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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Wheels and Tires Forum Sponsored by The Tire Rack > From RFT to Continental ExtremeContact DWS?



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      04-24-2013, 09:21 AM   #1
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From RFT to Continental ExtremeContact DWS?

I have a 2007 E92 with Sports Package on 18" wheels and soon I will be buying new tires. I want to swap to conventional tires and saw that TireRack has great prices on the Continental ExtremeContact DWS.

Has anyone switched to these tires and can elaborate on what can I expect when compared to my stock RFTs?

Ride?
Handling?
Grip?
Noise?
Wear?

Thanks for any info!
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      04-24-2013, 10:36 AM   #2
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From all that I've read (and I've been doing a ton of research because I'm about to do same thing, just going from Conti RFT 16" to 18" either Conti or Hankook V12) you'll see noticeable ride difference and better grip

Noise and wear I'm unsure of other than I think the Hankooks will wear faster but the Contis seem to have sidewall defects based on several reviews I've read on TR - but things like alignment etc could be the factor there, not certain....
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      04-24-2013, 12:54 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragenitro6
From all that I've read (and I've been doing a ton of research because I'm about to do same thing, just going from Conti RFT 16" to 18" either Conti or Hankook V12) you'll see noticeable ride difference and better grip

Noise and wear I'm unsure of other than I think the Hankooks will wear faster but the Contis seem to have sidewall defects based on several reviews I've read on TR - but things like alignment etc could be the factor there, not certain....
Oh ok... As long as the ride still feels sportier, I think I will make the crossover. I also heard that being lighter tures, helps a tad with performance but I guess it shouldn't be much if a gain. Really looking forward to a smoother ride.
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      04-24-2013, 01:24 PM   #4
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The DWS is a great all-season option. It's quiet, lasts a long time, and provides a surprising amount of grip for an all-season tire. Downsides are that the sidewalls are pretty soft, so your car may lose some of its responsiveness. Ride comfort should get better for you though, going from an RFT to a non-RFT.
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      04-24-2013, 01:28 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by AviatorCop View Post
Oh ok... As long as the ride still feels sportier, I think I will make the crossover. I also heard that being lighter tures, helps a tad with performance but I guess it shouldn't be much if a gain. Really looking forward to a smoother ride.

I don't know where you guys are getting info about the weak sidewalls on DWS and Hankooks, but I think it is a subjective feeling that everyone experiences transitioning from RFT to non-RFT. RFT have super rigid sidewalls in order to get your car to a repair facility. Thus, the feeling of bombs exploding and suspension blowouts everytime you go over a bump.

All you have to do is pump up the tires.

If you don't want to swap out your tires twice a year, choose the DWS.



If you like to drift and not worried about cost, go Hankooks:

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      04-24-2013, 01:30 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VMRWheels
The DWS is a great all-season option. It's quiet, lasts a long time, and provides a surprising amount of grip for an all-season tire. Downsides are that the sidewalls are pretty soft, so your car may lose some of its responsiveness. Ride comfort should get better for you though, going from an RFT to a non-RFT.
Good info, thanks!

Damn, I don't want to lose responsiveness though. I live in VA and we get our fair share of rain and some snow, so I really need all season tires. What else you would recommend that will maintain responsiveness? Michelin PSS?
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      04-24-2013, 01:38 PM   #7
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Keep in mind that RFT sidewalls are very stiff! Any other non-RFT option is going to feel softer haha.

Michelin Pilot Super Sports are not all-season tires, so that would not work for you. They're an excellent dedicated summer tire though. I think you would be happy with the DWS. It's not going to be like you're riding on top of some jello or anything. You just have to remember that the sidewall construction is completely different.
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      04-24-2013, 02:27 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VMRWheels
Keep in mind that RFT sidewalls are very stiff! Any other non-RFT option is going to feel softer haha.

Michelin Pilot Super Sports are not all-season tires, so that would not work for you. They're an excellent dedicated summer tire though. I think you would be happy with the DWS. It's not going to be like you're riding on top of some jello or anything. You just have to remember that the sidewall construction is completely different.
Oh ok, I see... Yea, this is our family car after all and not a track car. Hahaha I think the DWS will still be a huge upgrade overall, over the RFTs.
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      04-24-2013, 02:55 PM   #9
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I switched from the OEM Conti RFT on 16's to the DWS on 18's and I am more than happy with them. These tires are a lot quieter than the the runflats and they feel smoother overall. Like flip4335 said, the run flats were horrible whenever I went over bumps, potholes, etc. I barely feel the bumps on the road now with the DWS.

