Please help: Cobb E30 Map Misfires & Bank 2 AFR Weirdness - BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum

minivan · 02-21-2013, 12:18 PM

Hi Cobb experts,

I am FBO and running the Cobb AP. Car ran beautifully on the 93 oct. maps. Recently switched to the E30 maps running the proper mix of E85 and 93 oct.

I'm attaching the CSV of the 3rd gear pull. After the first few seconds, car started misfiring on cylinders 4 and 6. Bank 2 AFR looks really weird as well. I had to coast to a stop and restarted the engine (also logged). While coasting, any application of throttle resulted in violent misfires. After restarting the engine, it runs fine. I have not tried another full throttle / full boost pull since.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks.

enrita · 02-21-2013, 12:27 PM

how many miles on the plugs and generally on the car? have you ever had the injectors replaced?
Did you read the codes? Also try to search for the excel sheet that was posted here to graph the logs better..

minivan · 02-21-2013, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enrita

how many miles on the plugs and generally on the car? have you ever had the injectors replaced?
Did you read the codes? Also try to search for the excel sheet that was posted here to graph the logs better..

12k miles on the plugs (OEM Bosch). Injectors replaced under recall 15k miles ago. 66k miles on the car. Original O2 sensors.

Two codes were cylinder 4 and 6 misfires. Nothing else.

The Zasquatch template didn't work for me - runtime error 1004. Probably the CSV is too long. I'll try shortening it.

enrita · 02-21-2013, 12:50 PM

the data is all messed up and there is no full pull. please try to log ONLY WOT 2000 rpm up and when it missfires just stop it.
are you opening it on a mac ?

minivan · 02-21-2013, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enrita

the data is all messed up and there is no full pull. please try to log ONLY WOT 2000 rpm up and when it missfires just stop it.
are you opening it on a mac ?

Thanks for the help. It's still giving me the same error. I'm on Windows, Word 2010. I'm attaching a shortened CSV and screenshot.

The pull is the first 4 seconds. The rest is not messed up... that's how the car ran!

enrita · 02-21-2013, 01:02 PM

is it missfiring everytime you do a pull and always those 2 cylinders?
Check the missfire thread as well. Could be coils.

Ænema · 02-21-2013, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enrita

is it missfiring everytime you do a pull and always those 2 cylinders?
Check the missfire thread as well. Could be coils.

This. Probably just the normal tune induced misfire.

mithiral67 · 02-21-2013, 01:49 PM

I have no actual help to provide. However, your logs made me want to smack a baby, so here's what I like to see in a log. Which wont help much in solving your problem.

minivan · 02-21-2013, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mithiral67

I have no actual help to provide. However, your logs made me want to smack a baby, so here's what I like to see in a log. Which wont help much in solving your problem.

I wanted to provide all the information. If I had just posted the minimal information (i.e., w/o bank 2 AFR) such as in your example log, it wouldn't have shown the whole story. I did attach the CSV files in addition to my admittedly dense screenshots.

Thanks to everyone else for the help! Looks like all signs point towards hardware.

minivan · 02-21-2013, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ænema

This. Probably just the normal tune induced misfire.

Thanks! Is it normal for the misfiring bank to go lean and continue misfiring until the engine is restarted?

enrita · 02-21-2013, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minivan

Thanks! Is it normal for the misfiring bank to go lean and continue misfiring until the engine is restarted?

yes since it switches off the injectors.
you can just clear the codes on the fly with the AP

Ænema · 02-21-2013, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minivan

Thanks! Is it normal for the misfiring bank to go lean and continue misfiring until the engine is restarted?

Yep, like enrita said when the DME sees a misfire it shuts that cylinder down. Which is also why it ran like crap after it misfired.

minivan · 02-22-2013, 09:54 AM

Thanks again! Based on the logs, is it possible to say what's causing the misfires (plugs, coils, injectors) or do you recommend just replacing things starting with the easiest ones and going from there?

Manny_World · 02-22-2013, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minivan

Thanks again! Based on the logs, is it possible to say what's causing the misfires (plugs, coils, injectors) or do you recommend just replacing things starting with the easiest ones and going from there?

This, but since you have to remove the coil to get to the sprak plug, I would replace them both at the same time for an extra peace of mind. When I had misfires on two cylinders, I replaced all 6 plugs and coils. Haven't had a problem since.

enrita · 02-22-2013, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minivan

Thanks again! Based on the logs, is it possible to say what's causing the misfires (plugs, coils, injectors) or do you recommend just replacing things starting with the easiest ones and going from there?

Easy test is to put coils 4-6 into cylinder 1-2. if the missfire follows than you know its the coils. If its the coils you can just replace ALL of them and 6 brand new plugs as well.

neilvosko · 02-22-2013, 12:50 PM

Probably your plugs, I heard this from others and the protune took care of the misfires

minivan · 03-28-2013, 01:50 PM

New plugs didn't help. Going to diagnose coils next. The weird thing is it only misfires in high gear, low RPM, high requested load.

marv85 · 03-28-2013, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minivan

New plugs didn't help. Going to diagnose coils next. The weird thing is it only misfires in high gear, low RPM, high requested load.

Yup the high load situation is when they misfire the most

Like enrita said, swap your coils from those cylinders with cyl1/2 if those start misfiring then your coils are not up to par. very easy to diagnose.

don;t be frustrated, you'll get there

AltecBX · 03-28-2013, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marv85

Yup the high load situation is when they misfire the most

Like enrita said, swap your coils from those cylinders with cyl1/2 if those start misfiring then your coils are not up to par. very easy to diagnose.

don;t be frustrated, you'll get there

+1
After you do this, send a .csv file so one of us can properly draw it for you in a graph.

SCGT · 03-28-2013, 02:21 PM

As stated above, what I would do is:
1: Swap coils on 2 misfiring cylinders with 2 non-misfiring cylinders
2: Log again. If misfire stays with cylinders replace plugs. If misfire moves with coils replace coils.
3: Log again, if replaced plugs and misfire continues look at injectors.

Shotgun random stupid little stuff/general tips: I had all sorts of misfires when my charge pipe/DV connection started to leak. It took FOREVER for the car to throw an underboost code, because I was still reaching boost and I don't spend a ton of time in tall gears WOT. Lesson being, check stupid little housekeeping/maintenance items while you're in there as general good work practice. Simple things like connections, vac lines, etc. Especially those vac lines that run by the oil filter. They're pretty easy to change once the engine cover is off. 3.5mm size.

minivan · 03-28-2013, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marv85

Yup the high load situation is when they misfire the most

Like enrita said, swap your coils from those cylinders with cyl1/2 if those start misfiring then your coils are not up to par. very easy to diagnose.

don;t be frustrated, you'll get there

Quote:

Originally Posted by AltecBX

+1
After you do this, send a .csv file so one of us can properly draw it for you in a graph.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCGT

As stated above, what I would do is:
1: Swap coils on 2 misfiring cylinders with 2 non-misfiring cylinders
2: Log again. If misfire stays with cylinders replace plugs. If misfire moves with coils replace coils.
3: Log again, if replaced plugs and misfire continues look at injectors.

Shotgun random stupid little stuff/general tips: I had all sorts of misfires when my charge pipe/DV connection started to leak. It took FOREVER for the car to throw an underboost code, because I was still reaching boost and I don't spend a ton of time in tall gears WOT. Lesson being, check stupid little housekeeping/maintenance items while you're in there as general good work practice. Simple things like connections, vac lines, etc. Especially those vac lines that run by the oil filter. They're pretty easy to change once the engine cover is off. 3.5mm size.

Thank you sirs. Replaced the vac lines earlier this year. I'll update the thread after further diagnosis - really hoping it's not the injectors.

marv85 · 03-28-2013, 11:57 PM

doesn't sound like injectors from what you're describing.. fingers crossed. good luck

02-21-2013, 12:27 PM	#2
enrita Major General Drives: 335i - Big turbos Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Italian in Sweden Posts: 6,849 iTrader: (0)	how many miles on the plugs and generally on the car? have you ever had the injectors replaced? Did you read the codes? Also try to search for the excel sheet that was posted here to graph the logs better.. __________________ 07 335i AT - TD St.2 Turbos - COBB (Custom Cobb mapping by http://www.protuningfreaks.com/) - JB4G5 ISO - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - E85 Walbro - Injen Intake - Helix IC - Snow Stg. 3 - Stett CP - AR DPs - midpipes 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - Level 10 AT upgrade - Alpina AT Flash

