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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N57 / M57 Turbo Diesel Discussions - 335d > The Dreaded Red Charge hose leak :/



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      10-28-2013, 08:50 PM   #1
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Exclamation The Dreaded Red Charge hose leak :/

It started last Thursday. As usual i started up my car and headed to work. I tried to overtake a truck - and my D took forever to do that. I thought that its just my imagination. In the evening, on my way back, i observed that the car is shifting at much higher revs than usual. Low end torque was non-existent. I tried to push it hard - as it went past the 3000 rpm there was a jerk and i was pushed back into the seat. at last, came home, did my research and immediately popped up the hood of the car and checked for the RED hose - My fear turned out into reality. There was oil everywhere. The red boostpipe was covered in oil and there was a film of oil on the plastic dip tray as well.

Here are a few pictures:








And, very obvious - a cracked VAC hose.


As per the looks of it, the crack seems in the outer shell of the hose, the silicone line itself seems fine. But, there might me minor hairline cracks.

I have ordered the parts and hopefully will get the car fixed this weekend. My only concern is - if i drive it in this condition can there be some damage to turbo(s) or anything else?
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      10-28-2013, 10:18 PM   #2
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The outer part that is cracked is not hose, its just a protective layer. The hose could still be cracked though of course.
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      10-29-2013, 09:01 AM   #3
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The biggest danger of driving with a boost leak is excessive EGT, territory it sounds like you have already explored. BMW should have coded a de-fuel parameter to protect against this, but dunno. I wouldn't drive it. Even going easy you will be running rich with high EGT and pumping lots of smoke and soot everywhere that stuff goes, including back through the EGR.
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      10-29-2013, 09:46 AM   #4
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Its totally "normal", its probably been that way for a while on your car, and its fine to drive. At any given time there are probably thousands of M57 engines on the road with this problem and not a single person has posted about an issue stemming from it. The DDE has EGT protection (even though we dont run anywhere near dangerous levels of EGT even at its peak) and at higher boost levels (where leaking is more likely) the DDE uses information from the MAP sensor and MAF for fueling, if you had significant boost leakage you would get a code.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=281232
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=639210
http://www.bavarian-board.co.uk/foru...ne-replacement
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      10-29-2013, 11:44 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by TorqueAddict View Post
I tried to overtake a truck - and my D took forever to do that. I thought that its just my imagination. In the evening, on my way back, i observed that the car is shifting at much higher revs than usual. Low end torque was non-existent.
Oh yeah, sounds totally "normal" to me.
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      10-29-2013, 11:53 AM   #6
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Oh yeah, sounds totally "normal" to me.
thats not related to the boost hose. I can only assume you didnt click the links, and arent aware of the vacuum line/actuator issue that is also very well known and perfectly describes that situation, as opposed to the other very well known situation of the boost hose which not a single person has related to the under 3k RPM lag.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=710353
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=755942
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      10-29-2013, 11:58 AM   #7
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What difference does it make where the lack of boost comes from if the result is the same?
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      10-29-2013, 12:20 PM   #8
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What difference does it make where the lack of boost comes from if the result is the same?
because the below response is way off base if you think you are chasing a serious boost leak as opposed to a lack of boost. You could chase a boost leak around the red hose for months and never solve the problem if you were stuck on looking for a leak instead of a lack of boost

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The biggest danger of driving with a boost leak is excessive EGT, territory it sounds like you have already explored. BMW should have coded a de-fuel parameter to protect against this, but dunno. I wouldn't drive it. Even going easy you will be running rich with high EGT and pumping lots of smoke and soot everywhere that stuff goes, including back through the EGR.
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      10-29-2013, 12:59 PM   #9
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...if you were stuck on looking for a leak instead of a lack of boost
Getting "stuck" in diagnosis is for amateurs.

