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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > VFF+VARGAS-- Single & Twin Turbo 335i TEST DRIVE and BBQ/MEET/DYNODAY



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      04-21-2013, 01:13 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vargasturbotech View Post
Here is a thought, the only one I will add to this thread. I offered a dyno shoot out / BBQ. Shiv ran from it, and refused to acknowledge it, now all of a sudden he wants one?? At this point I have zero interest in ever doing anything with or in association with anything he has his name on. If our kit runs into his kit at shift sector or the track so be it. I have zero respect for how Shiv runs his business and will not associate myself with him. I gave him the fuel he needs by figuring something out he couldn't in 4 years in a month, and basically blasted it on the forums til he got it. That is my gift to him, I evened the playing field. See you at the next event. Besides that stay out of my threads
It's unfortunate that you are backing out, especially in such an overly critical fashion. Just a tip, if you want certain people to stay out of your threads, you should stop adding in your little secondary comments/rumors about the competition and just focus on your product. You start the fire and then get upset when someone stokes it.
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      04-21-2013, 01:16 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W. View Post
Would Vargas feel more comfortable hosting it at his shop?
Nothing good will come from this for Vargas. He still has to finish and sell the kits. My opinion is he's thinking the outcome will be bad for the future sales of his kits.
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      04-21-2013, 01:33 AM   #47
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I'm guessing that by next spring season, we'll finally see the showdown between these two kits. VTT has got to get production kit out to customers, then they have to install it, tune it, tweak the suspension, wait for winter to end then do some runs!
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      04-21-2013, 01:37 AM   #48
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I guess everyone knows the outcome if it was held now. And Vargas is just afraid of looking bad.
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      04-21-2013, 01:49 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blisstik View Post
I'm guessing that by next spring season, we'll finally see the showdown between these two kits. VTT has got to get production kit out to customers, then they have to install it, tune it, tweak the suspension, wait for winter to end then do some runs!
Next spring? It's still spring right now. While I tend to agree that it's wise to wait a year for a new product to work through it's growing pains, I don't think Vishnu/FFtec will be sitting on their hands doing nothing until then. I predict in a year we'll be saying the same thing like, 'oh yeah? but the Vargas kit only has a year behind it while the Vishnu/FFtec kit has had 2 years.'
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      04-21-2013, 01:57 AM   #50
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I think it's really funny that people have already made deposits for the stage 3 and are standing in line like little kids waiting for the candy store to open for something that hasn't done anything but put up some nice dyno numbers.

I just wonder how long people will sit around waiting to get their kits and when they do get them, I wonder how long it is before they start having issues because no real testing was performed. We have NO 60-130 times. We have no 1/4 mile times. Will it even run a 1/2 mile without coding?

Other than making high HP truck turbos, what has Vargas done other than hop up his brother in-laws car? He talks about a HPFP, but has anyone other than him seen or used it? Do we have any real data regarding it? How long will it last before it fails?

Sorry if you're too stupid to not see the light at the end of the tunnel, but most of you bash Shiv about not providing ST quarter mile numbers and yet when Vargas puts a few nice dyno numbers on the forum you bow at his feet.

Just for once, take Shiv out of the picture and lets look at who really put the ST in to play, FFTEC. This company has a proven track record of making and testing high performance cars. So other than the fact they have been tuned with PROcede, why do you people hate on FFTEC?

Vargas knows better than to go head to head with FFTEC/Vishnu. Just look at the overlays. ST spools quicker and reaches peak torque quicker. Also stays nice and flat though the rpm range.

For everyone who has made a commitment, congrats. I hope this kit is everything you hoped for and more.
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      04-21-2013, 02:08 AM   #51
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      04-21-2013, 02:09 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wedge1967
I think it's really funny that people have already made deposits for the stage 3 and are standing in line like little kids waiting for the candy store to open for something that hasn't done anything but put up some nice dyno numbers.

I just wonder how long people will sit around waiting to get their kits and when they do get them, I wonder how long it is before they start having issues because no real testing was performed. We have NO 60-130 times. We have no 1/4 mile times. Will it even run a 1/2 mile without coding?

Other than making high HP truck turbos, what has Vargas done other than hop up his brother in-laws car? He talks about a HPFP, but has anyone other than him seen or used it? Do we have any real data regarding it? How long will it last before it fails?

Sorry if you're too stupid to not see the light at the end of the tunnel, but most of you bash Shiv about not providing ST quarter mile numbers and yet when Vargas puts a few nice dyno numbers on the forum you bow at his feet.

