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      05-21-2013, 01:04 PM   #89
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umm that could be the answer cause the X5d is heavier by about one grand if not mistaken
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      05-21-2013, 04:16 PM   #90
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You guys over there must be running some seriously shit quality diesel. You say your premium is 45 cetane ?.. that's not going to give you a nice clean burn !

In UK premium is 55 cetane! .. bottom rung diesel is 53 .. we'll forget about the pricing part !

Last edited by 335DEE; 05-21-2013 at 04:30 PM.
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      05-22-2013, 11:01 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Socom

Engine works harder in the X5. Perhaps the added resistance changes the characteristics of combustion. Such as more heat, sustained high pressure. I'm just guessing here but my BIL told me once that OTR big rigs run better when loaded vs. No load. He's a trucker.
Agreed that load is generally good, but I can't find ANY X5 owners with the same injector issues. Just based on probability and process capability, I would think that there would be a few X5 reported incidents given the number of issues with the 335s.

I initially thought that this had to be an EGR issue given the recalls. My SA had me convinced it was purely an injector problem. Now, it's starting to sound more like a wiring harness problem. I sure hope so because this is one amazing vehicle when it is right.
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      05-23-2013, 07:40 AM   #92
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Question.....

Everyone that is having the failing injectors / wiring harness issues / DDE issues......

Did anyone have these issues PRIOR to the emissions recall campaign which also reprogramed the DDE?

Wondering if the campaign could have a bug in the software??
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      05-23-2013, 10:48 AM   #93
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In my case, the series of injector #2 failure was after an emission recall reprogramming. After three failures, the car was reprogrammed to the last level to solve the problem. Since the new level, I had one limp mode that did correct itself by restarting the engine but no more injector failure.
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      06-13-2013, 03:28 PM   #94
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My 335d is choking!!!

Hello I am new to the forum. I have had a 2009 335d for a couple of years. It has around 80,000km on the odometer. We bought the car down in California.

Right now the SES light is on and it is idling very poorly. The SES has been intermittent for a while. Sometimes it idles OK, most of the time it does not. On a cold start it feels like it is going to stall out. It is slow to get revved up when you press the gas pedal. Once it is up to speed everything feels pretty good with good power. The low idle is the main problem. The car does run better as it warms up but you can still feel it missing at a traffic light. One thing to note is that we recently had the exhaust injection valve changed out.

I am wanting to get it into the dealer here in Calgary but the wait time is almost a month. Does this sound like it might be the same problem on this thread and can anyone suggest what steps I can recommend to a mechanic to check first? This car is just out of warranty (of course) and I want it fixed in the quickest order possible.

Thanks in advance for any help guys...
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      06-13-2013, 03:52 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shel335d View Post
Hello I am new to the forum. I have had a 2009 335d for a couple of years. It has around 80,000km on the odometer. We bought the car down in California.

Right now the SES light is on and it is idling very poorly. The SES has been intermittent for a while. Sometimes it idles OK, most of the time it does not. On a cold start it feels like it is going to stall out. It is slow to get revved up when you press the gas pedal. Once it is up to speed everything feels pretty good with good power. The low idle is the main problem. The car does run better as it warms up but you can still feel it missing at a traffic light. One thing to note is that we recently had the exhaust injection valve changed out.

I am wanting to get it into the dealer here in Calgary but the wait time is almost a month. Does this sound like it might be the same problem on this thread and can anyone suggest what steps I can recommend to a mechanic to check first? This car is just out of warranty (of course) and I want it fixed in the quickest order possible.

Thanks in advance for any help guys...
Try running an injector cleaner. Liqui Moly has some products.
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      06-13-2013, 05:24 PM   #96
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Stick with BMW dealership. They are becoming more familiar with the diesels. Indy shops probably won't have a clue or incorrectly diagnose the car. First things first, get the code for the SES light.
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      06-13-2013, 08:09 PM   #97
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Somebody help me. I'm new to the forum, and I live in Savannah, GA and drive back and fourth between Atlanta and Savannah often. My 2010 BMW 335d only has 33k miles on it and it's been back to the dealership 3 times in six months for the same issue over and over; SES light comes on, injector #6 is replaced, and "zero quantity adaptation". WTF is zero quantity adaptation anyway? I'm seriously about to lose it. I'm back in the dealership loaner car and it automatically paired to my smartphone from the last time I had the loaner car! That is not normal.
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      06-13-2013, 08:12 PM   #98
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I've read about ever thread I can find regarding zero adaptation failures but I still can't seem to track down any definitive solution. I really like my car... but I don't feel like I can trust it, and it's really a terrible feeling.
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      06-13-2013, 08:49 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlas1 View Post
WTF is zero quantity adaptation anyway?
It's the pilot injection (pre-injection) fuel quantity.