Balck stuff doesn't come from vacuum leaks.
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      10-29-2013, 01:16 PM   #10
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Quote:
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Getting "stuck" in diagnosis is for amateurs.
there are a lot of amateur mechanics in this forum

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Balck stuff doesn't come from vacuum leaks.
Have you intentionally missed the point or did you just not read any of the threads I linked? Heres a simple run down:

1) oil buildup on and around hose is likely from a bad lower seal on the red hose, the boost leak is not significant and usually this goes unnoticed for a long time unless the owner checks that area frequently. This is "normal" in that it happens on a lot of M57 engines. No noticeable effect on performance unless it gets bad.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=281232
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=639210
http://www.bavarian-board.co.uk/foru...ne-replacement

2) lack of power below 3k RPM is likely because of a bad actuator or vacuum piping to actuator

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=710353
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=755942

3) the red hose leak hasnt been the source of anyone's lack of power below 3k RPM yet (as far as those posting goes), cracked vacuum piping, failed actuators, and gunked up pressure converters have been the cause of many
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      10-29-2013, 01:22 PM   #11
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I had the dreaded OIL LEAK and it was that the seals were bad and replaced
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      10-29-2013, 01:45 PM   #12
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3) the red hose leak hasnt been the source of anyone's lack of power below 3k RPM yet (as far as those posting goes), cracked vacuum piping, failed actuators, and gunked up pressure converters have been the cause of many
What makes you think the abundant supply of amateur mechanics on this forum (yourself included) represents any more than a fraction of 1% of the 335D (or general diesel-related, for that matter) knowledge out there?
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      10-29-2013, 01:55 PM   #13
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Quote:
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What makes you think the abundant supply of amateur mechanics on this forum (yourself included) represents any more than a fraction of 1% of the 335D knowledge out there?
please, if you are trying to tell us that the red hose leak is the source of his low RPM power loss, just say that so that we can move on from your misinformation on this subject instead of having to hold our breath waiting for you to present some relevant information
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      10-29-2013, 02:11 PM   #14
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Ace damn it, not again!! Please assist us with info that would be nice in your part, we need /want info as to help others and NOT critisize each other, this forum is to help ANYONE, if they is any misinformation please ANYONE bring it forward with EVIDENCE and not BS.
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      10-29-2013, 02:26 PM   #15
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None of my business, but I have noted a higher level of acrimony in these forum threads lately, not just this thread. Wonder what's going on in people's lives? I can divert the thinking by introducing politics and wonder if people are stressing out over their 2014 healthcare.
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      10-29-2013, 03:02 PM   #16
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None of my business, but I have noted a higher level of acrimony in these forum threads lately, not just this thread. Wonder what's going on in people's lives? I can divert the thinking by introducing politics and wonder if people are stressing out over their 2014 healthcare.
Healthcare is the least of our worries in Canada.
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      10-29-2013, 03:54 PM   #17
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Healthcare is the least of our worries in Canada.
lol True!
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      10-29-2013, 03:56 PM   #18
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Quote:
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I had the dreaded OIL LEAK and it was that the seals were bad and replaced
Hey, did you experience any power loss when there was oil leak with your car?
I am asking this because i only checked for this the day when i experienced power loss.
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      10-29-2013, 04:03 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoooper View Post
thats not related to the boost hose. I can only assume you didnt click the links, and arent aware of the vacuum line/actuator issue that is also very well known and perfectly describes that situation, as opposed to the other very well known situation of the boost hose which not a single person has related to the under 3k RPM lag.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=710353
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=755942
Hey Hooper, now, i virtually have no boost. the car is shifting strange. I have even see the needle stall at a particular RPM and then go forward. So according to you, the issue might be the Actuators, or pressure controllers, or maybe even both??
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      10-29-2013, 04:49 PM   #20
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Hey Hooper, now, i virtually have no boost. the car is shifting strange. I have even see the needle stall at a particular RPM and then go forward. So according to you, the issue might be the Actuators, or pressure controllers, or maybe even both??
That sounds extreme, havent heard that before. Can you take a video by any chance? The symptoms you first described, with the slow acceleration to 3000 RPM and then strong afterwards point to an actuator issue (actuator, converter, or vacuum tubes). I wonder if the actuator issue could confuse the DDE and cause strange shifting. Do you have a code scanner you can use? You might have a code that isnt throwing a light.
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      10-30-2013, 08:21 AM   #21
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Torque I discovered it when we installed the WAGNER IC but never felt it.
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      10-30-2013, 09:07 AM   #22
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That sounds extreme, havent heard that before. Can you take a video by any chance? The symptoms you first described, with the slow acceleration to 3000 RPM and then strong afterwards point to an actuator issue (actuator, converter, or vacuum tubes). I wonder if the actuator issue could confuse the DDE and cause strange shifting. Do you have a code scanner you can use? You might have a code that isnt throwing a light.
ill try taking a video. I don't have a code scanner :/
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