[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by delmarco

Me explaining myself again! I did not set out to insult anyone but instead I wanted to make it aware what it means to own a BMW over 100,000 miles...

Since 2012, I've posted detailed information for taking an N52 E90 to 200,000, 250,000, and 300,000 miles. It's been far less expensive then buying 3 new cars.

[vb7200]

My 07 335xi is at 111,000 miles, and it hasn't been pretty...

Right when I bought it at 100,000, actually, it shit the bed. Threw a rod for unknown reasons. Vanos also went. I was very lucky with this, however, as all of it happened within a 30 day warranty period, so the dealer fixed everything at no cost to me. Had I gotten the car earlier, then I could have been up sh*t creek without a paddle.

Would I buy another BMW when this one reaches the end of its road? Hell yes! I know that might sound crazy after what happened with this one, but that could happen to any car. Bottom line, all these horror stories about the cars dying do not come true for every single e90 on the road, you have to keep that in mind. You have to keep up on maintenance and do preventative things before they can happen. BMW is kind of at blame, like saying your transmission has "lifetime" fluid, and saying you should change your oil at 12,000 mile intervals when really you should be doing it around every 5,000... and the people who originally bought these cars listened, because why else go against what the manufacturer says? These cars will go on forever, you just have to treat them right and not be afraid of doing these little things when you are supposed to, and not keep putting them off.

[Welcome to NBA Jam]

Originally Posted by vb7200

saying you should change your oil at 12,000 mile intervals when really you should be doing it around every 5,000...

Do you know what you've just done by saying that?

[vb7200]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

Do you know what you've just done by saying that?

Do I even want to know

[Phyrexia]

I believe you've just jinxed yourself, sir

[Welcome to NBA Jam]

Originally Posted by vb7200

Do I even want to know

The...greatest evil of our time. The phrase that divides communities; nay, the phrase that destroys BMW forums from the inside out. We must pray that our resilience holds.

[sea6speed]

Originally Posted by delmarco

You really don't know who I am do you?

Seriously, if anything people should be telling you NOT to DIY given how all in you went on your E46.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

The...greatest evil of our time. The phrase that divides communities; nay, the phrase that destroys BMW forums from the inside out. We must pray that our resilience holds.

I got banned once for it.

[phsullivan]

To the OP, I would guess that the three cars you owned were all purchased used, that is where the best value is and what I ha be always done. The issue with these and ALL used cars is regular maintenance. BMW like many other brands extended their suggested maintenance schedule as a cost saving and marketing ploy when they started picking up the tab for the first few years. What a joke lifetime fluids and 100k spark plugs are.

As you and others commented, many people own these cars for their status, particularly as they are getting older and cheaper on the used market. But many of these people can't afford or choose not do basic maintenance on any car.

A poorly maintained Tacoma or Civic is just as bad as a poorly maintained BMW. In buying a used car the only thing I care about is the service record -- and yes I keep a detailed spread sheet of everything I do (but not my gas usages ). Yes, idealy I want the options I want to be there, particularly three pedals, but most all the options on a car can be swapped, but wear and tear from poor maintenance are there for the life of the motor and tranny.

So when you say you had a bad experience with these cars it could be that you have done a less than ideal job in picking which used cars to buy and which ones to walk away from.

On a different topic, I agree that the electric water pumps are not ideal from a maintenance perspective or cost to replace, but it is really I interesting to watch the range of water temps the car takes on in different driving conditions that are facilitated by separating the pump rmp from the engine rpm. This is also the likely reason why there is no temp gauge on these cars, even damped down like all cars are it would still swing around too much for most drivers.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by phsullivan

To the OP, I would guess that the three cars you owned were all purchased used, that is where the best value is and what I ha be always done. The issue with these and ALL used cars is regular maintenance. BMW like many other brands extended their suggested maintenance schedule as a cost saving and marketing ploy when they started picking up the tab for the first few years. What a joke lifetime fluids and 100k spark plugs are.

