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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Helix Attaché 335i (Auto) VS PROcede 1.47 335i (6 spd) VIDEO



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      12-07-2007, 09:02 AM   #67
Sapphire135i
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Man are you guys hating, I was in the camera car recording(IN THE MT E90 WITH 1.47). On the first run the auto did downshift into second because the AT was at to low rpm, the next run was in 3rd gear they gunned it and even I was surprised I was wondering if he was really in third I look down and he is..... So the video is real, why would artz friend drive slow on perpose. We wanted to see what the difference was and we got it

As for the people saying find an E92 with auto we don't know anyone with an auto that is willing to do this...

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      12-07-2007, 09:04 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyBimmerDude View Post
Well that is interesting then because I've been on this site for a year now and I've only seen one other car with 1.47 that dyno'd sub 300whp. Especially with 93? Come on
No offense--but you need to do some research. It is well known that Mustang dynos read much lower than other types.
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      12-07-2007, 09:10 AM   #69
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I'm going to reserve my commnets until you guys run cars with the same trannys.
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      12-07-2007, 09:11 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by Sapphire135i View Post
Man are you guys hating, I was in the camera car recording. On the first run the auto did downshift into second because the AT was at to low rpm, the next run was in 3rd gear they gunned it and even I was surprised I was wondering if he was really in third I look down and he is..... So the video is real, why would artz friend drive slow on perpose. We wanted to see what the difference was and we got it

As for the people saying find an E92 with auto we don't know how anyone with an auto that is willing to do this...
You don't have to find another auto... just put the HELIX in the manual and the PROcede in the auto and show us another video.

Seems fair, eh?
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      12-07-2007, 09:32 AM   #71
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I'm not conviced that this video is real.
I could accept that a certain mod would make the 335i quicker than procede but not at this rate!!

Considering the car equiped with 1.47 was giving full throttle , the competitor car should have a 500+ horsepower to jump ahead like that.

Just my opinion...
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      12-07-2007, 09:41 AM   #72
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Guys, let me know when you're going to do some runs next. Either it be at the track or on the highway, I want to be apart of it. I want to see how well the JB2Rx without the 96 octane and the R switched off, does against the Attache and PROcede (whichever version).

Just FYI, I have 17" stock all-season RFTs non-ZSP with the Steptronic and no other performance mods.

I'll also be willing to go to Helix to do the dyno with you guys too!
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      12-07-2007, 09:46 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panoz View Post
I'm not conviced that this video is real.
I could accept that a certain mod would make the 335i quicker than procede but not at this rate!!

Considering the car equiped with 1.47 was giving full throttle , the competitor car should have a 500+ horsepower to jump ahead like that.

Just my opinion...
+1 Come on give me a break! I've got V2 Procede (AT) and I'm in NJ. I'd be up for a run and then we can find out if this real which I doubt.
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      12-07-2007, 09:50 AM   #74
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Helix FTW!
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      12-07-2007, 09:58 AM   #75
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Art, for future references(and you do this a lot) LEAVE ME AN EFFIN VOICEMAIL when you call me. Had I known this was going to happen, I would have been out there.

Secondly, it seems theres a lot of haters out there all of a sudden. Why?

I cant watch the video because Im at work so I cant comment on it until I actually watch it. That being said, its just a video and you have to take them with a grain of salt. It could have been driver error, it could have been tires slipping, it could have been the tune. Who knows?

This whole dyno thing is getting out of hand as well. I would love to get to a dyno and get a few runs in with my now corrected tune. However, I work for a living. For those of you that dont work or go to school, that means my weeks are pretty filled up with things a bit more important than trying to appease the masses. My weekends are my only free time and its now the holiday season. People are just busy, can you all understand that? When Helix has the ability to have me come back in and dyno my car Ill be there. Its a whole lot easier said than done.

I just dont understand the mentality here sometimes.
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      12-07-2007, 10:03 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyBimmerDude View Post
Well that is interesting then because I've been on this site for a year now and I've only seen one other car with 1.47 that dyno'd sub 300whp. Especially with 93? Come on
Its OK. We understand you are upset. If you want to sell your PROcede for an Attache too I'd say do it. By the way, it's a mustang Dyno, EXPECT significantly lower numbers. The guy is telling you the comparison dyno of the procede and attache was done on the same car, same day, same dyno. The attache had 20whp over the procede v1.47. Whats hard to believe here? Remember how badly walkedu took jonmartin when walkedu had v2.0 and jon had v1.47. Not to mention this is a video, so the percieved distance of how badly the procede got beat is somewhat distorted. You sound like a f***ing 10 year old. Move on and stfu Point here is the procede was outperformed by a considerable margin. Also, the procede car has a passenger... attache has 20 whp HP and one less passenger over the procede car and that is exactly how bad he will get beat. had there been no passenger the helix car would have still won by a significant margin, but certainly not as bad.
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      12-07-2007, 10:04 AM   #77
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I'd like to see some 6MT vs 6MT or auto vs auto runs, but it was entertaining if nothing else. I'm very interested in the helix tune, but its kind of hard to believe that it would put that much on a 1.47 car, regardless of the difference in transmissions. Also, I don't see why the 6MT and the auto need to be in the same gear, just take off from whatever gear is best for you. I know that you are just trying to show the difference from one tune to another, but if you don't have the same transmission than starting from the same gear doesn't make much sense to me. I've never driven a step 335 so I don't know how much of a difference in gearing there actually is, but the way that you took off and the other car was standing still made it look like he was in the wrong gear.
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      12-07-2007, 10:05 AM   #78
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You sound like a f***ing 10 year old. Move on and stfu
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      12-07-2007, 10:12 AM   #79
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Secondly, it seems theres a lot of haters out there all of a sudden. Why?
I don't understand, everybody knows that anything against Procede is evil and needs to be bashed... procede > world.... gosh...