You read the threads so you know the answers. It's going to take some time, but the dealers will figure it out. You can share your opinion about this topic with the SA and shop foreman, maybe it will help speed up the process.
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      06-13-2013, 10:16 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlas1 View Post
...WTF is zero quantity adaptation anyway?...
The following text is from (page 61) of the BMW training document "ST810 Advanced Diesel Technology Workbook" - you can probably find the whole pdf document by Googling for st810. Basically, each injector is slightly different and the DDE has separate "adaptation" values for each injector so that it can properly inject a precise volume of fuel. There _appears_ to be a poorly designed driver circuit on the DDE board that sometimes fails a little bit and results in the adaptation value going out of range. (Or something like that.)

FYI, there are three BMW PDF training documents out there that are really cool and informative. ST810 is one, another is named "Advanced Diesel with Blue Performance", and the last is "Introduction to Diesel Technology". The "...Blue Performance" seems to subsume the other two to some degree.

----------------------------------

Fuel InjectorVolume Adjustment
Piezo-fuel injectors not only bear the hydraulic tolerances but also
information concerning the stroke characteristics of the injector.
This is a separate classification for the injector voltage calibration.
This information is necessary due to the individual voltage requirement
of each fuel injector. The fuel injector is assigned to a voltage
requirement class. This replaces the seventh digit of the numerical
combination on the injector for hydraulic adjustment.
A piezo-fuel injector therefore has only six characters for the
hydraulic adjustment (due to a more precise manufacture of the
piezo-fuel injectors) and a seventh character for the injector voltage
adjustment.
Volume Adjustment
If the digital diesel electronics detects engine speed fluctuations,
the actuation period of the fuel injectors is corrected based on
these engine speed fluctuations. The volume adjustment adapts
the injected volume of all cylinders with respect to each other.
Zero Volume Adaptation
The zero volume adaptation is a continual learning process.
This learning process is required to enable precise pre-injection for
each individual fuel injector. Accurate metering of the very low
pre-injection volume is necessary for the fulfilment of exhaust
emission regulations.
Zero volume adaptation must be carried out on a continual basis
due to the volume drift of the fuel injectors.
At each cylinder, a small amount of fuel is injected during overrun
mode. This volume continues to increase until a slight increase in
engine speed is detected by the digital diesel electronics.
The digital diesel electronic is thus able to detect when the respective
cylinder begins to work. The volume of fuel injected during
zero volume adaptation is used by the digital diesel electronics as a
value for the characteristic map of pre-injection.
Zero volume adaptation takes place alternately from one cylinder to
the next during the overrun phase at engine speeds from 1500 to
2500 rpm and with the engine at operating temperature.
Zero volume adaptation has no influence on fuel consumption as
only very small quantity of fuel (about 1mm3) is injected at one
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      06-14-2013, 07:49 AM   #101
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I went a couple of days ago to get my yearly inspection, the guy recognized me and we spoke about the DIESEL quality in Puerto Rico which BTW SUCKS!!!!! He told me to keep my car ALL the time with any additive for DIESELS cause the quality of DIESEL fuel is horrible , he told me that his truck had too many issues to discuss about but his injector went out constantly, so word for the wise out there use any additive and or DIESEL injector cleaner, you will never know when you will be screwed at the pump!!!!!
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      06-14-2013, 10:27 AM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puerto Rican 335d View Post
I went a couple of days ago to get my yearly inspection, the guy recognized me and we spoke about the DIESEL quality in Puerto Rico which BTW SUCKS!!!!! He told me to keep my car ALL the time with any additive for DIESELS cause the quality of DIESEL fuel is horrible , he told me that his truck had too many issues to discuss about but his injector went out constantly, so word for the wise out there use any additive and or DIESEL injector cleaner, you will never know when you will be screwed at the pump!!!!!
Did he say that using an additive changed things around? Which additive?

I have looked several times and cannot find out how any agency monitors fuel quality anywhere, including Europe.

PL
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      06-14-2013, 11:06 AM   #103
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Pierre he did not mention which one, he just stated to use them cause our diesel down here is of poor quality.
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      06-14-2013, 01:56 PM   #104
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Need help, Carbon build up and bad injectors.

I have a little over 50k on my 2009 335d.

Car is at the dealer now. I have carbon build up and need all of the fuel injectors replaced. My warranty was up a couple of months ago. I think BMWNA knows this is an issue, they are hopefully going to repair as a goodwill gesture. I honestly think they know something is seriously wrong with the diesel.

I would appreciate if anyone can help me. If you could post past service codes and how it was resolved with your car or other systems and parts that may need to be looked at or replaced. My fear is that they fix part of the problem then leave me in the same spot in a few months with more problems.

One of the worst things about this is that most dealerships have little experience with this car. They told me this themselves. So they are gonna throw some parts at it and may miss what the cause may actually be from.

Please post similar issues and options that they may have tried with you. I wish the techs would spend some time here on this site, I found out more about my car in one hour than I had from the dealer in 4 days.

The rep helping me was fantastic, I was actually given a loaner and he has made every attempt to keep me informed. I just have less faith in the service techs with their lack of experience with diesel.
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      06-14-2013, 03:24 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePicturePro View Post
I have a little over 50k on my 2009 335d.

Car is at the dealer now. I have carbon build up and need all of the fuel injectors replaced. My warranty was up a couple of months ago. I think BMWNA knows this is an issue, they are hopefully going to repair as a goodwill gesture. I honestly think they know something is seriously wrong with the diesel.

I would appreciate if anyone can help me. If you could post past service codes and how it was resolved with your car or other systems and parts that may need to be looked at or replaced. My fear is that they fix part of the problem then leave me in the same spot in a few months with more problems.

One of the worst things about this is that most dealerships have little experience with this car. They told me this themselves. So they are gonna throw some parts at it and may miss what the cause may actually be from.

Please post similar issues and options that they may have tried with you. I wish the techs would spend some time here on this site, I found out more about my car in one hour than I had from the dealer in 4 days.

The rep helping me was fantastic, I was actually given a loaner and he has made every attempt to keep me informed. I just have less faith in the service techs with their lack of experience with diesel.
I find it highly suspicious that you need all injectors replaced. Sounds like to me that the techs took out a dart board and it landed on the injectors. Can't wait to see where the dart lands next month!
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      06-18-2013, 08:46 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePicturePro View Post
I have a little over 50k on my 2009 335d.

Car is at the dealer now. I have carbon build up and need all of the fuel injectors replaced. My warranty was up a couple of months ago. I think BMWNA knows this is an issue, they are hopefully going to repair as a goodwill gesture. I honestly think they know something is seriously wrong with the diesel.

I would appreciate if anyone can help me. If you could post past service codes and how it was resolved with your car or other systems and parts that may need to be looked at or replaced. My fear is that they fix part of the problem then leave me in the same spot in a few months with more problems.

One of the worst things about this is that most dealerships have little experience with this car. They told me this themselves. So they are gonna throw some parts at it and may miss what the cause may actually be from.

Please post similar issues and options that they may have tried with you. I wish the techs would spend some time here on this site, I found out more about my car in one hour than I had from the dealer in 4 days.

The rep helping me was fantastic, I was actually given a loaner and he has made every attempt to keep me informed. I just have less faith in the service techs with their lack of experience with diesel.
Which dealer did you take this to in socal?
It seems like all the dealers are saying that they do not see this problem, but OBVIOUSLY, it seems like for every 1 BMW dealer, there is 1 335d with injector/carbon/dde problem. and Most of us are out of warranty.
Mine is up north at another BMW dealer in the bay area for the same problem right now.

Perhaps a conf. call for all the dealer foremans working on similar issues at this exact moment?!haha
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      06-18-2013, 08:49 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hansj01 View Post
My 2010 335D just had an SES diagnostic saying #4 had a failed fuel injector at 57k. Warranty expired at 50k. The dealer wants $1300 to fix. This is my first Bimmer and it goes without saying that it will definitely be my last! The only other vehicle I have ever owned with a fuel injector problem was a Nissan Maxima back in 1996 that had 54k on it and and Nissan stepped up and replaced ALL of my injectors free of charge. I would expect a 2010 BMW to have better quality control than this! Hell, the 1999 Mercedes SLK my wife just sold had 193k on it and we never did a thing to it other than change the oil. Doesn't say much for BMW!

I intend to advertise my BMW experience in the Twin Cities's major newspaper's "classified" section next to the new BMW classified ads for a few months so others can be informed of this quality control problem. It will likely only dissuade 30 or 40 people from buying a new Bimmer but it gives me peace of mind that I did the right thing.
Hi Hansj01, If the code is specifying fault in the injectors, the injectors are covered under emissions warranty, which is 70k, not 50k. This is documented in your warranty booklet. Id go back and ask for your money back....
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      07-14-2013, 06:06 PM   #108
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anyone know decent price to reprogram DDE. not covered with oem gold extended warranty.
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      07-14-2013, 06:12 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlas1 View Post
Somebody help me. I'm new to the forum, and I live in Savannah, GA and drive back and fourth between Atlanta and Savannah often. My 2010 BMW 335d only has 33k miles on it and it's been back to the dealership 3 times in six months for the same issue over and over; SES light comes on, injector #6 is replaced, and "zero quantity adaptation". WTF is zero quantity adaptation anyway? I'm seriously about to lose it. I'm back in the dealership loaner car and it automatically paired to my smartphone from the last time I had the loaner car! That is not normal.

same here. zero quantity adaptation error. dealer wants inexplicable amount of money to reprogram dde. light goes on and off every couple hundred miles. ive had your same issues. contact customer relations.

luckily you are under 50k.
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      07-14-2013, 06:35 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yafool View Post
Hi Hansj01, If the code is specifying fault in the injectors, the injectors are covered under emissions warranty, which is 70k, not 50k. This is documented in your warranty booklet. Id go back and ask for your money back....
Not all states adopted Calif emissions policy
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