As you and others commented, many people own these cars for their status, particularly as they are getting older and cheaper on the used market. But many of these people can't afford or choose not do basic maintenance on any car.

A poorly maintained Tacoma or Civic is just as bad as a poorly maintained BMW. In buying a used car the only thing I care about is the service record -- and yes I keep a detailed spread sheet of everything I do (but not my gas usages ). Yes, idealy I want the options I want to be there, particularly three pedals, but most all the options on a car can be swapped, but wear and tear from poor maintenance are there for the life of the motor and tranny.

So when you say you had a bad experience with these cars it could be that you have done a less than ideal job in picking which used cars to buy and which ones to walk away from.

On a different topic, I agree that the electric water pumps are not ideal from a maintenance perspective or cost to replace, but it is really I interesting to watch the range of water temps the car takes on in different driving conditions that are facilitated by separating the pump rmp from the engine rpm. This is also the likely reason why there is no temp gauge on these cars, even damped down like all cars are it would still swing around too much for most drivers.

I just hate when people come on here and say stupid shit like this. This statement gets said over and over by people with no logical thought, engineering background, and no business education. If the engineering analysis showed that the various components of the drivetrain needed more service than what is currently recommended, BMW would just simply increase the MSRP. BMW is not giving away any service for free. The free maintenance that BMW provides while the car is under warranty is just a price component of the MSRP. Essentially the customer is paying for the free maintenance upfront at the time the vehicle is purchased or leased.

BMW started this practice in the mid 1990s so that the leased cars were assured to see the periodic maintenance is completed so the car remains in good shape and can carry an extended warranty for the 2nd owner with little risk the car is internally damaged due to lack of maintenance (which BMW would be responsible for). The beauty of this practice is BMW makes the original owner pay for it. Further, as an accounting treatment, owners are basically funding BMW with cash that it normally would not get until farther down the revenue stream as the car comes in for periodic maintenance and guarantees its dealers see the routine service work rather than independent service shops. Again, all pre-funded by the customer.

The service items such as drivetrain fluid changes have been extended due to engineering, better component design (design and mechanical engineering), use of better materials (materials engineering), better manufacturing tolerances (manufacturing engineering), and better fluid chemistry (chemical engineering).

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

Is delmarco actually e46mango?

He's a dude that likes to run his mouth and make a video of it.

[CTinline-six]

The E46 and E90 are very different. I maintain two E46s for friends.

In my experience, the E46 breaks more than the E90 does, but the problems are little annoying things that are usually not expensive to replace. E90 parts such as the water pump are more expensive, but the E90 seems to have fewer break downs in my experience. This is of course comparing only the N52 version of the E90. With turbos and direct injection there is more complexity and more stuff to break, which is obvious.

The E46 is more prone to rust, and if the sub frame cracks, it's pretty much game over at that point.

That last piece is mainly why I chose the E90 over the E46.

[BravoJohny33]

Originally Posted by vb7200

My 07 335xi is at 111,000 miles, and it hasn't been pretty...

Right when I bought it at 100,000, actually, it shit the bed. Threw a rod for unknown reasons. Vanos also went. I was very lucky with this, however, as all of it happened within a 30 day warranty period, so the dealer fixed everything at no cost to me. Had I gotten the car earlier, then I could have been up sh*t creek without a paddle.

Would I buy another BMW when this one reaches the end of its road? Hell yes! I know that might sound crazy after what happened with this one, but that could happen to any car. Bottom line, all these horror stories about the cars dying do not come true for every single e90 on the road, you have to keep that in mind. You have to keep up on maintenance and do preventative things before they can happen. BMW is kind of at blame, like saying your transmission has "lifetime" fluid, and saying you should change your oil at 12,000 mile intervals when really you should be doing it around every 5,000... and the people who originally bought these cars listened, because why else go against what the manufacturer says? These cars will go on forever, you just have to treat them right and not be afraid of doing these little things when you are supposed to, and not keep putting them off.

