E90Post
 


 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Wash, Wax, Detailing and Cosmetic protection/repairs > Do you go to touchless car washer for you 3?



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      01-30-2011, 08:14 PM   #45
Ricer X
noted crusty old man
Ricer X's Avatar
United_States
99
Rep
7,859
Posts

Drives: like a man late for work
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: of what?

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2007 335i  [6.76]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dday View Post
That is such bogus info. Show me a source proving that. I've heard people say it can wear down your wax before but you're the first to go so far as to say "it WILL eat away your clear"



As for comments on hand wash, the problem is if someone else is doing it for you you are trusting their wash media is completely clean, which it often is not, so that's why a handwash can cause damage.

These carwashes would go out of business immediately if they were disolving peoples paint. Come on now.

Long ago touchless washes did use some harsher acids but at worst they would remove your wax over time. Modern washes are much more mild. I run my car through a local one and after 8 washes my wax is still holding up.
I trust my detailer, who has done studies on his own. No one said it had an immediate effect, and no, I have no imperical evidence of my own. He has nothing to gain as I don't use him for washes and he knows this. I wash my own. However, if the detergents are strong enough to loosen and remove some of the crap that gets on our cars (bird shit, etc) it makes sense that it would have some effect on your clear over time and use.

You are correct about wash media...which is why I said make sure they are using freshly washed media. Even then, its not 100% just as it may not be in your own home when you do your own wash. But I will take my chances with the occasional surface scratch that can be addressed in a detail then my entire paint finish wearing sooner than expected.

Do what you want, OP asked for opinions. I gave him mine and he is free to listen or not as he feels fit. Its not my car and its not yours.
__________________
Ihsanshaik - X/Vasillalov - X/Nood1es - X/Countless more I can't recall - X
Nobama 2012
Appreciate 0
      01-30-2011, 08:59 PM   #46
dday
Captain
33
Rep
856
Posts

Drives: 2014 Alpine White 335 M-Sport
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MA

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFV335i View Post
I trust my detailer, who has done studies on his own. No one said it had an immediate effect, and no, I have no imperical evidence of my own. He has nothing to gain as I don't use him for washes and he knows this. I wash my own. However, if the detergents are strong enough to loosen and remove some of the crap that gets on our cars (bird shit, etc) it makes sense that it would have some effect on your clear over time and use.

You are correct about wash media...which is why I said make sure they are using freshly washed media. Even then, its not 100% just as it may not be in your own home when you do your own wash. But I will take my chances with the occasional surface scratch that can be addressed in a detail then my entire paint finish wearing sooner than expected.

Do what you want, OP asked for opinions. I gave him mine and he is free to listen or not as he feels fit. Its not my car and its not yours.
It's more the spread of misinformation. You had said to the OP that it WILL harm his paint, which factually is not true. Google it and you can see that. While your detailer may be great it doesn't mean he's right 100% of the time and this is one case where he gave you some bad info and you passed it on. Not the end of the world by any means but it's good for people to have the right info.

Dish soap strips wax right off your car, but it doesn't hurt your clear so removal of dirt or wax does not automatically equal harm to clear coat.


Up here in the northeast our cars get coated with salt. The salt is going to do much more harm than a touchless wash.
Appreciate 0
      01-30-2011, 09:14 PM   #47
RobNH
Second Lieutenant
RobNH's Avatar
United_States
22
Rep
200
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW M235i xDrive
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New Hampshire

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL View Post
I only trust myself when it comes to washing but if weather doesn't permit maybe a power wash.Watch it with those touch-less drive thru's.....WHEEL DAMAGE,yes i'm serious
Yes, but that's only the ones that have the rails that guide your car through. There are touchless car washes out there, like the one I go to where you drive in - put the car in park, and the laser guided system powers the wash system around the car. Nothing physically ever touches your car.
__________________
Current: 2015 ///M235i xDrive | 8-spd Auto | Glacier Silver/Black | Brushed Aluminum Trim | Cold, Tech, Premium, Driver Assist Packages | Harman/Kardon Surround Sound System

Previous: 2008 E92 335xi Coupe
Previous: 2004 330xi Sedan
Appreciate 0
      01-30-2011, 09:34 PM   #48
dday
Captain
33
Rep
856
Posts

Drives: 2014 Alpine White 335 M-Sport
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MA

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobNH View Post
Yes, but that's only the ones that have the rails that guide your car through. There are touchless car washes out there, like the one I go to where you drive in - put the car in park, and the laser guided system powers the wash system around the car. Nothing physically ever touches your car.
Yup! Use the exact same kind
Appreciate 0
      01-30-2011, 09:44 PM   #49
335is
Private First Class
Canada
19
Rep
120
Posts

Drives: 335is
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

iTrader: (0)

im wondering y is there smoke after i drive thru the dryer after it finished wash my car
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 01:10 AM   #50
Joonsup
Lieutenant General
Joonsup's Avatar
South Korea
317
Rep
17,316
Posts

Drives: E92 M3, E30 325i
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Bay Area

iTrader: (8)

Garage List
2008 BMW M3  [9.50]
If you don't want to wash your own car using the proper two bucket method with proper wash mitts and drying towels, I would take the car to a professional detailer who may offer just a car wash because in the past I've taken my previous car through a gas station car wash with the brushes and it left fine scratches on my paint. I think it's common knowledge for anyone who cares about their car to avoid those types of car washes.

