[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

I'd rather chew tin foil than take an EV for a rental.

I'd rent one for a week just out of gearhead and lifestyle curiosity. I'm sure it would not sway me from my current positions regarding the topic; the math is too easy to understand. But I'm open to be changed.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

I'd rent one for a week just out of gearhead and lifestyle curiosity. I'm sure it would not sway me from my current positions regarding the topic; the math is too easy to understand. But I'm open to be changed.

Maybe, my position is that if I'm on holiday I don't need any unnecessary stress like worrying about figuring out charging stations etc.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

What the article missed and what most what people still fail to understand is the impact of reducing gasoline usage as EV replace ICEV. I've written numerous times in this thread, changing the ratios of fuels and chemicals distilled from crude oil is mostly fixed within very small deviation on a per-refinery basis. If the world wants aviation fuels to still fly and heating oil to heat homes, and the myriad of chemicals that make the world work and produce products, the amount of gasoline production is fixed in ratio to those other fuels and chemicals. The petrochemical industry just can't stop making gasoline overnight (that means decades) without massive tech refresh of the refinery infrastructure. That will impact all of us with higher costs to operate and enjoy our lives. Reducing gasoline use reduces the other fuels and chemicals that are produced along with it.

There will be significant consequences or unintended issues when you take a product out of the economy/equation. Loss of gas tax will have to be replaced on top of the cost of the increased electrical capacity. This is going to be way more expensive than anyone has projected and we all know who's going to pay.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

Maybe, my position is that if I'm on holiday I don't need any unnecessary stress like worrying about figuring out charging stations etc.

100% percent agree with that. On vacation, nope; I'll go ICEV every time. Most EV'ers will rent ICEV too for a road trip vacation.

[Car-Addicted]

This is a simplified example of the byproducts from refining a barrel of crude oil. It's that 10.1% that the Greenies will be whining for if no oil is refined.

[KRS_SN]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

I'd rent one for a week just out of gearhead and lifestyle curiosity. I'm sure it would not sway me from my current positions regarding the topic; the math is too easy to understand. But I'm open to be changed.

Test driving is tesla is so easy.. all online..
I did it a year ago. They let me have a model y for 2 hours. It was easy for me to realize it was a no from me

[cfm56d7b]

It's important to note that not all crude oil grades are alike.

There are three primary qualities that differentiate one oil from another: weight, sweetness, and TAN count.

Heavy oil: evaporates slowly and contains material that will be used to make heavy products like asphalt. Light oil: requires less processing and produces a greater percentage of gasoline and diesel than heavy oil.

Sweet oil: has very low levels of sulfur, well under 1%. Sour crude: has as much as 1-2% of sulfur. Midstream companies and refiners that transport, store, and process sour oil know they need extra treating capabilities to take out the sulfur and sweeten the product.

TAN stands for “Total Acid Number.” The TAN count of oil is a measure of how corrosive it is. If a crude has a high TAN number, producers must use more robust metallurgy than standard so their processes can handle that corrosivity and keep the crude in the pipe.

Diesel prices are up 40% since May 2023 due to production curbs by Russia and Saudi Arabia. Why both of these countries decided to cut production is a different discussion.

Diesel is in the price of everything in case there is interest in learning more about inflationary trends.

In 2021, 61% of all electricity was generated in the US by burning fossil fuels: gas - 38.4%, coal - 21.9%, and oil - 0.6%.

https://www.epa.gov/power-sector/ele...-sector-basics

At least in the foreseeable future, the more electricity is demanded by EVs, the more fossil fuels will be burned.

[G MONEY]

Originally Posted by cfm56d7b

It's important to note that not all crude oil grades are alike.

There are three primary qualities that differentiate one oil from another: weight, sweetness, and TAN count.

Heavy oil: evaporates slowly and contains material that will be used to make heavy products like asphalt. Light oil: requires less processing and produces a greater percentage of gasoline and diesel than heavy oil.

Sweet oil: has very low levels of sulfur, well under 1%. Sour crude: has as much as 1-2% of sulfur. Midstream companies and refiners that transport, store, and process sour oil know they need extra treating capabilities to take out the sulfur and sweeten the product.

TAN stands for “Total Acid Number.” The TAN count of oil is a measure of how corrosive it is. If a crude has a high TAN number, producers must use more robust metallurgy than standard so their processes can handle that corrosivity and keep the crude in the pipe.

Diesel prices are up 40% since May 2023 due to production curbs by Russia and Saudi Arabia. Why both of these countries decided to cut production is a different discussion.

Diesel is in the price of everything in case there is interest in learning more about inflationary trends.

In 2021, 61% of all electricity was generated in the US by burning fossil fuels: gas - 38.4%, coal - 21.9%, and oil - 0.6%.

https://www.epa.gov/power-sector/ele...-sector-basics

At least in the foreseeable future, the more electricity is demanded by EVs, the more fossil fuels will be burned.

Us oil refineries are spending hundreds of millions of dollars on FCC turnarounds/upgrades. Gasoline is not going
Anywhere anytime soon. Merica baby

[Efthreeoh]

AI is so boring.

[Condorll]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

Maybe, my position is that if I'm on holiday I don't need any unnecessary stress like worrying about figuring out charging stations etc.

Add to that I get a 500 mile range on my X5 for highway road trips, usally drive about 400 miles a day then check into a hotel. Don't have to fill up until the next morning (5 minutes at the pump in daylight hours) and drive another 400 miles. Super convenient.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

100% percent agree with that. On vacation, nope; I'll go ICEV every time. Most EV'ers will rent ICEV too for a road trip vacation.

I never rent any cars when on hols now , we use public transport which we prefer and the best one so far was in LA from our base in santa monica, having a good old natter with the friendly Mexicans on the superb bus system.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Condorll

Add to that I get a 500 mile range on my X5 for highway road trips, usally drive about 400 miles a day then check into a hotel. Don't have to fill up until the next morning (5 minutes at the pump in daylight hours) and drive another 400 miles. Super convenient.

What's the gas tank capacity of your X5..

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Andesch

To facilitate compliance with the ICE bans and mitigate the economic impact on the automotive industry, policymakers are implementing generous subsidies for both manufacturers and consumers. Supporters of this transition argue that EVs have already achieved economic and operational parity, if not superiority, compared to petroleum-fueled vehicles. They believe that the bans and subsidies simply accelerate an inevitable shift towards electric transportation.

A case of blind leading the blind.

[Condorll]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

What's the gas tank capacity of your X5..

21.9 US gallons x 27-28 mpg (Ideal conditions) on highway = 590-613 miles range to empty.

I usually put in about 17-18 gallons when I fill up with 100-120 miles range left (3.9 gallons)

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Condorll

21.9 US gallons x 27-28 mpg (Ideal conditions) on highway = 590-613 miles range to empty.

I usually put in about 17-18 gallons when I fill up with 100-120 miles range left (3.9 gallons)

I make that 83 litres in UK terms, you must keep to a set moderate speed with minimum throttle probably on cruise and I gather its an in line six turbo hybrid?

[Condorll]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

I make that 83 litres in UK terms, you must keep to a set moderate speed with minimum throttle probably on cruise and I gather its an in line six turbo hybrid?

Not really, on the highway on a longer road trip I usually run in comfort mode (never eco mode) on cruise around 75 mph, usually over the speed limit and occasional run ups to 80-85mph or more.

My 2023 X5 xDrive 40i xLine is the 3.0L Turbocharged Inline 6 cylinder. It's not a hybrid. BMW says 335 hp, Car and Driver says no way, it's more like 360-380hp and clocked my exact car at 4.9 seconds 0-60. Amazing vehicle, handles like a dream with the adaptive M suspension, corners flat which is impressive for a big and tall SUV.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Condorll

Not really, on the highway on a longer road trip I usually run in comfort mode (never eco mode) on cruise around 75 mph, usually over the speed limit and occasional run ups to 80-85mph or more.

My 2023 X5 xDrive 40i xLine is the 3.0L Turbocharged Inline 6 cylinder. It's not a hybrid. BMW says 335 hp, Car and Driver says no way, it's more like 360-380hp and clocked my exact car at 4.9 seconds 0-60. Amazing vehicle, handles like a dream with the adaptive M suspension, corners flat which is impressive for a big and tall SUV.

That's good. Wondering why BMW call it a 40i

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Condorll

Add to that I get a 500 mile range on my X5 for highway road trips, usally drive about 400 miles a day then check into a hotel. Don't have to fill up until the next morning (5 minutes at the pump in daylight hours) and drive another 400 miles. Super convenient.

Our RAM 1500 ecoDiesel gets 1100KM ( a little under 700 miles) highway for a fill up. Same for us we usually drive for about 400 miles and fill up (a little more than 1/2 a tank) and stop for the night. I always fill up before checking in so I have a full tank to get going in the morning.

I can't imagine having to wait for a charger and then take an hour to top up the battery. I'd lose my shit.

[Car-Addicted]

More good news for the EV croud.
General Motors: Sorry Your EV May Have a Defective Battery, Here’s $1,400
General Motors is offering $1,400 to owners of the 2020-2022 Chevy Bolt to entice them to install a diagnostic program that will determine if their battery is defective. The move is reportedly part of an anticipated class action settlement related to the battery problems that have plagued GM’s all-electric car.
Over the summer, GM said it would stop replacing 2020-2022 Chevy Bolt Batteries and instead verify the battery’s durability with software that monitors the battery over 6,200 miles, during which time Chevy Bolt owners are only allowed to charge the batteries up to 80 percent, further limiting the range of their EVs.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

More good news for the EV croud.
General Motors: Sorry Your EV May Have a Defective Battery, Here’s $1,400
General Motors is offering $1,400 to owners of the 2020-2022 Chevy Bolt to entice them to install a diagnostic program that will determine if their battery is defective. The move is reportedly part of an anticipated class action settlement related to the battery problems that have plagued GM’s all-electric car.
Over the summer, GM said it would stop replacing 2020-2022 Chevy Bolt Batteries and instead verify the battery’s durability with software that monitors the battery over 6,200 miles, during which time Chevy Bolt owners are only allowed to charge the batteries up to 80 percent, further limiting the range of their EVs.

Only 80% charge allowed lol what a total waste of human resources and a hiding to nothing.

[Car-Addicted]

Most EV's only charge to 80% at full charge rate. There is no cell balancing so that is the best way for EV's to limit battery damage and extend life.

[M5Rick]

^ So wait, you could do a 100% charge with a slow charger? say one that takes all night.