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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Vishnu/FFTEC: 738WHP with 6466 Twin Scroll (New World Record)



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      07-27-2013, 12:13 PM   #45
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OMG.

Every time I see a new thread involving something with the VTT3's or the VFFTEC singles, it makes me completely change my ideas as far as where I want to end up with my car.

Looks like I'm going to need a big twin scroll in my life.
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      07-27-2013, 12:21 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainInsano
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdeterman View Post
I think its a bit early to judge the capabilities of either kit yet.
Yes, lets not "feel sorry" for anyone buying a big hp kit for this motor. The more big hp kits we have running around not exploding the more I can sleep at night.
Captain if your motor were to ever grenade would you build a beefy one or through another stock one in and call it a day?
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      07-27-2013, 12:36 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3000GT MR View Post
Captain if your motor were to ever grenade would you build a beefy one or through another stock one in and call it a day?
Build one, of course. There's no going backwards.
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      07-27-2013, 12:46 PM   #48
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Just for the record, the rule of thumb is to not exceed double the wastegate spring's rated pressure. If you want to aim for 28psi, you will need to run at least a 14psi spring for proper control.
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      07-27-2013, 12:48 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Eleventeen View Post
Just for the record, the rule of thumb is to not exceed double the wastegate spring's rated pressure. If you want to aim for 28psi, you will need to run at least a 14psi spring for proper control.
That's the rule of thumb when using a single port wastegate configuration (one port to boost signal, other vented to atmosphere). When using a dual ports configuration (it's new to me too), the ratio can be has high as 4:1. Just not in all cases it seems.
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      07-27-2013, 01:07 PM   #50
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I wonder if you plum the turbo nipple to the top port through the BC and the bottom port off the mani would net you enough deltaP. I've always used 2 separate lines from the same source when using dual port externals. The WG is so much happier in that configuration
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      07-27-2013, 01:07 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
That's the rule of thumb when using a single port wastegate configuration (one port to boost signal, other vented to atmosphere). When using a dual ports configuration (it's new to me too), the ratio can be has high as 4:1. Just not in all cases it seems.
Lot's of trial and error when doing new things. Hopefully changing the WG springs isn't a PITA. I'm impressed that all of that hardware fit at all.
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      07-27-2013, 01:17 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dfjaws View Post
OMG.

Every time I see a new thread involving something with the VTT3's or the VFFTEC singles, it makes me completely change my ideas as far as where I want to end up with my car.

Looks like I'm going to need a big twin scroll in my life.
I think now we've seen a good applies to applies comparison between a twin turbo and a similarly powered twin scroll single turbo. A latter is going to win in every way (spool, top end, packaging, reliability, etc,.) Especially at these higher boost levels were smaller frame turbos don't enjoy the same efficiency benefits. Packaging compromises also hurt twins in this application since you need to use sharp exhaust runner transitions and poor merges to simply get the turbos to fit in the space provided. And fitting a non restrictive turbo inlet pipe on the rear turbo is also a issue. And internal wastegates are also undesirable for high power applications. All in all, one huge compromise after another.

Using a properly sized/configured single turbo, on the other hand, allows you to enjoy the efficiency benefits of a large turbo while still allowing you optimize the rest of the system (manifold, downpipes and wastegate plumbing). The results are pretty evident
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      07-27-2013, 01:50 PM   #53
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Good job Vishnu and FFtec!
Amazing power!
Is it just me, or did the new twin scroll kit gain approx 75 ft-lbs of torque pre-spool at 3500 rpm?!?!

Twin scroll 6466 dyno;


and the previous single scroll 6466 dyno;
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      07-27-2013, 01:59 PM   #54
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it will fit 135i ?
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      07-27-2013, 01:59 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W. View Post
Good job Vishnu and FFtec!
Amazing power!
Is it just me, or did the new twin scroll kit gain approx 75 ft-lbs of torque pre-spool at 3500 rpm?!?!

Twin scroll 6466 dyno;


and the previous single scroll 6466 dyno;
The twin scroll set-up definitely makes more pre-spool torque. But then again, I did start the pull earlier which can have a small effect on spool up. I think going with a stiffer wg spring will help both spool-up and top end power. Looking at the graph, it looks like the WG may be opening up slightly right before full spool. Next week we will find out

Shiv
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      07-27-2013, 02:14 PM   #56
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Nice, either way ya gotta love the extra torque.
What's it like to drive this monster?
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      07-27-2013, 02:24 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W. View Post
Nice, either way ya gotta love the extra torque.
What's it like to drive this monster?
Surprisingly, it's easy to drive. Boost doesn't come on a light switch given the soft wastegate spring. You can hold it at any boost level you want with the appropriate throttle position. At partial throttle, it gives you absolutely no indication of what happens when you go WOT. And at WOT, scenery gets funny and you're back gets pressed to the seat. It's pretty awesome. By far, the tastest street car I've ever driven. Makes my 10.8ET e92 feel like it is driving on 5 cylinders.
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      07-27-2013, 03:25 PM   #58
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" I think there are baby strollers that have had more performance tests done on them than your Stg3 turbo kit."

LOL!
good one, Shiv!

Last edited by Dave W.; 07-27-2013 at 05:01 PM. Reason: Quoting Shiv
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      07-27-2013, 04:02 PM   #59
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Interesting, im am looking at having a single installed on my car, what is the drivability and reliability?
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      07-27-2013, 04:14 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W.
" I think there are baby strollers that have had more performance tests done on them than your Stg3 turbo kit."
LOL!
hahahahahaha
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      07-27-2013, 04:32 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W. View Post
" I think there are baby strollers that have had more performance tests done on them than your Stg3 turbo kit."
LOL!
LMAO!!
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      07-27-2013, 04:33 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
NO please no more coolers! As it is, with your enormous coolers, it takes forever to warm the car up on the dyno. And by the time it's warm, the room is so contaminated with exhaust it defeats the purpose of cool, non-heatsoaked run.

Shiv
There's nothing wrong with appropriate sized oil coolers for the amount of heat rejection that will be required because of the new power levels. A proper thermostat can easily address this, as far as warm up times. I would highly advise one actually. The longer that oil is cold, the longer it could be bypassing the oil filter because of the higher pressure (as a safety to ensure the bearings are properly lubricated).

(All of this assuming this car isn't running an oil thermostat. Either that or it's a super low temp thermostat or it isn't functioning correctly)


REGARDLESS, good work fellas!
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      07-27-2013, 04:42 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akotten View Post
There's nothing wrong with appropriate sized oil coolers for the amount of heat rejection that will be required because of the new power levels. A proper thermostat can easily address this, as far as warm up times. I would highly advise one actually. The longer that oil is cold, the longer it could be bypassing the oil filter because of the higher pressure (as a safety to ensure the bearings are properly lubricated).

(All of this assuming this car isn't running an oil thermostat. Either that or it's a super low temp thermostat or it isn't functioning correctly)


REGARDLESS, good work fellas!
Hehe it's running the 180f STETT thermostat. I'm just obsessed with cooling and Shiv is joking around.

Maybe I should get a little higher temp one though...
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      07-27-2013, 05:06 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainInsano View Post
Hehe it's running the 180f STETT thermostat. I'm just obsessed with cooling and Shiv is joking around.

Maybe I should get a little higher temp one though...
Hmm....There really shouldn't be an issue with warm up temps, although obviously I wouldn't expect them to go anywhere beyond 180 until after a few dyno pulls. I haven't really seen many that are higher than 180-200. I'll be producing some form of an oil cooler kit in the future, with hopes of retaining the factory 240F target. We'll see. I need to do a ton of research yet. So many projects as it is. Busy, busy.
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      07-27-2013, 07:25 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainInsano View Post
I use Motul 300v. I get a pretty good discount on it, which makes it still horrendously expensive. I'm pretty sure they use AMSOIL at FFTEC.
yea you cant beat motul/amsoil. just curious thanks!
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      07-27-2013, 09:42 PM   #66
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Wow. Great job shiv and cap.insano, but what a disaster this thread was lol
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