I can't comment on the handling since I don't really toss my car around, but I haven't felt much of a difference if that helps.
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      04-24-2013, 03:06 PM   #10
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Quote:
I don't know where you guys are getting info about the weak sidewalls on DWS and Hankooks, but I think it is a subjective feeling that everyone experiences transitioning from RFT to non-RFT. RFT have super rigid sidewalls in order to get your car to a repair facility. Thus, the feeling of bombs exploding and suspension blowouts everytime you go over a bump.

All you have to do is pump up the tires.

If you don't want to swap out your tires twice a year, choose the DWS.
Hey flip I know we've been PM'ing back and forth.....my mention on the sidewalls having 'issues' came from the pages of reviews I read on TireRack
Wasn't meant as a slam against this tire, just a concern I raised since I was unaware of those tires having a 'defect'
I do realize damn near any tire is going to feel 'softer' flex wise vs RFT's - that's a given

Just talking out loud about the reviews that I read about guys having issues with sidewall defects with the Contis - that doesn't mean that maybe all those guys were slamming their cars around and doing things they shouldn't when on an 'all-season' tire....
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      04-24-2013, 03:21 PM   #11
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I just made a recent switch from stock conti rft to dws. There are pros and cons with the dws. I am considering returning them. Pros: Very comfortable ride, you can hardly feel the bumps on the road. And it's all season capabilities. I have driven them in heavy rain and they gave me the same feeling of driving on dry pavement, very confidence inspiring. Cons: Turn-in is so much less sharp than th stock Rfts. There is a lag between your steering input and the actual car turning. They gave me a feeling of driving a Toyota Corolla, not sporty at all. My bimmer is no longer a ultimate driving machine. Finally the biggest concern to me is after swapping the tires, my car starts to wander around on the street, pulling right and left everywhere. If you search "dws pull", you will see lots of complain. My car was driving straight as arrow before but not anymore. I checked my tire pressure but havent had an alignment yet. If the alignment doesnt cure the problem, I will probably return them. My person advice is " get something else, your bimmer deserves sportier tires."
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      04-24-2013, 03:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragenitro6 View Post
Hey flip I know we've been PM'ing back and forth.....my mention on the sidewalls having 'issues' came from the pages of reviews I read on TireRack
Wasn't meant as a slam against this tire, just a concern I raised since I was unaware of those tires having a 'defect'
I do realize damn near any tire is going to feel 'softer' flex wise vs RFT's - that's a given

Just talking out loud about the reviews that I read about guys having issues with sidewall defects with the Contis - that doesn't mean that maybe all those guys were slamming their cars around and doing things they shouldn't when on an 'all-season' tire....
Hahaha...no offense taken, brah.

Lots of folks have been complaining about the move to non-RFTs and how things just don't feel the same, so you are not alone in that respect. People have to also remember to burn off the slickness on the tires when they are new--oh, maybe after 500 miles--before they start slamming the tires for ineffective performance.

I went through the same transition...trying to recapture the sure-track feeling and solid turn ins that the stiff sidewalled RFTs provided.

While I never really achieved the same feeling (but I did lose the tramlining and other issues related to RFTs), I came really close with both the Hankooks and DWS by pumping up the tire pressure.

My door jamb states that 32 psi front and 38 psi rear are normal for any tire under a nominal load, say, two people. My yellow sticker suggests that for speeds up to and beyond 100 mph, and for carrying excessive loads, like my golf clubs in the trunk and other sundries (LOL), the recommended tire pressure is 39psi Front/45psi Rear.

Since I got my non-RFTs, I raised the tire pressure to somewhere in the middle at 35psi Front/41psi Rear to allow for some pressure gain in hot weather or fast tracking on the asphalt, regaining some of that sidewall grip in the turns as a result.

My suggestion is to experiment with the tire pressure that feels best for your needs. I love both tires, but will try the Pilot Super Sports when the Hankooks wear out and there is a sale!
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      04-24-2013, 03:49 PM   #13
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From experience, on a Mini Cooper S, 370Z, 335i, and even a Volvo Xc70, Continentals are consistently soft rolling (they somehow "feel" smoother on the road), they are quieter, and in every way an improvement over Bridgestone especially the RFTs.
They wear well, reduce tram-lining a little bit, road noise is improved and remains superior throughout the life of the tire.

