Rough Idle: Help

BHairsto · 11-21-2007, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Move.Over

Probably the load of the AC compressor. Mine had a rough iddle. Turn off the AC and it iddled nicely. AC running and it was rough. Since you are in VA the AC won't be on in the fall.

Nope--appeared to have nothing to do with the AC. It stalled/stuttered with the AC on or off, and I had previous episodes before the summer.

6Zylinder · 11-21-2007, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cstmx_ryder

From a cold start, my car idles @ 1000 rpm, then a few seconds later, it drops to 800 rpm, then a few more seconds later it drops to 600 rpm......I'm assuming this is NORMAL from a cold start? It hasn't given me a problem when the car's up to temp........Is this normal??

That is absolutely normal.

fast_lap28 · 11-21-2007, 11:34 AM

1st - to all, thanks for posting your experiences with this rough idle deal. please keep your thoughts and ideas coming since this issue is still not resolved for many of us.

2nd - I have been trying to use some fuel injector cleaner i.e. Lucas, Techron and alternating every 3 fill up. this seems to help a good deal but from time to time at long lights (at temp) I will get the slightest of shakes. I still have not tried another fuel brand outside of Shell 93. I will do so in coming weeks but first I wanted to try the additives and see what that did.

Q: anyone have an opinion or issues with using such additives in their fuel? what (if any) issues could someone expect later down the road from additives in their fuel system?

3rd - I don't know if I agree with the idea of the "shakes" being related to the AC compressor or such - case in point is that I have never had the AC on when I experience the shakes.

4th - I am doubting that this issue is HPFP related at this time because not once has the car hesitated to delivery fuel under any load conditions. Never has it felt like it was going to stall or did I experience a power lose.

Q: Could this be related to the ignition system on these cars or the spark plugs by any chance?

Keep in mind again, the "shake" I feel is more on the butt dyno meter scale. What I mean is that the RPMs never fluctuate between a range, they stay steady BUT i do feel the quick shake throughout the seat etc. Its almost as if the motor mounts were older which they are not. For the build on my car the software update is not available per my previous posts. So I am just riding this one out hoping that after the current 6100 miles + the car will get better. I will def check with dealer from time to time to mention this to them and will see what they say - I will try to keep everyone posted on my progress or lack off.

Thanks everyone for your input!

rideelement247 · 11-22-2007, 10:01 AM

I've had my A/C both on and off, and I experience the drop from 1000 RPM to 800 RPM to 600 RPM. The car makes a little vibration on cold starts. My car is an 09/07 build, 2008 E92 335i....sadly, it looks like SOMETHING is wrong on this car as well...but I do believe it is "commonly normal". aka, everyone experiences it, but it probably shouldn't be there

greyhound · 11-23-2007, 12:11 AM

I'm kinda impressed at how smooth the 335i idle is on these vehicles.

I would focus on a bad injector, or perhaps the fuel pump.

The problem is that you may not get the answer quickly.

My '05 Subaru Turbo Legacy GT had a similar problem. The idle got nasty rough (it would die at traffic lights) and the dealer said, "we can't find anything"

A month later it finally threw a CEL and the ECU clearly identified the bad injector. I drive in and say "it's number 4", they give me a car for a day, and the problem went away.

RedBarron · 11-25-2007, 11:36 AM

You guy's are not alone, I have had an rough idle on my 330ci for 2 years and it has been to the dealer multiple times and they don't know what to do.

BMWdmk · 11-29-2007, 03:38 PM

I too get the shakes...and hiccups between 3k-5k ONly after that it pulls hard
sometimes, at idle, it feels like someone "love tapped" that back of my car
but no one is behind me

i will now resort to changing coils and spark plugs and last the injectors...
HOPEFULLY problem goes away (knock on wood)
ill keep you guys posted

Quisp · 12-02-2007, 12:45 AM

i have the same issues, no ac, and noticed that it is worse when it rains.

roy@gambitmotorsport · 12-05-2007, 01:00 AM

Possibly silly question - are you always under 1/4 tank when this happens (or just refilled afterwards)?

I've had my rough idle recur since my post here, someone on bimmerforums mentioned the idea, and thinking back I can remember where the tank was maybe half the time and it was always in this range.

Not that this is how a car should act, but just want to see if others have had the same experience.

Our build dates (OP) are both recent, if I remember, after the original fuel pump issues were supposed to be remedied. I wonder if there's a "new" problem.

fast_lap28 · 12-05-2007, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy@gambitmotorsport

Possibly silly question - are you always under 1/4 tank when this happens (or just refilled afterwards)?