Every 5k oil.. what year is this 1955? New oil is designed to last 15k miles plus and the cars are designed to handle this for hundreds of thousands miles. I have followed BMW oci since day one and the one thing that has not broke is the engine. It's everything else.

[nsjames]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

The service items such as drivetrain fluid changes have been extended due to engineering, better component design (design and mechanical engineering), use of better materials (materials engineering), better manufacturing tolerances (manufacturing engineering), and better fluid chemistry (chemical engineering).

why then does every GM transmission using Dexron 6 state that you should change the fluid at 50K miles for severe use, and change the fluid and filter at 100K miles for normal use, yet BMW says never change it?

It's a GM transmission in my 328, what's special about BMW Dexron 6?

I'll follow GMs service intervals thank you.
Coincidentally my transmission shifts a ton better with fresh fluid in it, and the 100K mile fluid I drained was badly oxidized.
So much for lifetime fluids being better engineered.
Now, do I think you should be doing 5K mile oil changes? No, that's wasteful. Do I think 15K mile intervals are too much? Yes, and oil analysis shows that to be true in my N52. The sweet spot is 7500-8K for my particular motor and driving habits. 10K was a tad too much, 15K is insane.

So what I'm saying is use your best judgment and take samples, not take BMW's word as gospel, because frankly, they don't care once it's passed the warranty period.

[cbi1972]

I've driven my 2008 335i from 100k miles to 140k miles over 4 years, and I've spent about $18,000 in stealership maintenance for the privilege. $3000 here, $4000 there, it adds up in a hurry. Fuel pump, coils, plugs, fluid reservoirs, gas tank(!), oil leaks, halo bulb, headlight ballast, idler pulley, fuel injectors necessitating Dinan reflash, you name it.

Prior to this e90, I have had four e30 BMWs, and I probably spent about the same amount over the course of 15 years.

I love the car, and I'm probably going to keep doing this, but I would not recommend this to anybody without cash to burn or a proclivity for doing their own work.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by nsjames

why then does every GM transmission using Dexron 6 state that you should change the fluid at 50K miles for severe use, and change the fluid and filter at 100K miles for normal use, yet BMW says never change it?

It's a GM transmission in my 328, what's special about BMW Dexron 6?

I'll follow GMs service intervals thank you.
Coincidentally my transmission shifts a ton better with fresh fluid in it, and the 100K mile fluid I drained was badly oxidized.
So much for lifetime fluids being better engineered.
Now, do I think you should be doing 5K mile oil changes? No, that's wasteful. Do I think 15K mile intervals are too much? Yes, and oil analysis shows that to be true in my N52. The sweet spot is 7500-8K for my particular motor and driving habits. 10K was a tad too much, 15K is insane.

So what I'm saying is use your best judgment and take samples, not take BMW's word as gospel, because frankly, they don't care once it's passed the warranty period.

BMW does say to change the auto trans fluid at 100,000. Is in the maintenance booklet that comes with the set of manuals. It says to change to coolant as well at 100,000.

[labrador]

Because BMW considers 100K end of life. Yes I think 50k is the better interval as most are driven under servere service. There is only one Dexron VI specification, fully synthetic or not. Change the filter too.

Originally Posted by nsjames

why then does every GM transmission using Dexron 6 state that you should change the fluid at 50K miles for severe use, and change the fluid and filter at 100K miles for normal use, yet BMW says never change it?

It's a GM transmission in my 328, what's special about BMW Dexron 6?

I'll follow GMs service intervals thank you.
Coincidentally my transmission shifts a ton better with fresh fluid in it, and the 100K mile fluid I drained was badly oxidized.
So much for lifetime fluids being better engineered.
Now, do I think you should be doing 5K mile oil changes? No, that's wasteful. Do I think 15K mile intervals are too much? Yes, and oil analysis shows that to be true in my N52. The sweet spot is 7500-8K for my particular motor and driving habits. 10K was a tad too much, 15K is insane.

So what I'm saying is use your best judgment and take samples, not take BMW's word as gospel, because frankly, they don't care once it's passed the warranty period.

