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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Wash, Wax, Detailing and Cosmetic protection/repairs > Detailing 101: Common Question and Answers, What and Where to buy stuff + Technique



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      06-19-2007, 01:16 PM   #177
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Originally Posted by rtjones View Post

Full detail every year:
- wash/dry
- clay
- Z-AIO
- Z5/ZFX
- Z6
- Z2
- Z8
- interior trim, leather

Mini detail every year (alternating 6 months):

- wash/dry
- Z5/ZFX
- Z6
- Z2
- Z8
I think it shoud go like this,

Full detail every year:
- wash/dry
- clay
- Z-AIO
- Z5
- Z6
- Z2/ZFX
- Z8
- interior trim, leather

Mini detail every year (alternating 6 months):

- wash/dry
- Z5/ZFX
- Z6
- Z2/ZFX
- Z8
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      06-19-2007, 01:19 PM   #178
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Interesting. So Z6 is a quick detailer. Why would you mix it with the ZFX accelerating agent?
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      06-19-2007, 01:21 PM   #179
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Interesting. So Z6 is a quick detailer. Why would you mix it with the ZFX accelerating agent?
Sorry, I put the ZFX on the wrong spot. I already corrected.
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      06-19-2007, 01:25 PM   #180
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I see. As I understand, the ZFX is needed only if you plan on adding another coat after the one you're working on. So if at the beginning of the detail, you intend to apply 3 coats of sealant, you would put ZFX in the first 2, but it is not needed for the third, because the third is the last, with no additional coats to follow.

Now if you're planning on applying 3 coats of Z2, and you already mixed the Z2/ZFX, then go ahead and use it for all 3 coats. But for my plan, I'll mix the Z5 with ZFX, because I plan on adding a 2nd coat of sealant, the Z2. But then the Z2 will go on alone - no ZFX required.
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      06-19-2007, 01:38 PM   #181
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I see. As I understand, the ZFX is needed only if you plan on adding another coat after the one you're working on. So if at the beginning of the detail, you intend to apply 3 coats of sealant, you would put ZFX in the first 2, but it is not needed for the third, because the third is the last, with no additional coats to follow.

Now if you're planning on applying 3 coats of Z2, and you already mixed the Z2/ZFX, then go ahead and use it for all 3 coats. But for my plan, I'll mix the Z5 with ZFX, because I plan on adding a 2nd coat of sealant, the Z2. But then the Z2 will go on alone - no ZFX required.
May be you're right. I thought that ZFX is the bonding for the coat the you're applying, not the next one. Sorry for confusing. David, could you confirm please. Thank you.
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      06-19-2007, 02:32 PM   #182
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May be you're right. I thought that ZFX is the bonding for the coat the you're applying, not the next one. Sorry for confusing. David, could you confirm please. Thank you.
It's technically both. ZFX is used to accelerate the curing of the coat you are applying. It also acts as a bonding agent for 10 subsequent non ZFX coats, or for the next 6 months, whichever occurs first.

The way you recommended above is incorrect. ZAIO, Z5, Z6, then Z2/ZFX will not work if all done in the same day. Why? Because the Z5 has not cured (non ZFX Zaino needs 24 hours to cure before another layer can be applied, regardless of whether you are using ZFX with the subsequent layer). The way I would do it is ZAIO, Z5/ZFX, Z6, and then Z2(no ZFX).
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      06-19-2007, 02:55 PM   #183
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I think I'm getting the hang of this! My plan (post #176) is correct.

Can't wait to give my '95 VW Passat the full treatment this weekend. It's never been clayed, it's going to significantly improve with the full detail...

I'm adding $175 to it's selling price, due to the detail I'm giving it. Seems fair.
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      06-19-2007, 03:12 PM   #184
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I think I'm getting the hang of this! My plan (post #176) is correct.

Can't wait to give my '95 VW Passat the full treatment this weekend. It's never been clayed, it's going to significantly improve with the full detail...

I'm adding $175 to it's selling price, due to the detail I'm giving it. Seems fair.
Good luck with your sell.
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      06-19-2007, 03:36 PM   #185
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Good luck with your sell.
Thanks, dude. I apprecate that.
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      06-22-2007, 07:28 PM   #186
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Becoming familiar with clay...

