[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by bNks334

Just thought I would share this compilation of data here seeing as how this is the "ultimate" intercooler thread. Half the comments are from vendors... Here is what I found:

For anyone looking for some real world comparisons of a $295 ARM unit to the competition:

$295 ARM 5" unit:

http://datazap.me/u/banks334/76f-amb...og=0&data=4-17

Mods: VRSF DP, AP3 - protuned, DV+, 5" intercooler, Charge Pipe

Results: 76f ambient, 3rd gear - 101f rising to 109f @ 6500 rpms, load peaking 180-190.

Here it is a Lime Rock Park (88f): http://datazap.me/u/banks334/track-d...og=0&data=4-17
Lap times were 1:06-1:10.

$449 VRSF 5" unit:

http://datazap.me/u/mike5809/dyno-lo...0&data=4-12-14

Mods: Cobb AP V3 (PTF tune), E85, BERK 4in DP, VRSF 5in FMIC, ER CP, BMS Intake

Results: Looks like he didn't let IAT's settle before he started the run. IAT's drop to 110 DURING the run meaning is car was probably sitting at a red light or something before the pull. This is a 3rd gear pull, let's call it 110f rising to 129f at redline (Looks like it's close to 90f ambient). His car is running a tune very similar to mine.

Same car sees 100f rising to 114f (temps are closer to 75f here and this log is very comparable to my log): http://datazap.me/u/mike5809/dyno-lo...0&data=4-12-14


$689 ETS unit:

http://datazap.me/u/miamim3/log-2221...data=4-5-12-14

Mods: 2011 335i AT on 93 octane. It has ETS 5" FMIC, Cobb CP and PTF tune based off of Cobb Stage 1 Agressive OTS, no iterations.

Results: (2-3-4 pull) 77f ambient. 3rd 109f rising to 117, 4th 108f rising to 122f+. Load peaking around 180, slightly less aggressive than me.


$690 Wagner 5" unit:

http://datazap.me/u/335iffm/cobb-n55...-19&zoom=0-473

Mods: N55 DCT, PTF v12, Ultimate 102RON, Wagner EVO I Competition, 200cpi Catted OEM DP, 25.5°C, 1bar outside air pressure, 190kg OCC weight + 1815kg Curb weight = 2005kg

Results: 78f ambient temp: 3rd gear hits 116f at 6200 rpms (want to guess what it would be at 6500 or 6800?), 4th hits 132 @ 6400. This car IS tuned more aggressively though and has a 2f penalty. It's not a perfect comparison, but it looks pretty damn even after adjustments.

Here the log is done at 68f: http://datazap.me/u/335iffm/cobb-n55...-15&zoom=4-496

His temps are actually HIGHER than mine, he's starting off WAY cooler, he's seeing LESS peak load, and he is running in a more favorable 68f ambient.


$949 COBB unit:

http://datazap.me/u/jamesey271975/bm...-9-10-12-13-14

Mods: Cobb (stage 1 aggressive log), Cobb FMIC, Catless DP, BMW Performance Exhaust, aFe stage 2 intake, BMS Chargepipe, Alpina B3

Results: 95 rising to 135f in 3rd gear (not even a multi-gear pull)... Higher altitude(Utah Altitude is 4500ft), only 12psi, way less load @ ~145, but looks like a similar starting temp of 95f.

STOCK:

3rd gear pull @ 65f ambient, JB4 map 1, unknown mods, 96f rising to 145f. http://datazap.me/u/boris335i/log-2-...&data=1-4-6-19

and here is the AFTER of an ETS 5" same 65 ambient, JB4 map 1, unknown mods, 65f ambient, 98f rising to 118f: http://datazap.me/u/boris335i/log-2-...&data=1-4-6-19

Pretty dramatic decrease in IAT vs stock. However, it's pretty even compared to my car despite a 10f favorable temp difference and a much less aggressive tune (he is holding more boost 'till redline though. That might not be necessarily leading to more heat since the turbo isn't being maxed out at 4800rpms like the above flash tunes.

Conclusion: I am failing to see how a 5" ARM intercooler is so inefficient that it won't be effective on a stock turbo car. It looks like it's actually doing BETTER than the competition based on the above logs. Pretty much all the above logs show similar results, to be honest.

I commend the effort put into this post, genuinely.

Except not 1 aspect was an apples to apples comparison in a controlled environment.

Different vehicles, different parts of the country, different tunes, different heat soak, different ambients, different humidity and the list goes on. You'll chase your tail trying to figure out what is what and why.

I'll give it to you, ARM is a better intercooler then stock but I'm sorry the quality and efficiency overall will not stand up to a high quality intercooler.

If the ARM works for you or whoevers car it's on, the more power to em (no pun intended). However, until they compare another intercooler on the same vehicle in what is almost exactly same conditions, it's always going to be a moot argument.

10 Degree ambient is a large difference, especially when comparing say a 70F day and a 80F day. There are 70 degree days with low humidity that feel cold and have denser air. There are 80 degree days that have high humidity and feel closer to 90. Sitting at a traffic light, repeated stops, giving the intercooler enough time to cool down from heat soak for slow moving or stopped traffic all factor in too.

My first run of the day looks a lot better then a run 2 hours later after leaving the gym where the car sat in the parking lot (OFF) and heat soaked.

It's also typically found that on hot days, say 85+ that the vehicles overall will run hotter and therefore you might see a 40F rise in intake temps on that day but on a 65 degree day you might only see a 15 degree rise. Comparing IAT alone is the issue with all the other variables different is my point.

There is a reason both Mike @XPH and myself run ETS intercoolers... Vendor or not, if we could choose any intercooler, why did we choose them? (We didn't get them for free).