[BozoBlaster]

Originally Posted by Podunk

Just watched your vid, the seal area right behind the cam gear looks like the steels wore a pretty good groove, did you do the fingernail check to see if it caught really bad in that area? my concern is if its as deep as it looks on camera, you may be leaking oil pressure past the new teflon seals. causing the vanos gears to rely on internal spring pressure and be overly retarded. and that fix is pretty hefty and makes BMW worthy of the "bring my wallet" moniker if i'm correct, ( although decent used clamshells with little to no wear can be found in junk yards or on Ebay for much cheaper then what FCP euro sells the clamshell kit for) .


Edit: i would ask on other forums as well and see if they concur.

Finally got around to doing a data log for you, and yes I will do that, I have been itching to drive this car again, it's been like three months now that it's sat in the driveway.

https://datazap.me/u/bozoblaster/log...25-26-27-29-30

Not sure if its going to help or not, just to clarify, if the grooves in the ledges are really deep, then does that mean the seals can't make a good enough seal therefore the vanos system can't keep oil pressure in the top end of the engine making it so vanos can't do its job, potentially having these issues?

[Podunk]

that would be correct, but looking at your datalog, it looks liek they are functioning correctly, and requested and actual are pretty close to each other. exhaust is dead on intake is only 2 degrees off.

so i'd say Vanos function looks good. however i see your STFT 2, it's -26 macx and runs around -20 after idle settles, lambda looks ok-ish, around 14.7-15.x but that is a lot of fuel to be pulling out at idle.. and seems like an injector may be leaking, can you log misfire counts at all? if you can it may narrow down the cylinder(s) causing issue and lead to finding a leaking injector

you can also pull plugs and see if any smell like fuel or are black with soot compared to others.

a video of it running would help too so we can get audio. and see if there is any persistent backfires/pops or anything out intake or exhaust.

[BozoBlaster]

Originally Posted by Podunk

that would be correct, but looking at your datalog, it looks liek they are functioning correctly, and requested and actual are pretty close to each other. exhaust is dead on intake is only 2 degrees off.

so i'd say Vanos function looks good. however i see your STFT 2, it's -26 macx and runs around -20 after idle settles, lambda looks ok-ish, around 14.7-15.x but that is a lot of fuel to be pulling out at idle.. and seems like an injector may be leaking, can you log misfire counts at all? if you can it may narrow down the cylinder(s) causing issue and lead to finding a leaking injector

you can also pull plugs and see if any smell like fuel or are black with soot compared to others.

a video of it running would help too so we can get audio. and see if there is any persistent backfires/pops or anything out intake or exhaust.

Would I be looking at cylinder corrections for logging misfires? I can upload a video of it running, I did take a short video of its first startup back on the 11th when I first asked about this issue and I also took some longer videos today when I was logging, I can upload to YT and post a link like before. On my last MHD tune I did tune burbles with it so it should have a little extra fuel dumping through the cylinders.

[Podunk]

burbles? shouldn't activate on startup the RPM is too low. and shouldn't persist for more then a few seconds.

Ok i saw your video from 14 hours ago, there is a loud clacking noise still. that is concerning, your fuel trims being off is concerning.. i would rip the valve cover off and turn it TDC and reverify timing, but i would also verify TDC with something in the spark plug hole. like a boroscope or a copper rod and feel it with my hand as it comes up. just to make triple sure i don't wedge it. and then verify the pin enters the flywheel.

here is Vehicle DIY doing his where he had to use a different flywheel holder:

that 50's kid:

[BozoBlaster]

Originally Posted by Podunk

burbles shouldn't activate on startup the RPM is too low. and shouldn't persist for more then a few seconds. you are effectively -20% throughout the whole datalog. you did mention you are single turbo, and i'm guessing you are running TPI as well, is your TPI consistent SFI along with direct or does it kick in under boost only?

Makes sense, and no that was going to be a near future upgrade, at the moment i just have 4 index 12 injectors, 1 index 9, and one index 4. I just finished getting the car put back together after putting in the single this last weekend so I haven't driven the car with the single. I planned on getting two more index 12's to make them all the same and wanted to go PI when the budget can accommodate it. Seems like that is going to end up happening before I get this all running.

