E90Post
 


GT Haus
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > Regional Forums > UK > Is the 325D dead?



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      11-20-2007, 12:56 PM   #23
Ulrikgm
Private
3
Rep
99
Posts

 
Drives: 525d E61 LCI msport
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Denmark

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikem View Post
Melted G`box and and dismounted rear sub-frame.

Ulrikgm, if thats right then things have really moved on since mine was mapped by DMS last Dec, then again in Feb. It was their programmer who warned me that taking it further would sacrifice longevity. I don`t know anything about engine internals but I do know the 325 and 330 both have variable geometry turbos but have different part No`s for the engine, cyl. heads and clutches as I looked into this last year.
It might be asking for trouble to push it that fare. DMS could very well be right but on the other hand Hartge is not just any tuning company.

Ulrik
Appreciate 0
      11-20-2007, 03:19 PM   #24
dagjohnsen
Second Lieutenant
4
Rep
276
Posts

 
Drives: BMW E92 325dM Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Hartge tunes the 325d to 271 horsepower, and thats conservatively rated.
591 NM. ESS says 280 hp and 600 NM.
I have talked to one guy at Hartge and he told me the 325d and 330d engines are the same. Hartge also has a 231 hp alternative.

Hartge does it in two steps, first to original 330d map, and then up to chipped level, probably because none of the tuners including Hartge (and with an exception of ESS) dont know where the original programs has its limitations and torque-blocks (sorry, dont know the proper english word)

ESS delivers 238 hp at the rear wheels, thats 280 engine horsepower if a 15% loss is calculated. (280 hp minus 15% equals 238hp) They also claim 600 NM.

I will dyno my car next week. Will get back with the numbers!
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 12:03 AM   #25
dxb335d
The Tarmac Terrorist
dxb335d's Avatar
England
381
Rep
29,288
Posts

 
Drives: E46 M3 CS
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: ''Fandango Towers''

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Guys is the 325d a 3.0 turbo also then, same as the 330d?
__________________
M3 gone .... But I now have a M3 CS
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 01:48 AM   #26
mikem
Lieutenant Colonel
29
Rep
1,549
Posts

 
Drives: Z4M
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

Yes but with a smaller turbo. Just like the 318d is a 320d engine but with smaller turbo.
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:38 AM   #27
NFS
Major General
NFS's Avatar
United Kingdom
112
Rep
9,216
Posts

 
Drives: 335i m-sport LCI
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dxb335d View Post
Guys is the 325d a 3.0 turbo also then, same as the 330d?
The 325d and 330d both use 3.0 litre M57TU2D30 engine.

Best information on BMW engines is here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_BMW_engines
__________________
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:55 AM   #28
dagjohnsen
Second Lieutenant
4
Rep
276
Posts

 
Drives: BMW E92 325dM Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikem View Post
Yes but with a smaller turbo. Just like the 318d is a 320d engine but with smaller turbo.
Hi Mikem,

I see you have info regarding different turbo sizes. Do you have details?
According to Hartge the turbos are 100% the same on 325d and 330d.

Dag
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 05:00 AM   #29
dxb335d
The Tarmac Terrorist
dxb335d's Avatar
England
381
Rep
29,288
Posts

 
Drives: E46 M3 CS
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: ''Fandango Towers''

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed View Post
The 325d and 330d both use 3.0 litre M57TU2D30 engine.

Best information on BMW engines is here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_BMW_engines
Thanks NFS
__________________
M3 gone .... But I now have a M3 CS
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 06:45 AM   #30
ChrisMWard
Captain
United Kingdom
9
Rep
686
Posts

 
Drives: E93 320d M Sport, E81 116d SE
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Epsom UK

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2006 120d SE  [0.00]
2007 335d A M Sport  [0.00]
1998 M3 Evo  [0.00]
2002 330d Sport  [0.00]
2004 330d Sport  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dagjohnsen View Post
Hi Mikem,

I see you have info regarding different turbo sizes. Do you have details?
According to Hartge the turbos are 100% the same on 325d and 330d.

Dag
With the max torque occuring at such low rpm (1300) I would suspect the 325d to have a smaller turbo. Best to look at the parts list.

Regards

Chris
__________________
Previously: 2007 335D MSport E90 Le Mans Blue, 2004 330D A Sport Silver Grey, 2002 330D A Sport Saphire Black, 2001 320D SE Touring Titanium Silver, 1998 M3 Evo Techno Violet, 1996 328i Sport Montreal Blue, 1994 325i Coupe Red, 1989 325i Sport 2 door Dolphin Grey,1986 325i SE 4 door Lachs
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 09:57 AM   #31
dagjohnsen
Second Lieutenant
4
Rep
276
Posts

 
Drives: BMW E92 325dM Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisMWard View Post
With the max torque occuring at such low rpm (1300) I would suspect the 325d to have a smaller turbo. Best to look at the parts list.