I've had my rough idle recur since my post here, someone on bimmerforums mentioned the idea, and thinking back I can remember where the tank was maybe half the time and it was always in this range.

Not that this is how a car should act, but just want to see if others have had the same experience.

Our build dates (OP) are both recent, if I remember, after the original fuel pump issues were supposed to be remedied. I wonder if there's a "new" problem.

I can honestly tell you that having the tank 1/4, 1/2 or other is not an issue in my case. This has been happening in all ranges from having the tank Full, 1/2, 1/4, etc.

FYI - I went to my dealer this past weekend and talked with the service manager. I have him all the scenarios and details and also brought some valid concerns from this post to his attention. He didn't look at me like I was

and

.......

He said that they have been noticing the same symptoms on their B7 Alpinas!!! So he said that he would discuss this issue with the high powers that be at BMW and would get back to me with some sort of answer. I will wait for his comments and will advice everyone here what could be cause and what could be the solution. The svc. mgr said that another (new) SW update was out there but he wanted to run this by the BMW engineer he knows well first before deciding to go this route.

Stay tuned.

e46hijinks · 12-05-2007, 03:15 PM

I agree this should not be normal. My friend's car (Maybe Jon can chime in on this) did this pretty badly. He got the fuel pump replaced by BMW and it's still doing it. It idles (purrs) smoothly at a stop light... then it "hiccups" or stutters as if one of the spark plugs momentarily didn't spark. Car runs and drives strong otherwise. This "hiccup" occurs random and intermintently but if I had to guess I would guess maybe every 2 or 3 seconds while idling and ONLY when idling (perceivable at least).

e46hijinks · 12-05-2007, 03:16 PM

By the way his car is a 335i 6MT

e46hijinks · 12-05-2007, 03:17 PM

I'll try to get a video of it... the stuttering is extremely obvious and nothing you need to "sit still" for to notice

roy@gambitmotorsport · 12-12-2007, 11:45 PM

Risking another possibly unfounded suggestion, but I wanted to get it out there, rather than PM you: are you running with the golf-tee mod or the relay to it disconnected?

I performed the relay disconnect to the exhaust butterfly valve very early on (may 1K miles). I'm at around 8K miles and have gotten rough idle on and off for about the last 1K. I've gotten idle hunting (600, 850, 500 - regardless of temps) for as long as I remember. I'm not positive if this stretches back before 1K miles.

About 2 weeks ago, I reverted my exhaust valve relay disconnect. I've been through two tanks of gas. I've had no rough idle - but, that's no proof. However, my car's idle has never hunted during this period - *ever*. This could be the cool temps in SoCal for the last two weeks, it could be something I don't understand, or it could be random. Thought I'd mention it, though.

For the record, I originally did the exhaust valve mod because I thought it sounded cool. After having some "other" exhaust work done, I reverted it, because I'm not trying to awaken curiosity under 3K RPMs. I've got to say "going back" feels no slower and maybe a little smoother. Perhaps the back pressure on our small turbos peps things up to a certain RPM, like a NA-engine, rather than a big single turbo block.

Oh well, probably not the issue you're having, but maybe. Anyway, would be interested in anyone else who reverted the golf-tee hose or relay and they're opinions on the idle.

For the record, I did have my car in at the dealer at this time for an 8K miles 1st oil change (at my cost). Perhaps they uploaded some new software.

I doubt it, though, since my OBDII datalogger was still plugged in when I got it back.

omg516 · 12-13-2007, 10:51 AM

I also get the shakes, 07/07 build with 3500 miles. I'm thinking its the HPFP but I guess I'll just have to wait and see. I haven't had a chance to take it into the dealer yet but if it gets worse I probably will have to.

fast_lap28 · 12-14-2007, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy@gambitmotorsport

Risking another possibly unfounded suggestion, but I wanted to get it out there, rather than PM you: are you running with the golf-tee mod or the relay to it disconnected?

I performed the relay disconnect to the exhaust butterfly valve very early on (may 1K miles). I'm at around 8K miles and have gotten rough idle on and off for about the last 1K. I've gotten idle hunting (600, 850, 500 - regardless of temps) for as long as I remember. I'm not positive if this stretches back before 1K miles.

About 2 weeks ago, I reverted my exhaust valve relay disconnect. I've been through two tanks of gas. I've had no rough idle - but, that's no proof. However, my car's idle has never hunted during this period - *ever*. This could be the cool temps in SoCal for the last two weeks, it could be something I don't understand, or it could be random. Thought I'd mention it, though.

For the record, I originally did the exhaust valve mod because I thought it sounded cool. After having some "other" exhaust work done, I reverted it, because I'm not trying to awaken curiosity under 3K RPMs. I've got to say "going back" feels no slower and maybe a little smoother. Perhaps the back pressure on our small turbos peps things up to a certain RPM, like a NA-engine, rather than a big single turbo block.

Oh well, probably not the issue you're having, but maybe. Anyway, would be interested in anyone else who reverted the golf-tee hose or relay and they're opinions on the idle.

For the record, I did have my car in at the dealer at this time for an 8K miles 1st oil change (at my cost). Perhaps they uploaded some new software.

I doubt it, though, since my OBDII datalogger was still plugged in when I got it back.

good point there! I did my relay disconnect early on (around 1K) and never thought about connecting again since. this is something worth a try and see what happens

thanks for the thought....

jbuds335xi · 12-16-2007, 06:04 PM

My car has been doing the same thing recently. It's hard to tell exactly what is causing it because I got V2.0.2 (which has the overcrank and power failure under high boost) but I also get many of the HPFP failure symptoms... I'm hoping it's software related and I won't have to go see the dealer and pay $$$ for a new fuel pump...

Regardless, let's keep this thread updated!

tibbz · 01-30-2008, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy@gambitmotorsport

Possibly silly question - are you always under 1/4 tank when this happens (or just refilled afterwards)?

I've had my rough idle recur since my post here, someone on bimmerforums mentioned the idea, and thinking back I can remember where the tank was maybe half the time and it was always in this range.

Not that this is how a car should act, but just want to see if others have had the same experience.

Our build dates (OP) are both recent, if I remember, after the original fuel pump issues were supposed to be remedied. I wonder if there's a "new" problem.

this does happened when i have a 1/4 tank or just fill up....anyone know why?

roy@gambitmotorsport · 01-30-2008, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibbz

this does happened when i have a 1/4 tank or just fill up....anyone know why?

I'm not sure - I've been keeping it above 1/4 tank for months now. I feel very superstitious, like I should carry a voodoo stick in the car. Before I started doing this, I had the chance to pull the ECU code once (a restart makes it disappear), and I got "Cylinder 1 misfire".

In another couple of weeks, I'm going to start letting it get down to near empty each tank to see if it recurs...

Roy

tibbz · 01-31-2008, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy@gambitmotorsport

I'm not sure - I've been keeping it above 1/4 tank for months now. I feel very superstitious, like I should carry a voodoo stick in the car. Before I started doing this, I had the chance to pull the ECU code once (a restart makes it disappear), and I got "Cylinder 1 misfire".

In another couple of weeks, I'm going to start letting it get down to near empty each tank to see if it recurs...

Roy

good luck....keep us updated....

dinkoh · 02-04-2008, 03:57 PM

My tech has posted that my car is idling poorly. And I'm having high pressure on my fuel pump. Could be related...

But they didn't change the FP though.

Bombardier · 02-14-2008, 01:12 PM

3000 miles...... , I've got my first "kick in the but" 50 metres from BMW dealer, at STOP lights, minute after picking up brand new ULTIMATE MACHINE....
Is having these hiccups daily ever since (4 months). Twice complain to BMW and the only help... burn out half tank of gas... otherwise (for them) everything is O.K. - but is mine and it hurts already. I know one more person with the same problem.. it is a PROBLEM.