[Podunk]

i edited my above post, cause i rechecked your channel and listened to your car on your more recent video. when in doubt recheck all work.

if you have a place that can test injectors locally for flow/leaking, i would do that, it' usually only a couple hundred max for injector cleaning/flow checks.

I'd still double check the timing work and verify TDC was actually TDC with the pin installed, first cause STFT can be affected by timing as well.

i know it was a lot of work, and it would suck to go back to Square 1, but best to verify first before going down the rabbit hole.

if you can verify all work, timing is spot on, then i'd start with the fueling issue the logs indicate.

[BozoBlaster]

I might end up putting this off for a little, only have so much time outside of work and now my other bmw (E28 533i) is starting to have a clutch issue, doesn't seem like 1st gear is engaging as much as it should leading to rolling backwards too much from uphill stops, when the trans is cold 1st doesn't disengage right away when I push in the clutch pedal and I'm hearing a slight clunking sound whenever I release the clutch pedal in any gear. I feel like something is just loose not allowing things to seat all the way without having gotten under the car yet but the clutch could also be failing, that car has just over 200k miles being a 1984 model.

I appreciate all your help and advice a whole lot, and when I get around to it, I will do as you suggested, I believe there is a piezoelectric fuel injector shop near me that can do the injector cleaning and testing, and I really don't want to but I will take the top end back off and confirm TDC, piston one at the front of the engine would be the one to check through correct? I don't see it being nessecary to use the different flywheel locking tool that Vehicular diy used in the video you posted since I shouldn't need to break the crank bolt loose, anything else other than the cam qr codes/ Vanos sensor wheels/ and making sure piston one is raised all the way through the spark plug hole I should be looking at that confirm TDC? If I need more advice I hope I can have you give me some direction as needed. Much appreciation friend.

[BozoBlaster]

If I hypothetically over torqued my connecting rods down when I replaced the rod bearings could it be potentially causing issues like this? Is that even possible since there is only so much clearance between the bottom "u" piece and the top rod to piston head piece, I wouldn't think they can tighten down past that, the bolts would just break right? I had to move the car over in my driveway a little and when I gave it gas a little, nothing happened and the engine shaking felt very bad. Just curious if that is a possibility or is this almost a for sure timing issue.. my fear with the rods is that maybe my torque wrench is somehow out of calibration? I have only used it on a handful of projects on this car so I wouldn't think so but I'm not ruling it out.

[Podunk]

Originally Posted by BozoBlaster

I might end up putting this off for a little, only have so much time outside of work and now my other bmw (E28 533i) is starting to have a clutch issue, doesn't seem like 1st gear is engaging as much as it should leading to rolling backwards too much from uphill stops, when the trans is cold 1st doesn't disengage right away when I push in the clutch pedal and I'm hearing a slight clunking sound whenever I release the clutch pedal in any gear. I feel like something is just loose not allowing things to seat all the way without having gotten under the car yet but the clutch could also be failing, that car has just over 200k miles being a 1984 model.

I appreciate all your help and advice a whole lot, and when I get around to it, I will do as you suggested, I believe there is a piezoelectric fuel injector shop near me that can do the injector cleaning and testing, and I really don't want to but I will take the top end back off and confirm TDC, piston one at the front of the engine would be the one to check through correct? I don't see it being nessecary to use the different flywheel locking tool that Vehicular diy used in the video you posted since I shouldn't need to break the crank bolt loose, anything else other than the cam qr codes/ Vanos sensor wheels/ and making sure piston one is raised all the way through the spark plug hole I should be looking at that confirm TDC? If I need more advice I hope I can have you give me some direction as needed. Much appreciation friend.

The Bolded:

he had an aftermarket flywheel and clutch plate, which is primary reason he used the different tool, as an aftermarket flywheel likely won't have the TDC alignment hole like the OEM dual mass flywheel does.

as you are single turbo, i assume you have an aftermarket flywheel and clutch combo which could be the issue is the alignment hole for the hold dowel is missing or any holes machined into the flywheel are not in the proper spot.



as for overtorquing the rod bolts, that shouldn't cause a timing issue, like we are seeing, and if the motor would spin by hand without binding, i wouldn't worry much about it. if it did bind, then it would be an issue as you would have clearances too close together which creates a situation where the crank can contact the bearing, grab it, and spin the bearing, ruining the crank and the rod journal. ( you did turn it by hand gently after doing rod bearings correct?)

however it wouldn't be a timing issue, it would be rather loud racket, and possibly low oil pressure light. which should cause over retard codes, not synchronization codes.

or at least it SHOULDN'T cause Synchro codes, but BMW is finnicky like that, but you'll also see metal particulate in your filter paper by now if this was an issue and causing a problem as well as particulate on the check valves, and or Vanos solenoids.

[BozoBlaster]

Originally Posted by Podunk

The Bolded:

he had an aftermarket flywheel and clutch plate, which is primary reason he used the different tool, as an aftermarket flywheel likely won't have the TDC alignment hole like the OEM dual mass flywheel does.

as you are single turbo, i assume you have an aftermarket flywheel and clutch combo which could be the issue is the alignment hole for the hold dowel is missing or any holes machined into the flywheel are not in the proper spot.



as for overtorquing the rod bolts, that shouldn't cause a timing issue, like we are seeing, and if the motor would spin by hand without binding, i wouldn't worry much about it. if it did bind, then it would be an issue as you would have clearances too close together which creates a situation where the crank can contact the bearing, grab it, and spin the bearing, ruining the crank and the rod journal. ( you did turn it by hand gently after doing rod bearings correct?)

however it wouldn't be a timing issue, it would be rather loud racket, and possibly low oil pressure light. which should cause over retard codes, not synchronization codes.

or at least it SHOULDN'T cause Synchro codes, but BMW is finnicky like that, but you'll also see metal particulate in your filter paper by now if this was an issue and causing a problem as well as particulate on the check valves, and or Vanos solenoids.

Well I guess I can rule out the over torquing then, I torqued down on the same setting as the new bolts with old bolts and plastigauge and tolerances were within spec. I can order a new filter and check that as well.

As for the flywheel/transmission its still all stock. Something that my low budget couldn't include at this time but I wanted to address in the future. I have an automatic transmission that has had some slight intermittent issues I posted here about in the past.
https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1862454
So I was wanting to replace it with something like the DCT or maybe the 8hp, which ever can handle the power better. I've considered doing the manual swap but that seems like a lot of work. If there is a way to address that without replacing, that would be ideal for the time being but I would rather make a true repair rather than putting a bandaid on the situation.

This whole conversion was prompted because of my stock twins were starting to fail, I had the dreaded wastegate rattle and it was getting worse and worse and I suspected that the seals were failing. I had put an oil catch can setup on the low side of the valve cover and I was still getting a high amount of oil through the intake tract. About a year ago I did a valve clean and when I took off the valve cover recently I'm still getting oil blow-by so I did the head port plugs with the dual catch can/ aluminum valve cover. I wanted to go single at some point and I didn't want to do this job twice so I decided to go single instead of replacing the twins. My idea for now is to hopfully get it running with a conservative tune, then when I have more of a budget to address all the weak points with a lot more power, then I can re-tune it to have more of my desired power levels.

[Podunk]

8HP is supposed to be a good swap for power, Next Level Rides swapped one into his 135i, i believe he goes through the necessary items for the process. including the conversion harness.

my car came as a 6MT so no work to get it swapped.. sadly it's still sitting at the body shop waiting on progressive to move their ass on a decision, apparently once the plastic cover came off the rear, the reinforcement was totally F'd and shoved into a body panel. so hoping they don't try to total it, and i have to get litigation involved.


there SHOULD be an alignment dowel/hole on the crank that the flex plate/flywheel lines up with, i'd still double check cause never know what any prior wrenches did, or if they used the proper parts for the model/year cause they like to make small changes to models ( like how we have LCI, Pre LCI, with or without headlight washers, and PDC.. etcetera and we have both 6 bolt and 8 bolt cranks depending on year as well)

[BozoBlaster]

I'm sorry to hear that, and I hope all goes well with insurance and you can get back on the road ASAP. What model do you have? Any aftermarket mods?

Just to be 100% sure, I'm going to try and tackle confirming timing this weekend and want to make sure that all I have to do is confirm TDC with the cams qr, vanos position sensor, flywheel locking pin, and piston 1 at highest point in rotation? And if the pistons and flywheel/crank doesn't line up with cam TDC then what I should do is loosen the vanos timing chain gear bolts so cams don't rotate, lock cams and timing sensors with locking tool and turn crank until piston 1 is at highest point and be able to insert flywheel locking pin? Then everything should all be linea up at TDC? That makes the most sense in my head but maybe there is another way.

[OMEGA412]

If its manual it could be your flywheel.

[BozoBlaster]

No its an automatic.

I think I might've figured out what I did wrong just thinking about the process I took to do the rod bearing replacement. So technically I started off with the crank at TDC because that is the position the engine was in during the removal and reinstall of cams while changing out the six bad lifters. Put the valve cover back on. Then moved down to remove oil pan and oil pump to get access to all connecting rods, removing oil pump requires you to take out the bolt connecting the timing chain to the oil pump so that is what I did. In order to get to the rest of connecting rods I had to rotate the engine and that would drop the other rods to an accessible spot to work on. After getting all bearings changed out, I PUT THE OIL PUMP BACK IN WITHOUT ROTATING ENGINE BACK TO TDC!!

So based on that I think its a maybe an oil feeding issue? And if so then am I going to have to get back into the oil pan, take off the bolt from the timing chain to the oil pump, to somehow line up timing with how it should've been? Not sure how I would determine what the TDC position would be for the oil pump or if I'm thinking about this all wrong and does that really matter? Not sure how all of the works entirely.

[BozoBlaster]

Took the valve cover off today. Timing is as close to perfect that I can get without all the special timing tools most mechanics use. I did however notice that two exhaust rocker arms were knocked off of their valve springs, must've happened when I set and tightened down cam ledges even though I was aware of that being very easy to do and trying to avoid that from happening at the time but here we are. So piston three and six both had one exhaust valve not opening when it should. I feel like that would explain the engine running rough and having a lot of heavy vibration around 6-700 rpm but will that cause the long crank during starting? I'm afraid that the cam ledges are causing issues like was discussed before..

[BozoBlaster]

Originally Posted by BozoBlaster

Took the valve cover off today. Timing is as close to perfect that I can get without all the special timing tools most mechanics use. I did however notice that two exhaust rocker arms were knocked off of their valve springs, must've happened when I set and tightened down cam ledges even though I was aware of that being very easy to do and trying to avoid that from happening at the time but here we are. So piston three and six both had one exhaust valve not opening when it should. I feel like that would explain the engine running rough and having a lot of heavy vibration around 6-700 rpm but will that cause the long crank during starting? I'm afraid that the cam ledges are causing issues like was discussed before..

Okay so I got it put back together and started it up. No more check engine light, no more limp mode, however it still has the heavy engine shuddering around 6-700 rpms in idle, goes away after slight acceleration, feels smooth after that in all gears so far. No more codes related to timing but I have these three codes now as shown in attached photo. Turbo seems to be working as well as it can without tuning the ecu, currently on a 91 octane stage 2+ v10 MHD map, I did reflash it with the 3-port mac solenoid option for boost control but I know it won't work 100% without a custom tune. Definitely seems like I'm headed in the right direction but I still don't like that shuddering at idle, not sure if that's the new bearings being broken in or what. I can't really get it on video either since I can only really feel it instead of hear it. Standing outside the vehicle while idling I wouldn't be able to tell but sitting down in the seat you can feel it for sure, it's very prominent.

[BozoBlaster]

Originally Posted by BozoBlaster

Okay so I got it put back together and started it up. No more check engine light, no more limp mode, however it still has the heavy engine shuddering around 6-700 rpms in idle, goes away after slight acceleration, feels smooth after that in all gears so far. No more codes related to timing but I have these three codes now as shown in attached photo. Turbo seems to be working as well as it can without tuning the ecu, currently on a 91 octane stage 2+ v10 MHD map, I did reflash it with the 3-port mac solenoid option for boost control but I know it won't work 100% without a custom tune. Definitely seems like I'm headed in the right direction but I still don't like that shuddering at idle, not sure if that's the new bearings being broken in or what. I can't really get it on video either since I can only really feel it instead of hear it. Standing outside the vehicle while idling I wouldn't be able to tell but sitting down in the seat you can feel it for sure, it's very prominent.