[labrador]

This has got to be an outlier for 100-140k miles. That is ridiculously young still. BMW sure needs to engineer in reliability, then again stealer charges do not help. There should not be an excuse building unreliable cars.

Originally Posted by cbi1972

I've driven my 2008 335i from 100k miles to 140k miles over 4 years, and I've spent about $18,000 in stealership maintenance for the privilege. $3000 here, $4000 there, it adds up in a hurry. Fuel pump, coils, plugs, fluid reservoirs, gas tank(!), oil leaks, halo bulb, headlight ballast, idler pulley, fuel injectors necessitating Dinan reflash, you name it.

Prior to this e90, I have had four e30 BMWs, and I probably spent about the same amount over the course of 15 years.

I love the car, and I'm probably going to keep doing this, but I would not recommend this to anybody without cash to burn or a proclivity for doing their own work.

[tlow98]

Originally Posted by labrador

This has got to be an outlier for 100-140k miles. That is ridiculously young still. BMW sure needs to engineer in reliability, then again stealer charges do not help. There should not be an excuse building unreliable cars.

As a dealer maintained 335i I’m not so sure how far outside the bell curve this car could fall. Each dealership repair visit could easily exceed $2500 if you do everything they say.

Friend with a modern 328d was told she should have diff seals and Trans re-sealed because they “weaping”. They might as well have been lying - there was absolutely nothing to worry about, but she was most certainly about to be taken advantage of.

[cbi1972]

Originally Posted by tlow98

As a dealer maintained 335i I’m not so sure how far outside the bell curve this car could fall. Each dealership repair visit could easily exceed $2500 if you do everything they say.

Friend with a modern 328d was told she should have diff seals and Trans re-sealed because they “weaping”. They might as well have been lying - there was absolutely nothing to worry about, but she was most certainly about to be taken advantage of.

There may have been a few fabricated or unnecessary jobs done, but I generally bring it in when I have a symptom I need dealt with. I don't bring it in for an oil change and they tell me I need brakes and transmission. They tell me what is causing my symptom, and what will be involved, and sometimes find extra things, like oil pan and valve cover leaks. I have no knowledge or basis to dispute them, but I could always take it somewhere else.

I think generally, though, there are just a lot of things going wrong.

When I am constantly topping off coolant, and they tell me there is a leak in the coolant reservoir, I okay the replacement. Maybe it's just a rubber ring, and they replace the whole damn tank, I don't know.

I was told they had to take off front bumper to get at a faulty headlight, which I found suspicious, but which has been corroborated by others, so

Check engine light comes on, I take it in, they tell me there's a problem with fuel injectors. Ok, fix it, I say. $$$$$$

[tlow98]

Originally Posted by cbi1972

There may have been a few fabricated or unnecessary jobs done, but I generally bring it in when I have a symptom I need dealt with. They tell me what it is, and what will be involved. I have no knowledge or basis to dispute them, but I could always take it somewhere else.

I think generally, though, there are just a lot of things going wrong.

When I am constantly topping off coolant, and they tell me there is a leak in the coolant reservoir, I okay the replacement. Maybe it's just a rubber ring, and they replace the whole damn tank, I don't know.

I was told they had to take off front bumper to get at a faulty headlight, which I found suspicious, but which has been corroborated by others, so

Check engine light comes on, I take it in, they tell me there's a problem with fuel injectors. Ok, fix it, I say. $$$$$$

All very indicative of high mileage 335i ownership, based on what’s reported around here.

Didn’t mean to indicate you are a car philistine in any way.

Also, bumper removal for faulty light? That’s new to me in BMW world. Audi world pretty routine.

[cbi1972]

Originally Posted by tlow98

All very indicative of high mileage 335i ownership, based on what’s reported around here.

Didn’t mean to indicate you are a car philistine in any way.

Also, bumper removal for faulty light? That’s new to me in BMW world. Audi world pretty routine.

http://www.speedstersource.com/INSTA...ALL_B3_E90.pdf

Step 8.