11-21-2007, 11:34 AM	#25
fast_lap28 Lieutenant 40 Rep 494 Posts Drives: '07 335i Montego Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC iTrader: (0)	1st - to all, thanks for posting your experiences with this rough idle deal. please keep your thoughts and ideas coming since this issue is still not resolved for many of us. 2nd - I have been trying to use some fuel injector cleaner i.e. Lucas, Techron and alternating every 3 fill up. this seems to help a good deal but from time to time at long lights (at temp) I will get the slightest of shakes. I still have not tried another fuel brand outside of Shell 93. I will do so in coming weeks but first I wanted to try the additives and see what that did. Q: anyone have an opinion or issues with using such additives in their fuel? what (if any) issues could someone expect later down the road from additives in their fuel system? 3rd - I don't know if I agree with the idea of the "shakes" being related to the AC compressor or such - case in point is that I have never had the AC on when I experience the shakes. 4th - I am doubting that this issue is HPFP related at this time because not once has the car hesitated to delivery fuel under any load conditions. Never has it felt like it was going to stall or did I experience a power lose. Q: Could this be related to the ignition system on these cars or the spark plugs by any chance? Keep in mind again, the "shake" I feel is more on the butt dyno meter scale. What I mean is that the RPMs never fluctuate between a range, they stay steady BUT i do feel the quick shake throughout the seat etc. Its almost as if the motor mounts were older which they are not. For the build on my car the software update is not available per my previous posts. So I am just riding this one out hoping that after the current 6100 miles + the car will get better. I will def check with dealer from time to time to mention this to them and will see what they say - I will try to keep everyone posted on my progress or lack off. Thanks everyone for your input!
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11-22-2007, 10:01 AM	#26
rideelement247 Lieutenant Colonel 58 Rep 1,677 Posts Drives: 08 335i, 67 Camaro SS Join Date: May 2007 Location: South Florida iTrader: (2)	I've had my A/C both on and off, and I experience the drop from 1000 RPM to 800 RPM to 600 RPM. The car makes a little vibration on cold starts. My car is an 09/07 build, 2008 E92 335i....sadly, it looks like SOMETHING is wrong on this car as well...but I do believe it is "commonly normal". aka, everyone experiences it, but it probably shouldn't be there __________________ Legal Disclaimer: Anything I or anyone else says about my vehicle on this website(e90post.com or any affiliated or nonaffiliated sites), pertaining to modifications, is only to gain acceptance from my/our peers, and does not actually represent anything actually existing on my car, and thus, cannot be held against me in any issues, i.e. warranty claims, that may arise.
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11-23-2007, 12:11 AM	#27
greyhound New Member 0 Rep 14 Posts Drives: '11 335d Sedan 6AT Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Howland Island iTrader: (0)	I'm kinda impressed at how smooth the 335i idle is on these vehicles. I would focus on a bad injector, or perhaps the fuel pump. The problem is that you may not get the answer quickly. My '05 Subaru Turbo Legacy GT had a similar problem. The idle got nasty rough (it would die at traffic lights) and the dealer said, "we can't find anything" A month later it finally threw a CEL and the ECU clearly identified the bad injector. I drive in and say "it's number 4", they give me a car for a day, and the problem went away.
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11-25-2007, 11:36 AM	#28
RedBarron Lieutenant 136 Rep 419 Posts Drives: BMW 440i Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Jacksonville, FL iTrader: (0)	You guy's are not alone, I have had an rough idle on my 330ci for 2 years and it has been to the dealer multiple times and they don't know what to do. __________________ Current: Porsche Cayman S
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11-29-2007, 03:38 PM	#29
BMWdmk Rollin 3rd 106 Rep 1,232 Posts Drives: Something fast Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Chino Hills iTrader: (15)	I too get the shakes...and hiccups between 3k-5k ONly after that it pulls hard sometimes, at idle, it feels like someone "love tapped" that back of my car but no one is behind me i will now resort to changing coils and spark plugs and last the injectors... HOPEFULLY problem goes away (knock on wood) ill keep you guys posted
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12-02-2007, 12:45 AM	#30
Quisp Does not play well with others 80 Rep 1,787 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Arizona iTrader: (4)	i have the same issues, no ac, and noticed that it is worse when it rains.
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12-05-2007, 01:00 AM	#31
roy@gambitmotorsport Something Else 24 Rep 216 Posts Drives: '07 335i coupe 6MT Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA iTrader: (0)	Possibly silly question - are you always under 1/4 tank when this happens (or just refilled afterwards)? I've had my rough idle recur since my post here, someone on bimmerforums mentioned the idea, and thinking back I can remember where the tank was maybe half the time and it was always in this range. Not that this is how a car should act, but just want to see if others have had the same experience. Our build dates (OP) are both recent, if I remember, after the original fuel pump issues were supposed to be remedied. I wonder if there's a "new" problem.