Seriously now... since we have so many cars that are piggybacked.. proc v x.xx, helix manual and auto, JB2, R, RH - let's meet up and have some fun...
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      12-07-2007, 10:14 AM   #80
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Seriously now... since we have so many cars that are piggybacked.. proc v x.xx, helix manual and auto, JB2, R, RH - let's meet up and have some fun...
Would love to. Unfortunately the timing of the season and the sky releasing slippery particals, isnt condusive to making this happen anytime soon.
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      12-07-2007, 10:26 AM   #81
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Well that was four pages of little enlightenment. I've been around long enough to know that such a thread does nothing for the community or for the betterment of tuning.

For the record, Arthur filmed and posted that vid without my knowledge (BTW, I'm president of Helix), and whereas it's not my style to post such a vid, we have no agreements implied or expressed about what he can or should say about Helix products. He is a beta tester for our tuning product, meaning that he's working with us to develop the Attaché. He's a dyed-in-the-wool hot rodder and car guy who has owned and driven many very interesting vehicles. That's why we chose him to help us beta. That having been said the video clearly is not an apples-to-apples comparison: there'll be plenty of time for that when we have a product on the market. It's evident that the cars are in different gears, based upon the perfomance delta in the vid, versus the dyno information we have at this time.

So I think it's time to let this thread go dormant, at least from the Helix folks, and get back to making these cars go fast.
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      12-07-2007, 10:27 AM   #82
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/edit i know nothing about the helix product
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      12-07-2007, 10:29 AM   #83
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I'd love to do some runs but traction these days is less than optimal! Too cold. :sad0147:
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      12-07-2007, 10:33 AM   #84
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The MT third gear is shorter than AT third gear (4.8664 vs 4.6816). Thus MT 3rd has more punch. Add the AT drivetrain losses and MT should definitely win from roll at third.

(General comment, i.e. not commenting on what can be seen on the video. But if there is something wrong in the video, it is not in that Helix would have better gearing. Helix (AT) does not have gearing advantage in 3rd gear.)
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      12-07-2007, 10:33 AM   #85
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Quote:
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why don't we do helix vs. procede v2? Am I the only one that thinks comparing it to the 1.47 seems kind of dumb
Since very few people have v2 and even fewer people have the Attache, I think that setup might be a bit difficult at the moment. Further down the road when these are in more hands Im sure there will be tons of vids posted.

I dont care what tires you have on your car, in 27 degrees, nothing is going to get traction. Racing or doing runs in these conditions is just stupid and Im not going to partake in it just so forum members can sleep at night.

When the tracks reopen in Feb, more timeslips will be available. Until then, just relax, chill by the fire, and enjoy your holidays.
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      12-07-2007, 10:37 AM   #86
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PS. FWIW I bet the auto car was starting in 2nd. It downshifts to 2nd every time when you floor it from 40, at least mine does.
I was manually in 3rd gear not going passed the kick down and once reaching a point of it could not go back to 3rd i went passed the kick down.
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      12-07-2007, 10:40 AM   #87
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The MT third gear is shorter than AT third gear (4.8664 vs 4.6816). Thus MT 3rd has more punch. Add the AT drivetrain losses and MT should definitely win from roll at third.

(General comment, i.e. not commenting on what can be seen on the video. But if there is something wrong in the video, it is not in that Helix would have better gearing. Helix (AT) does not have gearing advantage in 3rd gear.)
You forgot about the final drive ratio.

3.08 for the MT and 3.46 for the AT.

Multiply gear ratio with final drive ratio to see what the true torque multiplication is ..

AT has a 8% shorter ratio.
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      12-07-2007, 10:46 AM   #88
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You forgot about the final drive ratio.

3.08 for the MT and 3.46 for the AT.

Multiply gear ratio with final drive ratio to see what the true torque multiplication is ..

AT has a 8% shorter ratio.
all these numbers even out with the different drive ratios. Alex since everyone is calling BS, looks like I will bring out the 335i tonight, call my friend with procede 1.47, my friend with JB2r, and you.. I will even bring out my M and show you that my M pulls on the JB2R and 1.47 and then I will also run the M agaist my Auto trans 335i and alex's 6 speed.
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