Just for once, take Shiv out of the picture and lets look at who really put the ST in to play, FFTEC. This company has a proven track record of making and testing high performance cars. So other than the fact they have been tuned with PROcede, why do you people hate on FFTEC?

Vargas knows better than to go head to head with FFTEC/Vishnu. Just look at the overlays. ST spools quicker and reaches peak torque quicker. Also stays nice and flat though the rpm range.

For everyone who has made a commitment, congrats. I hope this kit is everything you hoped for and more.
Good write up
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      04-21-2013, 02:20 AM   #53
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Overlaying the latest dynos. VFF has the advantages from 3700-5300 while VTT has the advantage up top starting at 5300. When you shift from 3rd to 4th at 7000, what RPM do you end up 4th gear for 6MT?

Edit: I found it, around 4700. This means that midrange advantage is minimized after VTT shifts into 4th. Of course the VFF will shift into 4th first but look at the top end difference! So if they were on a 60mph roll race, both 6mt and on 3rd gear, the VFF would pull up first but the VTT would catch up and I think would take the win in a close race. Yeah I know I'm bench racing but this is the data were dealt with.
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      04-21-2013, 02:27 AM   #54
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Let's have the meet to see how much Shiv's 6466 makes. The turbo is good for 900hp.
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      04-21-2013, 02:30 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blisstik View Post
Overlaying the latest dynos. VFF has the advantages from 3700-5300 while VTT has the advantage up top starting at 5300. When you shift from 3rd to 4th at 7000, what RPM do you end up 4th gear for 6MT?
Yeah, but you heard Shiv, he didn't post his highest numbers and I don't blame him. But honestly, the dyno wars are getting boring and truly don't tell us anything other than they are both using dyno's that read high.

Get the VBOX's out boyz and give everyone something we can write home about. Then and only then will we really know who walks the walk around here. Until then it's nothing but BS...
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      04-21-2013, 02:33 AM   #56
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That's true. I better wear my space suit on!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wedge1967 View Post
Yeah, but you heard Shiv, he didn't post his highest numbers and I don't blame him. But honestly, the dyno wars are getting boring and truly don't tell us anything other than they are both using dyno's that read high.

Get the VBOX's out boyz and give everyone something we can write home about. Then and only then will we really know who walks the walk around here. Until then it's nothing but BS...
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      04-21-2013, 03:33 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by creaminz View Post
If this happens, I will be interested to make the drive up there! This should be fun! 5hour drive no problemo!
+1
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      04-21-2013, 03:52 AM   #58
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But but, I live in the Bay Area

Do it for the community!!! Put politics and business tactics aside and lets get some BBQ going!
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      04-21-2013, 04:31 AM   #59
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..
LOL
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      04-21-2013, 04:39 AM   #60
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So much hate... Smh
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      04-21-2013, 05:07 AM   #61
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People can talk alot about dyno records, track records, etc. But in the end I rather have a finished product.

We are comparing a product that was released more than a year ago Vs a month ago.

Real world shoot out would be more awesome though. Same track, same day.
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      04-21-2013, 05:51 AM   #62
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Stage 3 kit?
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      04-21-2013, 06:12 AM   #63
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Why is this such a big deal to everyone? The platform has been pressed, we are over 700whp and at least on the Vishnu camp tbey have proven quality 1/2 mile times.

Everyone says Vargas has only been on a dyno 3 times but as much as a lot of you hate shiv him and fftec started the big turbo game for the n54 so people should acknowledge that they learned a lot from their growing pains and were able to implement it on their side and have a better starting point. Pretty narrow-minded if you fail to see that the first person around the block will always have the hardest time.
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      04-21-2013, 07:47 AM   #64
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This thread seems to me like a attempt by a certain vendor to draw lines in the sand, create a following and put down the amazing progress that has been made in such a short time. There was never going to be a BBQ, that's painfully obvious to me.... The two kits will prove themselves by the customers that buy them, track times, and roll event results.
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      04-21-2013, 09:27 AM   #65
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I find this thread quite entertaining. Not sure why anyone cares about the meet. Vargas has backed up what they needed to with a dyno. Most kits sold on the market do not get an open BBQ meet with dyno sessions. It is a huge promotional/marketing thing which is nice, but each company has to way the costs of this and if they even have to do this.

I think at this point Vargas does not have to do this as they doing great with their stage 2 and stage 3 kits.

But good luck.
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      04-21-2013, 09:28 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobS View Post
This thread seems to me like a attempt by a certain vendor to draw lines in the sand, create a following and put down the amazing progress that has been made in such a short time. There was never going to be a BBQ, that's painfully obvious to me.... The two kits will prove themselves by the customers that buy them, track times, and roll event results.
+1 and then some!!
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