02-21-2013, 12:50 PM	#4
enrita Major General Drives: 335i - Big turbos Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Italian in Sweden Posts: 6,849 iTrader: (0)	the data is all messed up and there is no full pull. please try to log ONLY WOT 2000 rpm up and when it missfires just stop it. are you opening it on a mac ? __________________ 07 335i AT - TD St.2 Turbos - COBB (Custom Cobb mapping by http://www.protuningfreaks.com/) - JB4G5 ISO - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - E85 Walbro - Injen Intake - Helix IC - Snow Stg. 3 - Stett CP - AR DPs - midpipes 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - Level 10 AT upgrade - Alpina AT Flash

02-21-2013, 01:02 PM	#6
enrita Major General Drives: 335i - Big turbos Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Italian in Sweden Posts: 6,849 iTrader: (0)	is it missfiring everytime you do a pull and always those 2 cylinders? Check the missfire thread as well. Could be coils. __________________ 07 335i AT - TD St.2 Turbos - COBB (Custom Cobb mapping by http://www.protuningfreaks.com/) - JB4G5 ISO - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - E85 Walbro - Injen Intake - Helix IC - Snow Stg. 3 - Stett CP - AR DPs - midpipes 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - Level 10 AT upgrade - Alpina AT Flash

02-21-2013, 01:49 PM	#8
mithiral67 That guy Drives: mineral white 335is coupe Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Chicago Burbs Posts: 5,437 iTrader: (3)	I have no actual help to provide. However, your logs made me want to smack a baby, so here's what I like to see in a log. Which wont help much in solving your problem. Attached Images __________________ 2015 - m4 - hopefully 2011 - 335is e92 - Cobb E30/AR/Helix (454 rwtq and 404 rwhp) 2007 - 911 Turbo - EP1/AMS (617 awtq and 500 awhp) - Retired 2008 - 335i e92 - Cobb/AR/Helix/OSS (384 rwtq and 356 rwhp) - Retired 2003 and 2005 330i/ci zhp - Stock - Retired

03-28-2013, 11:57 PM	#22
marv85 Colonel Drives: '07 335i MT Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Portland Posts: 2,460 iTrader: (4)	doesn't sound like injectors from what you're describing.. fingers crossed. good luck __________________ '10 E92 335i MKit, COBB E40 tune (more toys coming in soon)

02-22-2013, 09:54 AM	#13
minivan Private Drives: 335i Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 61 iTrader: (0)	Thanks again! Based on the logs, is it possible to say what's causing the misfires (plugs, coils, injectors) or do you recommend just replacing things starting with the easiest ones and going from there?

02-22-2013, 12:50 PM	#16
neilvosko Major Drives: 335i e92 FBO Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: miami Posts: 1,174 iTrader: (12)	Probably your plugs, I heard this from others and the protune took care of the misfires

03-28-2013, 01:50 PM	#17
minivan Private Drives: 335i Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 61 iTrader: (0)	New plugs didn't help. Going to diagnose coils next. The weird thing is it only misfires in high gear, low RPM, high requested load.

03-28-2013, 02:21 PM	#20
SCGT Banned Drives: 2007 335i Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Chandler AZ Posts: 36 iTrader: (1)	As stated above, what I would do is: 1: Swap coils on 2 misfiring cylinders with 2 non-misfiring cylinders 2: Log again. If misfire stays with cylinders replace plugs. If misfire moves with coils replace coils. 3: Log again, if replaced plugs and misfire continues look at injectors. Shotgun random stupid little stuff/general tips: I had all sorts of misfires when my charge pipe/DV connection started to leak. It took FOREVER for the car to throw an underboost code, because I was still reaching boost and I don't spend a ton of time in tall gears WOT. Lesson being, check stupid little housekeeping/maintenance items while you're in there as general good work practice. Simple things like connections, vac lines, etc. Especially those vac lines that run by the oil filter. They're pretty easy to change once the engine cover is off. 3.5mm size.

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