Regards

Chris

I think the max torque at 1300 rpm is just a hype to try to tell people how flexible the engine is.

During driving the max torque seems to be around 1800 rpm, and clearly not at 1300 rpm.

I think the turbo is the same as the 330d, and Hartge have told me that this is the case 100% sure.
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 11:46 AM   #32
330cdsport
Right Responsible
330cdsport's Avatar
United Kingdom
29
Rep
1,640
Posts

 
Drives: AW F21 M135i
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: N. Ireland

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Took a look at RealOEM and both engines (325d and 330d) use the same turbo?!?!?!

325d

330d

The 318d and 320d however have different turbos.
__________________
Last: 330cd Sport - Silver Grey, 335d M Sport Coupe, F10 535d M Sport.
Current: AW F21 M135i, Coral Red, Pro Nav, Vis, HK, & Clunky Adaptive Suspension
Current: X5 XDrive 35d M Sport - Black Sapphire, lots of toys.
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 01:38 PM   #33
dagjohnsen
Second Lieutenant
4
Rep
276
Posts

 
Drives: BMW E92 325dM Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 330cdsport View Post
Took a look at RealOEM and both engines (325d and 330d) use the same turbo?!?!?!

325d

330d

The 318d and 320d however have different turbos.
Then the tuners are not kidding me
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 01:39 PM   #34
scooba0010
Colonel
scooba0010's Avatar
United Kingdom
39
Rep
2,217
Posts

 
Drives: F32 430D-MOTORSPORT
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: UK

iTrader: (1)

kevin bird from hartge ref 325d

I have enquired at birds the hartge uk agent .kevin bird there technical director with 30+ years exp of tuning bmw says its identical for 325 /330 d just a few mods on the map .now the but its 1100 plus vat for a new hartge remap and 271 bhp is the figure he is quoting also he highly reccomends a LSD god knows how much that adds to the mod ,so the question is who is correct ??
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 02:38 PM   #35
Ulrikgm
Private
3
Rep
99
Posts

 
Drives: 525d E61 LCI msport
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Denmark

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by scooba0010 View Post
I have enquired at birds the hartge uk agent .kevin bird there technical director with 30+ years exp of tuning bmw says its identical for 325 /330 d just a few mods on the map .now the but its 1100 plus vat for a new hartge remap and 271 bhp is the figure he is quoting also he highly reccomends a LSD god knows how much that adds to the mod ,so the question is who is correct ??
I think maybe we can conclude that if you are going to chip tune your car the 325d is a good choice. You save 4000 Euro over the 330d which is about equal to an M-package.

Dag How is your mileage in your 325d. Is is a 2007 or 2008 model?
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 02:47 PM   #36
Hotcoupe
Major General
Hotcoupe's Avatar
United Kingdom
70
Rep
6,105
Posts

 
Drives: Don't know yet!
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
scooba0010 I have enquired at birds the hartge uk agent .kevin bird there technical director with 30+ years exp of tuning bmw says its identical for 325 /330 d just a few mods on the map .now the but its 1100 plus vat for a new hartge remap and 271 bhp is the figure he is quoting also he highly reccomends a LSD god knows how much that adds to the mod ,so the question is who is correct ??
Geez nearly £1300 for a remap,that's big bucks.
Do you get anything else thrown in for that,like a new set of alloys.
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 02:48 PM   #37
E92Fan
Moderator
E92Fan's Avatar
United Kingdom
102
Rep
5,492
Posts

 
Drives: .
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: .

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by scooba0010 View Post
I have enquired at birds the hartge uk agent .kevin bird there technical director with 30+ years exp of tuning bmw says its identical for 325 /330 d just a few mods on the map .now the but its 1100 plus vat for a new hartge remap and 271 bhp is the figure he is quoting also he highly reccomends a LSD god knows how much that adds to the mod ,so the question is who is correct ??
Kevin is quite correct. The 325d and 330d uses exactly the same turbo, but run different maps. Kevin is also correct in saying that the Hartge map can liberate around 270bhp - which is fantastic! What that means is that it is probably better to buy a 325d loaded than a 330d, then remap the 325d to 270hp!!

