[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by 200Duece

The simple logic always works the best. Let me know how the test results work out. Do me a personal favor and keep track of the time that you are going to invest into these test to prove my 6th grade logic unsatisfying.

Are you smarter than a 6th Grader?

LOL....It will probably take my about 20 min to make a set, and maybe 20 min to test. The testing is more fun then anything.... Relax a little bit bro, its gonna be ok....

[AWD Addict]

Originally Posted by O-cha

Why the hell is it that whenever I click these types of threads the timing is always like this lol? But yea I'm sure it will send more air through the snorkel, not hundreds of CFM more, but more. Problem is it's still mixing with hot air after coming in. Because of this, a heat shield is the best option, period. I had plans on cutting my UR about where the logic is and giving it a heatshield from the rest of the bay long before they came out with their "design" (which I had hoped was exactly that, where they placed the filter + heatshield).

With turbos, volume of air is more important than incoming temperature. The turbo is just going to heat the charge up to close to 1000 degs anyways.

Intake charge should be cooled in the intercooler. That's why CAIs are basically useless on a turbo.

[ontopofm]

Originally Posted by O-cha

Why the hell is it that whenever I click these types of threads the timing is always like this lol? But yea I'm sure it will send more air through the snorkel, not hundreds of CFM more, but more. Problem is it's still mixing with hot air after coming in. Because of this, a heat shield is the best option, period. I had plans on cutting my UR about where the logic is and giving it a heatshield from the rest of the bay long before they came out with their "design" (which I had hoped was exactly that, where they placed the filter + heatshield).

do you have some sketches for the heat shield? what kind of materials are you gonna use?

[200Duece]

The testing is what i've been talking about. Just drive it. That's where the fun is. you don't need a placebo mod to go drive.

It's all good in the hood

[200Duece]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

With turbos, volume of air is more important than incoming temperature. The turbo is just going to heat it up to close to 1000 degs anyways.

Intake charge should be cooled in the intercooler. That's why CAIs are basically useless on a turbo.

This is what I have been talking about^^^^^^^

[AWD Addict]

Yeah, but I'd like to see some tests, and some data on this. I'm not so sure what the air is doing under the hood. It could be getting diluted real quick, or it could be going into the box pretty efficiently. It could even be screwing up an already effient air pattern, and making things worse!


Its impossible to wieght in without some more information.


Looks cool at least.


*subscribed

[O-cha]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

With turbos, volume of air is more important than incoming temperature. The turbo is just going to heat the charge up to close to 1000 degs anyways.

Intake charge should be cooled in the intercooler. That's why CAIs are basically useless on a turbo.

1000 degrees, just lol . Hot air is less dense whether it's getting heated more or not. The turbos run more efficient with cooler air, period. Turbo efficiency is a killer on this car, period.


You should duct off the area behind the radiator and take advantage of all that ram air if it's not important. I mean theres a big fan there too! more off the line acceleration. Good luck.

Originally Posted by ontopofm

do you have some sketches for the heat shield? what kind of materials are you gonna use?

Aluminum sheet and maybe some reflective tape on it, though it wont make a difference. The main point is to keep the already hot air away from it not to prevent heat from penetrating the area.

[ontopofm]

more air blowing at it, i need something to pin it down, yeah? for my case what do you suggest? im very new at this

[radgator1]

Originally Posted by 200Duece

The simple logic always works the best. Let me know how the test results work out. Do me a personal favor and keep track of the time that you are going to invest into these test to prove my 6th grade logic unsatisfying.

Are you smarter than a 6th Grader?

I'm not sure why you are assuming everyone who does this will be using the Logic intake. I would guess many folks who stick with the oem airbox might be interested in this along with a drop-in like the soon to be released Streamline filter for instance. I think it is a cool mod, if you don't like it by all means don't do it.

[ontopofm]

a member here has RPI scoops and his impression after first drive, i hope he doesnt mind me posting his pics, mine does not turn heads but instead curiousity, and it's 150+ times less expensive
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101148

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by O-cha

Turbo efficiency is a killer on this car, period.

Have you done a test showing this? There seems to be alot of people who disagree with you on this one....

[ontopofm]

is this heat shield any good?

The Insulator
Thermal Acoustic Insulation
The Insulator is a radiant heat barrier, acoustic sound barrier, airflow barrier and a thermal heat barrier. Natural fiber pad has a 99.5% pure aluminum foil facing. Class-A fire rating. Great for under hood, firewall or floorboard. These 4 foot by 6 foot pads are easy to use and install.

