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      11-26-2010, 09:11 PM   #1
shiv@vishnu
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Exclamation Procede V5 Traction/Launch Control

I have some good video from road testing today. I'll post it up once it is edited. Until then, here's a video of Procede v5's new Spark Retard-based Traction/Launch control system.

Unlike the factory traction control nannies, our sytsem is almost completely transparent to the driver. No hiccups, surges, bucking, etc,. But most important for performance, it allows a mild degree of wheelspin before intervening (with spark retard). And even better, the degree of Procede intervention is dependent upon the severity/duration of the wheelspin event!



Above is a datalog taken today on an empty backroad in Mexico. Just a bunch of 1st and 2nd gear romps on a completely dry surface. BMW traction control was FULLY defeated (DTC button held and pressed for a few seconds). Our 335 is fully modded and equipped with an aftermarket LSD. Running on 91oct, the Procede autotuned to 14.5psi and ~50% ignition correction. So pretty representative of typical power output.

Looking at the Ignition Correction graph, you can see how the amount of ignition correction relates to the severity of wheelspin. You can't really see wheelspin well in the logs since it is a computed value based upon calculated gear, the wheelspeed input, rate of RPM rise, etc,. But you can get a good idea of it by looking at the RPM graph. When you have severe uncontrolled wheelspin, you will see RPM will climb up sharply and steeply. When you see it go up and down like a saw-tooth, you have moderate wheelspin caused by the tires losing and regaining traction over and over again. When you see neither of these, you have full (or close to full) traction.

In the datalog, you can see the Procede react to every type of wheelslip condition quickly. In the video that I'll post sooh, you will see that the car can still be driven fast and slid about aggressively. But when traction is limited, you will notice that there is very little torque-induced gross wheelspin. Keep in mind that the Procede's traction control will never close the throttle or apply the brakes automatically. It simply reacts to wheel slippage by retarding up to 15 deg of timing which results in a short term engine torque loss of up to 150lb-ft.

And for those who want more allowable slip before the Procede intervenes (those running drag slicks for instance), you can adjust the Traction Threshold user adjustable upwards. Or turn the system off completely by inputting 100%.

And to make things even cooler, you can set up Map1 and Map2 to have different Traction Threshold values which. Combine that with the ability to have different Boost Response, boost level, etc,. values in each map, and you can set up one map to be a conservative daily driver/bad weather map that does everything it can to prevent wheelspin. And the other to be a balls-out, drifting map!

And this is just the beginning

Shiv

PS. I'll get my hands on a 6AT car this week to demonstrate the Launch Control aspect of this feature. That's also very cool. And expect all these goodies to be ported over to the n55 firmware within the next couple of weeks.

PSS. I imagine both the Traction and Launch Control feature will be even more useful for those without LSDs.

Last edited by shiv@vishnu; 11-26-2010 at 09:20 PM.
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      11-26-2010, 09:20 PM   #2
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3x I said nice already

So on the street where we're say WOT and hit a small uneven piece of road, say a bump, what will procede TC do when the car lands back on the ground in these short "bounces" for lack of a better word..I always try to let off throttle if I notice bumpiness in the road as I have a feeling that these cause enormous shocks to the driveline..
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      11-26-2010, 09:27 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dzenno View Post
3x I said nice already

So on the street where we're say WOT and hit a small uneven piece of road, say a bump, what will procede TC do when the car lands back on the ground in these short "bounces" for lack of a better word...
Was wondering the same thing...
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      11-26-2010, 09:47 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dzenno View Post
3x I said nice already

So on the street where we're say WOT and hit a small uneven piece of road, say a bump, what will procede TC do when the car lands back on the ground in these short "bounces" for lack of a better word..I always try to let off throttle if I notice bumpiness in the road as I have a feeling that these cause enormous shocks to the driveline..
You'll like this answer:

When your tires are off the ground spinning wildly, the Procede will retard heaps of timing, effectively robbing the engine of massive amounts of torque. So when the tires land and get full grip, the driveline wont be shocked with anything close to max torque (even if you stay WOT in the air). The torque will ramp back in gradually (but nice and quickly) once it is confirmed that the tires have regained full traction. I could probably demo this somehow... lol

shiv
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      11-26-2010, 09:54 PM   #5
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Shiv that would be the ballsiest demo ever LOL

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
You'll like this answer:

When your tires are off the ground spinning wildly, the Procede will retard heaps of timing, effectively robbing the engine of massive amounts of torque. So when the tires land and get full grip, the driveline wont be shocked with anything close to max torque (even if you stay WOT in the air). The torque will ramp back in gradually (but nice and quickly) once it is confirmed that the tires have regained full traction. I could probably demo this somehow... lol

shiv
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      11-26-2010, 10:42 PM   #6
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Shiv that would be the ballsiest demo ever LOL
I'll do it tomorrow and videotape it.
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      11-26-2010, 10:54 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
You'll like this answer:

When your tires are off the ground spinning wildly, the Procede will retard heaps of timing, effectively robbing the engine of massive amounts of torque. So when the tires land and get full grip, the driveline wont be shocked with anything close to max torque (even if you stay WOT in the air). The torque will ramp back in gradually (but nice and quickly) once it is confirmed that the tires have regained full traction. I could probably demo this somehow... lol

shiv
SICK! this should save some halfshafts and trannies
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      11-26-2010, 11:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dzenno View Post
SICK! this should save some halfshafts and trannies
I hope so. At 75k miles on the clock and 200+ runs at the dragstrip, i've been pushing my luck for far too long
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      11-26-2010, 11:40 PM   #9
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how will this work if say you need to burn out at the drag strip on DRs? Assume disable the feature completely and more benefit for street tire guys?
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      11-26-2010, 11:43 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themyst View Post
how will this work if say you need to burn out at the drag strip on DRs? Assume disable the feature completely and more benefit for street tire guys?
You can either do the burn out in map0 (pass-thru stock) or toggle to another map that has the feature disabled. Simple.

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      11-26-2010, 11:49 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
You can either do the burn out in map0 (pass-thru stock) or toggle to another map that has the feature disabled. Simple.

shiv
But, when you switch maps, wouldn't you reset autotune?
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      11-26-2010, 11:55 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onesuperboi View Post
But, when you switch maps, wouldn't you reset autotune?
If you are running at the dragstrip, I'll assume that your starting boost and IC values are what they should be

But I suppose we can put in an over-ride. Perhaps disable the feature if the hazard lights are flashing. Easy enough to implement.

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      11-27-2010, 12:20 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
If you are running at the dragstrip, I'll assume that your starting boost and IC values are what they should be

But I suppose we can put in an over-ride. Perhaps disable the feature if the hazard lights are flashing. Easy enough to implement.

Shiv
Cool. I was just thinking that if people go to the drag strip and have to switch maps in order to do a burnout that they'd lose their optimal settings from the autotuning.

I haven't been to a drag strip in my life. I guess I'll have to go one day and represent.
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      11-27-2010, 12:25 AM   #14
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I just thought of something shiv. You say to have your launch control active you turn off the BMW traction control correct? Now what do you do if you just want to melt your tires before you get to the tree and don't want the the procede traction control kicking in?
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      11-27-2010, 12:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
I hope so. At 75k miles on the clock and 200+ runs at the dragstrip, i've been pushing my luck for far too long
No idea how you haven't at least damaged one of your rear CVs..
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      11-27-2010, 09:58 AM   #16
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These features are awesome especially the traction control system if it is designed in a manner that will intervene only is you absolutely need it not consistently bug you on turns. Somewhat like an M-Dynamic mode on a non-M car As far as the Launch Control is concerned, it sounds awesome but how will it be implemented? Hold the brake and floor the gas or does it have the ability to somehow engage a gear suddenly? Also, will the LC aggressiveness (RPM at launch) be a user setting?

Thanks again and keep up the great work!
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      11-27-2010, 10:03 AM   #17
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I do like where this is going.
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      11-27-2010, 12:24 PM   #18
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I wonder how this will effect us AWD guys who rarely have much wheel slip. Should we just disable the Procede traction control system completely?
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      11-27-2010, 12:27 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dzenno View Post
No idea how you haven't at least damaged one of your rear CVs..
for real i broke mine at the track the other day. now in in search for a another axle shaft
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      11-27-2010, 01:36 PM   #20
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Shiv I'm wondering, I've got the AR solenoid based line lock kit but haven't installed it yet...wondering if this TC on procede could get tied into it for launch control for 6MTs? Maybe this'd be a way to get 6MTs to build boost off the line and get more consistent sub 2.0 60'...
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      11-27-2010, 05:32 PM   #21
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- Is every 1 deg of timing 10lb-ft of torque?

- I notice that every-time boost spike the Procede traction control will kick in. Can you demonstrate the boost spike without wheel slippage? It'll be very easy in Mexico.

- Is 15 deg of timing the limit?
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      11-27-2010, 05:59 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamia2super View Post
for real i broke mine at the track the other day. now in in search for a another axle shaft
Get DSS to upgrade your broken set...they do amazing work..
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