, 10:28 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kgolf31 View Post
I'm trying to source someone who can custom tune for me and get some dyno time.

I think AA's tune, while very good, leaves some safety factor in there. I'm sure there is an easy +10hp untapped yet

Replacing the stock box this winter and re-working the exhaust with 100 cell hi-flow cats. Pretty sure eliminating the restrictive secondaries along with a resonator will be more power band with the existing tune.


Also, just thinking...if you have AFE catted headers, you should be getting no SES error regardless
Do the Dinan intake and Rev hose, or buy a AFE SI intake.
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      10-30-2015, 11:45 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Do the Dinan intake and Rev hose, or buy a AFE SI intake.
Was thinking AFE SI Stage 2 or whatever the heck it is
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      10-30-2015, 11:47 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kgolf31 View Post
Was thinking AFE SI Stage 2 or whatever the heck it is
That's the one. Made power, but the Dinan modified box/Rev Hose isn't bad either.
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      10-30-2015, 12:03 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
The tune isn't about the SES light, it's about valvetiming and ignition timing changes - probably even top end fueling changes (like EGT and cat protection) that's why you're down on power - technically you could be more powerful with a more optimization.
This is correct. It's not about the SES light, it's about optimizing power and safety.
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      10-30-2015, 12:06 PM   #18
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So people really feel the dips? If I'm WOT I feel the power surge on at 4500 RPM, but below that it's just powerful and linear. I checked DISA activations in INPA and they're working fine so I'm pretty sure I didn't lose the first stage, LOL.
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      10-30-2015, 03:23 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kgolf31 View Post
Was thinking AFE SI Stage 2 or whatever the heck it is
All this time and still the stock intake? Wow.
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      10-30-2015, 03:32 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kgolf31 View Post
Was thinking AFE SI Stage 2 or whatever the heck it is
All this time and still the stock intake? Wow.
Ummm, yep. And stock exhaust with exception to the muffler delete
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