Started claying my 2nd car, and am getting more familiar with technique. I prefer using much larger pieces, no smaller than 1/10th a bar. And I think I was a bit timid in my pressure. I applied a bit more pressure, and it seemed to go fine.

David, one thing I notice. I can clay a given 2'x2' area for a full minute, and it is as clean as possible. No rough portions at all, no scraping sound, nice and clean. Yet when I rub my fingers over it after drying, I still feel tiny tiny granules. Is this expected? Do I need a finer clay? The clay I'm now using is labeled "fine". Or is this just a matter of preference?

One thing I just did was use clay on my windows. WOW! On a 12.5 year old VW, I don't think they were that clean brand new!
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      06-23-2007, 02:33 PM   #187
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Started claying my 2nd car, and am getting more familiar with technique. I prefer using much larger pieces, no smaller than 1/10th a bar. And I think I was a bit timid in my pressure. I applied a bit more pressure, and it seemed to go fine.

David, one thing I notice. I can clay a given 2'x2' area for a full minute, and it is as clean as possible. No rough portions at all, no scraping sound, nice and clean. Yet when I rub my fingers over it after drying, I still feel tiny tiny granules. Is this expected? Do I need a finer clay? The clay I'm now using is labeled "fine". Or is this just a matter of preference?

One thing I just did was use clay on my windows. WOW! On a 12.5 year old VW, I don't think they were that clean brand new!
Once you get the hang of claying you can definitely move up to using bigger pieces of clay for multiple sections. Cutting smaller pieces for different sections is good for beginners so they don't cause any marring.

In terms of the roughness after claying, it probably does need a bit more claying to get 100% smooth would be my guess. The clay itself sounds fine.
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      06-23-2007, 04:03 PM   #188
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Once you get the hang of claying you can definitely move up to using bigger pieces of clay for multiple sections. Cutting smaller pieces for different sections is good for beginners so they don't cause any marring.

In terms of the roughness after claying, it probably does need a bit more claying to get 100% smooth would be my guess. The clay itself sounds fine.
Just so I'm clear, the very very fine roughness I feel even after claying is not a matter of the 'grade' of clay? In other words, 'fine', vs 'very fine' (does clay come in different degrees of 'fine'?), but is rather that I'm not claying long enough?

One thing I just learned, I used Mother's clay in a pinch, and it was horrible! I will never use Mother's clay again. It fell apart, was not cohesive, and was not as effective as the Clay Magic I first used.

EDIT: Just learned the following: For the brand 'Clay Magic', medium grade (red) removes moderate to heavy contaminants; fine grade (blue) removes light to moderate contaminants. So that makes sense. I don't think the fine grade (blue) is fine enough to remove the tiny granules I am feeling. What I would need is a very fine grade - don't know if that is even manufactured.
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      06-23-2007, 10:40 PM   #189
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So I've put on a coat of Zaino AIO, but had problems. When I used ZAIO for the first time, which is the last time I used it, I found it a little difficult to rub off. Now I know why. I used too much. Today, when putting it on my '95 VW, the white haze was much heavier, though it also may have been that the car is dark graphite, and the haze is easier to see. In any case, I do think I put on more this time. I could not get it off. I rubbed as hard as I could with a microfiber towel, and it would not come off. I didn't know what to do! I tried spraying it with Z6, and fortunately, it came off, though it still required considerable effort.

Hopefully this helps someone who is about use ZAIO for the first time - if you put on too much, it will be harder to remove, and you may need Z6 to get it off.

But the car looks so good right now, I don't really think I want to go through the effort of adding 2 coats of Z2/ZFX. I'm spent, and the car looks great as is!!
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      06-24-2007, 02:25 PM   #190
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I hope at least someone is able to benefit from my firist-time (or two) experience with Zaino.

I HAVE JUST DISCOVERED ZAINO!!!

So I didn't think I would put on a coat of Z2, as I'm selling my car, and after claying and AIO, I thought that was plenty. Well, here is a Sunday late morning, and I went ahead with the Z2.

One thing I have not seen mentioned in this entire thread that I believe is key - the applicator MUST BE KEPT DAMP. Without a damp applicator, the product cannot be spread evenly, nor can it be applied in extremely small quantities, which is a must with Zaino. As is known from my prior post, I could not get the AIO off last night without using Z6. I don't think that is the method intended to be used. I am no absolutely positive the cause was too much product.