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12-05-2007, 03:15 PM	#33
e46hijinks E46 8 Rep 83 Posts Drives: 2006 E46 325ci 5MT Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Woodland Hills, CA iTrader: (0)	I agree this should not be normal. My friend's car (Maybe Jon can chime in on this) did this pretty badly. He got the fuel pump replaced by BMW and it's still doing it. It idles (purrs) smoothly at a stop light... then it "hiccups" or stutters as if one of the spark plugs momentarily didn't spark. Car runs and drives strong otherwise. This "hiccup" occurs random and intermintently but if I had to guess I would guess maybe every 2 or 3 seconds while idling and ONLY when idling (perceivable at least). __________________ MY06 E46 325ci 5MT
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12-05-2007, 03:16 PM	#34
e46hijinks E46 8 Rep 83 Posts Drives: 2006 E46 325ci 5MT Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Woodland Hills, CA iTrader: (0)	By the way his car is a 335i 6MT __________________ MY06 E46 325ci 5MT
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12-05-2007, 03:17 PM	#35
e46hijinks E46 8 Rep 83 Posts Drives: 2006 E46 325ci 5MT Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Woodland Hills, CA iTrader: (0)	I'll try to get a video of it... the stuttering is extremely obvious and nothing you need to "sit still" for to notice __________________ MY06 E46 325ci 5MT
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12-12-2007, 11:45 PM	#36
roy@gambitmotorsport Something Else 24 Rep 216 Posts Drives: '07 335i coupe 6MT Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA iTrader: (0)	Risking another possibly unfounded suggestion, but I wanted to get it out there, rather than PM you: are you running with the golf-tee mod or the relay to it disconnected? I performed the relay disconnect to the exhaust butterfly valve very early on (may 1K miles). I'm at around 8K miles and have gotten rough idle on and off for about the last 1K. I've gotten idle hunting (600, 850, 500 - regardless of temps) for as long as I remember. I'm not positive if this stretches back before 1K miles. About 2 weeks ago, I reverted my exhaust valve relay disconnect. I've been through two tanks of gas. I've had no rough idle - but, that's no proof. However, my car's idle has never hunted during this period - ever. This could be the cool temps in SoCal for the last two weeks, it could be something I don't understand, or it could be random. Thought I'd mention it, though. For the record, I originally did the exhaust valve mod because I thought it sounded cool. After having some "other" exhaust work done, I reverted it, because I'm not trying to awaken curiosity under 3K RPMs. I've got to say "going back" feels no slower and maybe a little smoother. Perhaps the back pressure on our small turbos peps things up to a certain RPM, like a NA-engine, rather than a big single turbo block. Oh well, probably not the issue you're having, but maybe. Anyway, would be interested in anyone else who reverted the golf-tee hose or relay and they're opinions on the idle. For the record, I did have my car in at the dealer at this time for an 8K miles 1st oil change (at my cost). Perhaps they uploaded some new software. I doubt it, though, since my OBDII datalogger was still plugged in when I got it back.
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12-13-2007, 10:51 AM	#37
omg516 Lieutenant 18 Rep 572 Posts Drives: 07 e90 335i Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: San Francisco iTrader: (0)	I also get the shakes, 07/07 build with 3500 miles. I'm thinking its the HPFP but I guess I'll just have to wait and see. I haven't had a chance to take it into the dealer yet but if it gets worse I probably will have to.
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12-16-2007, 06:04 PM	#39
jbuds335xi Second Lieutenant 9 Rep 248 Posts Drives: 335xi Manual, Jet Black, Black Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: All over iTrader: (0)	My car has been doing the same thing recently. It's hard to tell exactly what is causing it because I got V2.0.2 (which has the overcrank and power failure under high boost) but I also get many of the HPFP failure symptoms... I'm hoping it's software related and I won't have to go see the dealer and pay $$$ for a new fuel pump... Regardless, let's keep this thread updated! __________________ Modded.
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02-04-2008, 03:57 PM	#43
dinkoh Captain 21 Rep 877 Posts Drives: 07 e90 lemon/black Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: charm city --> bay area iTrader: (4)	My tech has posted that my car is idling poorly. And I'm having high pressure on my fuel pump. Could be related... But they didn't change the FP though.
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02-14-2008, 01:12 PM	#44
Bombardier Registered 0 Rep 1 Posts Drives: 2008 335i Coupe, 6 speed mt Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Toronto, Ontario iTrader: (0)	3000 miles...... , I've got my first "kick in the but" 50 metres from BMW dealer, at STOP lights, minute after picking up brand new ULTIMATE MACHINE.... Is having these hiccups daily ever since (4 months). Twice complain to BMW and the only help... burn out half tank of gas... otherwise (for them) everything is O.K. - but is mine and it hurts already. I know one more person with the same problem.. it is a PROBLEM.
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