Could it possibly be that there is a larger volume of air being pushed into the engine now and in idle at lower rpms the engine can't properly balance but as soon as rpms increase it can balance out? So hypothetically a tune could solve this issue? Just trying to speculate. Not sure if its a bearing break in or not, trying to look into it. There is a back and forth of if there truly is a "break in period" for new rod bearings and there seems to be no consensus. The closest informed opinion I can find is to just assume there is even though we can't prove it so keep rpms low for first 500 miles and then change oil, although there is no evidence to back this up other than a shop saying this is what we tell customers and we haven't had any negative situations so far.

[Podunk]

Originally Posted by BozoBlaster

Could it possibly be that there is a larger volume of air being pushed into the engine now and in idle at lower rpms the engine can't properly balance but as soon as rpms increase it can balance out? So hypothetically a tune could solve this issue? Just trying to speculate. Not sure if its a bearing break in or not, trying to look into it. There is a back and forth of if there truly is a "break in period" for new rod bearings and there seems to be no consensus. The closest informed opinion I can find is to just assume there is even though we can't prove it so keep rpms low for first 500 miles and then change oil, although there is no evidence to back this up other than a shop saying this is what we tell customers and we haven't had any negative situations so far.

i don't think it's be bearings, did you check the cam lobes to make sure they didn't get ground down from contacting components on the rockers that fell off?

and actually that makes sense you got those codes if they did fall off cause the lobes may have hit and forced timing to over retarded before forcing past the restriction from the fallen rockers. you also gave it a few light revs with it in this condition as well which may have also caused damage.

however you also have hPFP codes, which can cause a rough idle as well. let me go look uip the english version of those real quick and i'll come back and edit, ( sorry i haven't checked up on this thread in a while, been busy, waiting to hopefully get my 335i back from colision this week)

OK After checkign codes it seems to relate to fuel pressure and injection and can cause extended crank, and/or rough idle.

can you log your HPFP Rail pressure, and LPFP pressure and post the log? we want to see priem and bleed down, as well as pr9ime, start, shutoff then bleed down.

english translation as follows.
2FCA Fuel high pressure when the injection is released
2FDA Fuel high pressure when or after the injection is released

It could be bad Regulator/ LPFP ( integrated filters clogged) / HPFP ( has tiny filter that can also clog, or it can just be starting to fail) / Sensors.

[BozoBlaster]

No worries, hopfully you have your 335 back now!!
Other than the newfound turbo lag my car seems to be running fine apart from the rough idling. It did feel slightly worse when I turned on the A/C at idle.
I didn't remove cams again to check for damage but what I could see with an inspection mirror from under the opening of the ledges I didn't see anything concerning. No metal shavings or glitter or anything in those areas.
I have some data logs I will upload and post later. I replaced the LPFP regulator within the last year or so, the lid had a crack in it and I was noticing my fuel gauge dropping faster than it should, average mpg/ distance on a full tank readout on the dash was off, I would drive like 5-6miles and the distance would go down 10-15miles. And I started noticing a raw fuel smell outside by the fuel full. I didn't change the LPFP though, maybe a screen is clogged? Is that easy to check with the HPFP? They will both be upgraded in the future so I would hope its just a clugged filter and them not failing. I know there is a sensor on the fuel rail for the high side but where is the sensor located for the low side? Is that part of the regulator?

[BozoBlaster]

https://datazap.me/u/bozoblaster/sho...3-5-8-15-16-17 Took a trip to the store last Wednesday a couple miles on the freeway there in heavy traffic, had a couple openings to pass a few people, on way back not much traffic but I was behind a sherif so I didn't want to rev it up and be loud. I will say after the conversion, my car is noticeably louder. I already have high flow secondary cats and no mufflers, before I had catless twin downpipes but with the catless single downpipe and bigger turbo it totally makes a difference.