I just Z2'd my car, and I don't think I used 2 teaspoons for the entire car - this is accurate. I started by soaking my applicator, then squeezing out all of the water and just dabbing maybe 5-7 tiny specs of Z2 on the applicator. I rubbed it into a panel, shot the applicator with a squirt or two of water, and did the next panel. I may have used only 1 teaspoon for the entire car.

The magic came when I removed the haze and buffed the finish with a microfiber towel. Less than moderate pressure produced the best finish I've experienced yet with Z2. I'm so glad I applied this coat, and learned this technique, as now I can apply it to my 335i when it comes in.

Funny that in none of the detailing threads I've read, does it mention the damp applicator. Or suggest a spray bottle to keep the pad damp. Hope this helps someone.

NICE!!!!
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      06-24-2007, 09:10 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by rtjones View Post
Just so I'm clear, the very very fine roughness I feel even after claying is not a matter of the 'grade' of clay? In other words, 'fine', vs 'very fine' (does clay come in different degrees of 'fine'?), but is rather that I'm not claying long enough?

One thing I just learned, I used Mother's clay in a pinch, and it was horrible! I will never use Mother's clay again. It fell apart, was not cohesive, and was not as effective as the Clay Magic I first used.

EDIT: Just learned the following: For the brand 'Clay Magic', medium grade (red) removes moderate to heavy contaminants; fine grade (blue) removes light to moderate contaminants. So that makes sense. I don't think the fine grade (blue) is fine enough to remove the tiny granules I am feeling. What I would need is a very fine grade - don't know if that is even manufactured.
Fine vs medium clay does not determine the type of particles the clay will pick up from your paint (fine vs medium sized). It is referring to how abrasive the clay is. Medium clay is more agressive and will pick up more junk faster. It will also create marring on your paint. Meduim clay is usually used in bodyshops to remove overspray from panels.

In terms of the particles you are still feeling. I think it is because you need to clay a bit more.

In terms of the mothers clay, it's never fallen apart on me. I like it. Maybe you got a bad bar. I do like the clay magic blue as well.
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      06-24-2007, 09:16 PM   #192
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Originally Posted by rtjones View Post
So I've put on a coat of Zaino AIO, but had problems. When I used ZAIO for the first time, which is the last time I used it, I found it a little difficult to rub off. Now I know why. I used too much. Today, when putting it on my '95 VW, the white haze was much heavier, though it also may have been that the car is dark graphite, and the haze is easier to see. In any case, I do think I put on more this time. I could not get it off. I rubbed as hard as I could with a microfiber towel, and it would not come off. I didn't know what to do! I tried spraying it with Z6, and fortunately, it came off, though it still required considerable effort.

Hopefully this helps someone who is about use ZAIO for the first time - if you put on too much, it will be harder to remove, and you may need Z6 to get it off.

But the car looks so good right now, I don't really think I want to go through the effort of adding 2 coats of Z2/ZFX. I'm spent, and the car looks great as is!!
Yeah, use all Z products sparingly. Also let the AIO dry before buffing. Did you do this?
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      06-24-2007, 10:08 PM   #193
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Yeah, use all Z products sparingly. Also let the AIO dry before buffing. Did you do this?
Yes, it was dry. I conditioned the seats and door panels while it dried - about 30 min passed. I believe I just used too much.

I noticed there are some very faint water spots on the car that I did not noticed before. I've already AIO'd and Z2'd the car, so I'm not going to worry about it now. The paint looks amazing. I think if I were keeping the car, at some point I'd use ZPC and a PC polisher, and then Z2 again. But I'm not going to worry about it.

I know the spots are not from me, as I wash my cars from a nozzle in my garage that is fed by a water softener.

Is ZPC the right choice to remove the water spots? The AIO may have worked with a polisher, maybe.
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      06-24-2007, 11:33 PM   #194
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Yes, it was dry. I conditioned the seats and door panels while it dried - about 30 min passed. I believe I just used too much.

I noticed there are some very faint water spots on the car that I did not noticed before. I've already AIO'd and Z2'd the car, so I'm not going to worry about it now. The paint looks amazing. I think if I were keeping the car, at some point I'd use ZPC and a PC polisher, and then Z2 again. But I'm not going to worry about it.