And yes, the LSD will make a MASSIVE difference to the driving characteristics of the car... I'll report on the effects of the LSD (and anti-roll bars) once they've been installed tomorrow!
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 02:54 PM   #38
Ulrikgm
Private
3
Rep
99
Posts

 
Drives: 525d E61 LCI msport
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Denmark

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hotcoupe View Post
Geez nearly £1300 for a remap,that's big bucks.
Do you get anything else thrown in for that,like a new set of alloys.
You could go with ESS. Half price

Ulrik
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:09 PM   #39
Hotcoupe
Major General
Hotcoupe's Avatar
United Kingdom
70
Rep
6,105
Posts

 
Drives: Don't know yet!
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
Ulrikgm Quote:
You could go with ESS. Half price

Ulrik
Failing that,go somewhere else and save a grand!
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:18 PM   #40
Ireland
Private
Ireland's Avatar
Ireland
0
Rep
52
Posts

 
Drives: 2006 Bmw 330i
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Ennis, Ireland

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2006 330i SE  [0.00]
2006 330i SE  [0.00]
ya the 323d is going to be amazing i would definately prefer it to a 325d purely because less turbo-Lag that was the only thing i didnt like about my 320d that and the diesel rumble
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:25 PM   #41
nagge
Swedish user
nagge's Avatar
Sweden
2
Rep
267
Posts

 
Drives: 06' E90 330dA
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Sweden

iTrader: (0)

ESS has no problem maxing out your engine if you would like it. The only problem is that the rest of the drivetrain might not handle the extra torque all that well. When I visited them with my 330d they simply asked me what I was looking for: Max performance but with possible reliability issues or a "safe" map within the specifications of the gearbox. I know a swedish 335d owner who are currently in contact with ESS about tuning his car to 400bhp (thats with added intercooler and other stuff).

What I'm really saying is that numbers arent that hard to achieve, but getting numbers while still having reliability is another task...

ESS for instance changes your shift-pattern for the steptronic to handle the added torque.
__________________
E90 330dA | SG | Remapped | Blacklines | Matte black kidney grill | M3 Steering wheel | ‹mnitza Predator ICE LED Angel eyes | 18" M5 reps | ESS Tuning
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:42 PM   #42
Hotcoupe
Major General
Hotcoupe's Avatar
United Kingdom
70
Rep
6,105
Posts

 
Drives: Don't know yet!
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
nagge ESS has no problem maxing out your engine if you would like it. The only problem is that the rest of the drivetrain might not handle the extra torque all that well. When I visited them with my 330d they simply asked me what I was looking for: Max performance but with possible reliability issues or a "safe" map within the specifications of the gearbox. I know a swedish 335d owner who are currently in contact with ESS about tuning his car to 400bhp (thats with added intercooler and other stuff).

What I'm really saying is that numbers arent that hard to achieve, but getting numbers while still having reliability is another task...

ESS for instance changes your shift-pattern for the steptronic to handle the added torque.
nagge,I'm not planning on doing anything drastic,nothing that would impact on the drivetrain etc.
The remap will not be so aggressive to cause any problems.

400bhp is an awesome figure,I would hope a brakes upgrade would be included amongst 'the other stuff'.

Interesting site the ESS one,and I particularly liked the following:

Will ESS supercharger systems affect the new car warranty?

Yes, the original manufacterer's warranty will be void if the damaged part is caused as a direct result of the supercharger system. The burden of proof is on the original manufacturer. Only warranty on components directly affected can be void. ESS Supplemental Powertrain Warranty is available and will cover any affected factory components for the remaining term of the Original Vehicle Manufacturer's New Car Warranty (up to 4yr/50.000 miles).


What is the ESS Supplemental Powertrain Warranty program?

ESS Supplemental Powertrain Warranty will cover any affected factory components for the remaining term of the Original Vehicle Manufacturer's New Car Warranty (up to 4yr/50.000 miles) following the same conditions and exclusions as the Original Vehicle Manufacturer's New Car Warranty.
ESS Supplemental Powertrain Warranty can only be purchased with the purchase of a new ESS supercharger system directly from us or one of our authorized dealers.
ESS Supplemental Powertrain Warranty is only available in Norway, USA and Canada.
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 03:45 PM   #43
scooba0010
Colonel
scooba0010's Avatar
United Kingdom
39
Rep
2,217
Posts

 
Drives: F32 430D-MOTORSPORT
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: UK

iTrader: (1)

325 -- 330 d

So i think we have decided the engines are the same except the maps .what about gearboxes etc ?? because i am certain that i read there is a difference between the 325 /330 does any one know if thats correct thanks
Appreciate 0
      11-21-2007, 04:28 PM   #44
Ulrikgm
Private
3
Rep
99
Posts

 
Drives: 525d E61 LCI msport
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Denmark

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by scooba0010 View Post
So i think we have decided the engines are the same except the maps .what about gearboxes etc ?? because i am certain that i read there is a difference between the 325 /330 does any one know if thats correct thanks
The Manual gearbox also seems to be the same according to RealOEM but NOT the auto:

Manual

325d:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...41&hg=23&fg=05

330d
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...36&hg=23&fg=05


Auto:

325d:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...51&hg=24&fg=05

330d:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...36&hg=24&fg=05
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:19 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST