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BMW Considering Among 4-6 Concepts Based on BMW-Toyota Joint Sports Car
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07-26-2013, 09:17 PM | #67 |
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How you could come up with 4-6 concepts is crazy. I could see a small lightweight budget sports car that possibly is a step up from the FR-S/BRZ, a midsize front-engine modern day Supra (hybrid if they want, but whatever), and a mid-engine supercar.
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07-28-2013, 07:11 AM | #68 |
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it's good news to think that BMW can justify creating the i8 as a production car with a price tag estimated in the region of 100-150k...
It means we might see something from this venture which could take on the porsche gt2 or the gt2 rs in a similar price bracket. Anything over this is likely to be a non starter in terms of profitability. BMW has continually denied there is a business case for a supercar, but if something that competes with supercars can be squeezed into the same price bracket as the i8 I dont see why it wouldnt sell well. As long as it's brilliant of course, which of course the porsche is. |
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07-30-2013, 02:08 AM | #70 | |
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07-30-2013, 12:03 PM | #71 |
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Wow comparing the sports car making ability of Toyota and BMW? Never heard this one before!
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07-30-2013, 02:09 PM | #72 | |
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From CL: http://www.clublexus.com/forums/car-...sed-supra.html
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I think the bottom one is the LF-LC. I don't know what the white concept is. I doubt an actual BMW/Toyota Supra would be so gaudy, though. |
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07-31-2013, 01:48 AM | #73 |
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I think BMW should not take a back seat in development of turbo engines. I find the N54 to be a jem of an engine far under rated in stock form and with big upside.
They should work with Toyota on what Toyota is good at. Make reasonable and more affordable cars. Thus, offering us a more reasonable priced car. They should take Toyota input on durability and making cars more reliable. Other then that BMW should handle all the designing input of handling, powertrain, and engine performance.
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07-31-2013, 03:32 AM | #74 |
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Well, lately Toyota has more or as good sports cars as BMW. GT86 is lighter and more affordable than 1M, other than grearbox IS-F isn't much worse than M3, and LFA is among the best sportscars of the last 20 years. Not to forget all cars Toyota had before like the MR2 and the Supra. Toyota has nothing to prove, they have already with the LFA, BMW does have to prove something now, they have not a single true sportscar since the Z4 M.
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07-31-2013, 03:48 AM | #75 | |
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The white one is the FT-HS, a Supra concept, V6 Hybrid, that inspired the design of the FT-86 (aka GT86/FR-S). The LF-LC will be a V8 powered performance hybrid, 2, 2+ or 2+2 seater. It is yet totally unknown what the Toyota BMW project will be, that is why I can't wait till Tokyo Auto Show. The goal of this coorp is for Toyota to reduce price its costs on CF chassis, so that the Toyota should not costs as the LFA, same goes for BMW, they don't want to develop a sports car alone for cost reasons. The decisions going at BMW/Toyota are what type of sportscar do they want to build, something affordable (50-60 K), a 911 rival (100 K) or a supercar. (150-200 K). The supercar is very likely have a MR layout with V8 engine, BMW S63 and Toyota their V8 Turbo or NA V8, both with hybrid tech. If a 911 rival, it would be also a 2 seater, either MR or FR layout. Both Toyota and BMW would use their V6 Turbo (assuming M3/M4 has V6). The other car would be a FR layout, something a Z4 M/Z5, V6 engine (?) and no hybrid. |
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07-31-2013, 11:33 AM | #76 | |
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Lexus is just a fancy Toyota, they might look nice outside, but when you are opening their door panels and check out their steel and the technical approach, you can see the difference. Even the guy who fixes dents on my cars told me how soft they are in comparison with German and English cars. From outside might look better (for some people) but they are not that great. Just proven reliable mechanics(usually older than competition) but they will never drive like a BMW. For me is not just the leather. I beautiful woman might look good but there is a time when she needs to show what's inside. I had one Lexus as a try-on and I dump the thing in two weeks. I will never buy one. |
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07-31-2013, 01:07 PM | #78 | |
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07-31-2013, 05:13 PM | #80 |
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Well I wasn't doubting the assertion that "soft(er)" steel exists. I was questioning his anecdotal source that suggested Toyota uses softer steel than BMW.
Anyone have a third party source to corroborate? I'm genuinely interested... And for that matter, is harder steel always better to use, or is it context-dependent? |
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07-31-2013, 05:57 PM | #81 |
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07-31-2013, 07:10 PM | #82 | |
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When it comes to crash testing in general engineers don't want to make the car too strong in certain places because otherwise all the forces are transferred right to the passenger compartment. A good illustration of this is to imagine dropping a glass ball onto a platform with a spring under it. If the spring is to soft then the balls energy will compress the spring completely and then shatter. If the spring is too firm then the force of the ball will not compress the spring at all, which means no energy is absorbed by the spring. Again the glass ball will shatter. So you have to find a happy medium between the two. In the case of cars its a balancing act between keeping the passenger compartment intact and keeping the forces from reaching the passengers. |
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