I know the spots are not from me, as I wash my cars from a nozzle in my garage that is fed by a water softener.

Is ZPC the right choice to remove the water spots? The AIO may have worked with a polisher, maybe.
It depends on how stubborn the spots are ZPC with either a polishing or cutting pad may be enough. In some cases something more aggressive than ZPC may be needed. It really all depends.
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      06-28-2007, 12:41 AM   #195
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David,
thanks for the great info on the forum. I just recently bought most of the materials that you suggested including the pc. Quick question regarding the z-pc. I have minor swirls in my 335 sedan. Do you think the zpc alone will help remove them (with the use of the pc)? Also, which foam pad with the pc do you suggest i use if I only use the zpc to remove the swirls? I've read on previous replies that you suggest different types of foam pads with different solutions, but what do you think I should do? I bought the yellow and orange pads from pakshak that you recommended. Your reply is greatly appreciated.
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      06-28-2007, 09:54 AM   #196
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David,
thanks for the great info on the forum. I just recently bought most of the materials that you suggested including the pc. Quick question regarding the z-pc. I have minor swirls in my 335 sedan. Do you think the zpc alone will help remove them (with the use of the pc)? Also, which foam pad with the pc do you suggest i use if I only use the zpc to remove the swirls? I've read on previous replies that you suggest different types of foam pads with different solutions, but what do you think I should do? I bought the yellow and orange pads from pakshak that you recommended. Your reply is greatly appreciated.
Thanks for the kind words. I'm glad you found the thread helpful.

As to your situation. The rule of thumb is to start with the least aggressive pad and product and work your way up from there. In your case, start with ZPC and a polishing pad. You can step up to a cutting pad if the polishing pad does not help.
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      08-23-2007, 01:50 PM   #197
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Hey David...

First i want to thank you for this amazing tutorial. Its just great and you bet ill be following this on my first car wash.

Anyway, i just got my car last week and this weekend will be my first wash. I really wanted to order the Zaino stuff but i would never be here on time for saturday and next weekend is just not happening (lot going on). So i did a little bit of research and looked over your topic and a couple of other ones and got this list of stuff.

Is this good to hold me off till i get the zaino Kit?! please advise.

Okay... for my first wash this is what i got:


Meguiar's Gold Class Car Soap
Meguiar's Tire Hot Shine
F21 Turtle Wax Interior/Leather Care
F21 Wheel Cleaner

2 Microfiber Wash Mitts (1 for top/glass and 1 for bottom of car)
2 Microfiber Application Pads (For wheels)
1 Microfiber Drying towel (9' feet)
1 Soft Brush for Wheels
1 Microfiber Mitt for interior detailing


Again.. I want to get the zaino products soon but i just wanted to get the car washed as i can't really wait for all the stuff to be shipped.
Some comments on the stuff please... Do i need anything else? Replace anything?!
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      08-23-2007, 03:06 PM   #198
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Hey David...

First i want to thank you for this amazing tutorial. Its just great and you bet ill be following this on my first car wash.

Anyway, i just got my car last week and this weekend will be my first wash. I really wanted to order the Zaino stuff but i would never be here on time for saturday and next weekend is just not happening (lot going on). So i did a little bit of research and looked over your topic and a couple of other ones and got this list of stuff.

Is this good to hold me off till i get the zaino Kit?! please advise.

Okay... for my first wash this is what i got:


Meguiar's Gold Class Car Soap
Meguiar's Tire Hot Shine
F21 Turtle Wax Interior/Leather Care
F21 Wheel Cleaner

2 Microfiber Wash Mitts (1 for top/glass and 1 for bottom of car)
2 Microfiber Application Pads (For wheels)
1 Microfiber Drying towel (9' feet)
1 Soft Brush for Wheels
1 Microfiber Mitt for interior detailing


Again.. I want to get the zaino products soon but i just wanted to get the car washed as i can't really wait for all the stuff to be shipped.
Some comments on the stuff please... Do i need anything else? Replace anything?!
The products you purchased are fine for use. One recommendation I would make is to return the microfiber wash mitts and purchase genuine sheepskin mitts. Reason being is that the fibers on MF mitts are too short. Any dirt that gets trapped will drag across your paint and will cause marring.
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