[RPIpower]

I need the images of how you made the scoop taken off. We DO have a patent on these. Thanks.

[marcvtec]

patent lol he's not selling he made it for himself

[AWD Addict]

Originally Posted by O-cha

1000 degrees, just lol .

So how hot do you think the exhaust is then running through the blower? my guess is it's close to 1000 / 1200 degs.


Without real information, there's no way to tell if this thing helps, hurts, or is completely useless.

$0.02

[marcvtec]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

So how hot do you think the exhaust is then running through the blower? my guess is it's close to 1000 / 1200 degs.

I think its gonna melt the cats

[AWD Addict]

at 1600 it would definitely damage catalytic converters, although i doubt anyone's up in that range. Typically max EGTs should be in the 1400deg range on an aluminum block.

[O-cha]

Originally Posted by AWD Addict

So how hot do you think the exhaust is then running through the blower? my guess is it's close to 1000 / 1200 degs.


Without real information, there's no way to tell if this thing helps, hurts, or is completely useless.

$0.02

Temperature of the exhaust? LOL You said charge air temperatures were "Near 1000 degrees so it made no difference."

Every "discussion" I have with you you continue to prove you know absolutly nothing about turbos cars despite your "years" of tuning experience (with manual boost controllers ) .

This is for everyones benefit, not just my dear friend AWD addict. Charge air is not heated because the turbine side of the turbos is hot, charge air is heated mainly because it is being compressed. Charge air temps are no where NEAR 1000 degrees, not even half that.

Originally Posted by e90AW335i

Have you done a test showing this? There seems to be alot of people who disagree with you on this one....

No one disagrees with me on that, they disagree that cold air does not effect it.

[Mattscott]

Originally Posted by RPIpower

I need the images of how you made the scoop taken off. We DO have a patent on these. Thanks.

Thats funny because the Gruppe-M intake has those as well. SUE GRUPPE-M!!

[E82tt6]

Originally Posted by RPIpower

I need the images of how you made the scoop taken off. We DO have a patent on these. Thanks.

He posted pics earlier in the thread.

He's not selling them anyways, so it's not really relevant.

[ontopofm]

im not selling anything, i refused to do so when members here asked me to made extra sets, does mine looks like RPI scoops? maybe from the front view, not even bcuz i have 4 bolts hanging down.

[Numb3rs]

Originally Posted by O-cha

Why the hell is it that whenever I click these types of threads the timing is always like this lol? But yea I'm sure it will send more air through the snorkel, not hundreds of CFM more, but more. Problem is it's still mixing with hot air after coming in. Because of this, a heat shield is the best option, period. I had plans on cutting my UR about where the logic is and giving it a heatshield from the rest of the bay long before they came out with their "design" (which I had hoped was exactly that, where they placed the filter + heatshield).

O-Cha,


I think you underestimate the volume or air used to combust an engine. If you have a constant source of fresh cold air coming in, it does not have a chance to "mix with hot air", the volume of air coming threw the intake will actually cool the walls of the intake.

That "cooling" is offset buy the ambient engine temperatures outside the intake, in the engine bay. The surface temperature of the intake manifold changes degree throughout a run, but on average it settles to a happy medium. With the fresh air combating the ambient.

That doesn't mean the intake is heating the air coming in, it means the air that passed directly along those walls exchange the heat, but that exchange is so short lived, those air molecules don't have time to reach ambient engine bay temps. "Ram air" type intakes, are not effected significantly by the engine bays ambient temps.

If you don't understand, just look at the facts. A 3.0 liter engine uses 3.0 liters of air every revolution, in 10 seconds @ 3,000rpms the N54 uses 1,500 liters of air...



Chances are, depending how the car is driven, the intake manifold (usually plastic) is cooler to the touch than the engine bays ambient temperature. This is why aftermarket CIA that don't use fresh air are not a wise choice, unless they get their source from outside the engine bay.

The challenge with aftermarket intakes is to find a way to reduce the resistance and increase flow. A double pane or dual wall intake void of air is the optimol method from reducing the engines bays temps on the fresh air comming in. Vacuum doesn not transfer heat.

But again, using a ram air intake, heat isn't really the problem, it's restriction and flow.