Tire pressure wise I found that 38psi all around worked great on the Z, the Mini, and the Volvo. I think I ran 40psi rear and 38psi front on the 335i. FWIW.

The DWS Conti's are a little but squirmy though, and I noticed the DW's did give up some dry traction but made up for it in predictability. My .02, FWIW, YMMV.

Best bet though for year around awesomeness is two sets of wheels and tires. Dedicated 3 season Summers, and a dedicated snow tire depending on your year around intentions. Your tires will seem to last forever and you get so much better cold weather performance out of dedicated snow tires. I was blown away by some Michelin Alpin 2s and the huge improvement over any All Season in cold, slush, snow etc.
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      04-24-2013, 05:12 PM   #14
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The Conti DWS is a good valued tire that performs very well in all seasons, especially in the snow when compared to other high performance all season tires.

HOWEVER, if you can avoid it and can afford it, i am highly against getting all season tires. ALL season stands for NO season!! You are giving up both summer performance and winter performance with all season tires. They do not perform well in either, it is a compromise of the two. Also, most all season tires don't do well in the extreme dry and or wet. Always get dedicated summer tires and winter tires if you can. Good Luck!
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      04-24-2013, 07:14 PM   #15
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I'm debating between the Conti DW or the Hankook V12 summer tires. Which one would you guys recommend? I already have winter tires and rims for the snow.
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      04-24-2013, 07:45 PM   #16
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Conti DW.

Better overall almost everything especially in the Rain (where we need that here in Vancouver BC). Also very comfortable and durable, one of the best tires for its class if you're not looking for ultimate handling. Very cheap as well compared to others (even though the Hankook is around the same price point). Good Luck!
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      04-24-2013, 07:54 PM   #17
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I vote to still get dws.

Dws is somewhat bouncy compared to the firm stiff ride you are used to with rft. The handling is not bad, IMO.

Having said that, My next set will be Michelin pss, but only because I'm changing to summer and winter tire setup instead of all season.
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      04-24-2013, 10:54 PM   #18
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If your worried about cost and can sacrifice some performance, get DWS because they have a 540 tread.

If you don't care about cost, get Michelin Pilot Super Sport.
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      04-25-2013, 04:23 AM   #19
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Quote:
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If your worried about cost and can sacrifice some performance, get DWS because they have a 540 tread.

If you don't care about cost, get Michelin Pilot Super Sport.
Here we go again. You cannot use the UTQG treadwear number across brands, it is not standardized. 540 means nothing. It's like car mfgs. self-reporting mpgs to the EPA. The EPA tests about 15% of all cars, so mfgs. can sneak some numbers in there (like BMW tried to do with the F30 before they got smacked down).

My RS-A's on my Nissan went beyond 70k with a 240 treadwear.

The RE050A's have a 140, and they've gone 30k on my 335.

A ZSP car does not come with all season tires, why would you put replacements that are all season? To avoid snow tires? All season tires are a compromise across, all seasons.

With the PSS costing so much less than RFTs, they are the obvious choice. I believe in non-staggered setups, they even have a 30k warranty, which shows how much Michelin believes in them.
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      04-25-2013, 07:32 AM   #20
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You cannot deny that the DWS has a way better thread life than PSS which is why it has a 50k warranty vs a 30k warranty.

The compound on a dedicated summer tire (especially very high performance) like the PSS will wear out faster than the DWS in order to achieve more grip. There is no denying that.

His car is a family car so he's not going to pull 1g on it.... DWS is enough and it will last almost twice as long while costing significantly less than the PSS (don't forget that labour costs of mounting and balancing more often).
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      04-25-2013, 03:59 PM   #21
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Both John and Liang are making very good points and it's making my decision ever so difficult. LOL

It's definitely either the DWS or PSS, non-RFTs.

I'm ever so slightly leaning right now towards the PSS, but the price of the DWS is chirping into my ear. Haha actually, it is PRICE the most determining factor right now for me, because we hardly get much snow around here in the winter and I reallyndon't want to lose responsiveness. Like someone said earlier, I still want to feel like I'm driving the ultimate driving machine.
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      04-25-2013, 04:27 PM   #22
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Have you considered Conti Sport Contact 3? They are summer performance tires, I loved them and they are cheaper than PSS.
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