When I first got my bmw, I took it to a couple different "fancy" looking hand car wash places that charged $30 for just a wash. I read the yelp reviews and they were mostly positive so I said why not. You would see porsches and bimmers and other expensive cars there but after the wash I could see hologram swirls on the paint. That's because they didn't always use clean towels after each car, so trapped dirt particles in the fibers of the wash or drying towel would scratch the paint. So since then I avoided these hand car wash facilities. Think about it. They have to get through many cars throughout the day, so I'm sure they are not going to put all their attention and care into your car when there are cars lined up after yours.

The best way to prevent any swirls or holograms is to wash it yourself ESPECIALLY if you have a dark colored car. A quality detail ending with a good layer of wax/sealant will prevent scratches/swirls in between washes as long as you use the correct wash procedure

When I know that my car will need a full exterior detail in the near future, and if I get lazy and don't feel like washing my car, I'll take my car through a laserwash gas station car wash. There is a Chevron near my work that has a laserwash and it does a decent job at getting most of the dirt off for $10. There's no track on the ground, so I don't have to worry about damaging my 19 inch wheels, and as you enter a high pressure blast of water hits both lower sides of the car. The car goes through two stages of foaming which covers the entire car followed by the high pressure rinse and timed air dry as you exit. But let me remind you that you shouldn't go through a laserwash or other similar types of car washes if you recently had a coat of wax or sealant applied to the car because the harsh chemicals will strip the wax eventually. Hopefully this information helps out some of you.
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 04:55 AM   #51
GreenThree
Colonel
GreenThree's Avatar
206
Rep
2,110
Posts

Drives: 2011 e90
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boston, MA

iTrader: (0)

I used a soft cloth auto car wash with tracks on my last e90. Needless to say, there were fine scratches in the paint. This winter, we have had more salt and sand than I can remember. I hit up the laser touchless every couple if weeks. Sure there is still a very thin film on the car and it is not completely clean, but it does seem to get most of the sand and salt off. I think this is the way to go in the winter, and handwash in the summer, especially with JB!
__________________

2015 335xi | Mineral Grey Metallic | Black Dakota Leather | NAV | SportLine | ZPP | ZDA | ZCW | Munich Build

Retired: 2008, 2011, 2013 328xi
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 06:20 AM   #52
StealYourFace
Lieutenant Colonel
United_States
260
Rep
1,794
Posts

Drives: F30 328i M 6mt, E36 M3
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Shakedown Street, Buffalo NY

iTrader: (1)

I used the touchless by work the other day before I opened up. Got it to work, used some Adams QD to get the remaining residue off then put a coat of Einzette Glanz Wax on. Looked great and will get me through until Spring when I put my summer wheels back on and do a full clay/polish/wax.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 08:40 AM   #53
335BBS
Brigadier General
Canada
55
Rep
3,606
Posts

Drives: 2009 335 coupe.
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Toronto, Ontario

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dday View Post
That is such bogus info. Show me a source proving that. I've heard people say it can wear down your wax before but you're the first to go so far as to say "it WILL eat away your clear"



As for comments on hand wash, the problem is if someone else is doing it for you you are trusting their wash media is completely clean, which it often is not, so that's why a handwash can cause damage.

These carwashes would go out of business immediately if they were disolving peoples paint. Come on now.

Long ago touchless washes did use some harsher acids but at worst they would remove your wax over time. Modern washes are much more mild. I run my car through a local one and after 8 washes my wax is still holding up.
EXACTLY!! This thread is a JOKE. Dealers use the touchless. I have used it for years. Any drive through that touches your car WILL scratch your paint to some degree. If your car is light colored then you probably won't notice it but if its black anybody can see the damage. Unfortunately nothing can clean your car without contact. Salt can be washed away.A good hand wash is the only way.
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 08:43 AM   #54
335BBS
Brigadier General
Canada
55
Rep
3,606
Posts

Drives: 2009 335 coupe.
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Toronto, Ontario

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by StealYourFace View Post
I used the touchless by work the other day before I opened up. Got it to work, used some Adams QD to get the remaining residue off then put a coat of Einzette Glanz Wax on. Looked great and will get me through until Spring when I put my summer wheels back on and do a full clay/polish/wax.
Unfortunately you just scratched the sh&%^ out of your paint. Touchless takes of the loose salt etc. Look at the corners of your windsheild after touchless to see what is left. If you took that off without soap and water you will have left millions of fine scratches. Its all ametter of how picky you are. Know a couple of guys that hand washa nd dry with a leaf blower to avoid more contact with the finish.
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 08:49 AM   #55
dday
Captain
33
Rep
856
Posts

Drives: 2014 Alpine White 335 M-Sport
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MA

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post
Unfortunately you just scratched the sh&%^ out of your paint. Touchless takes of the loose salt etc. Look at the corners of your windsheild after touchless to see what is left. If you took that off without soap and water you will have left millions of fine scratches. Its all ametter of how picky you are. Know a couple of guys that hand washa nd dry with a leaf blower to avoid more contact with the finish.
Sadly you're right, you never want to use any sort of towel on your car unless it's CLEAN.

My take on it is this.

1. Do a good detail and apply sealant/wax in November
2. Use touchless wash a couples times/month during winter to remove salt as best as possible
3. Hope my sealant/wax holds up until warm enough to hand wash
4. Hand wash once I get a warm day an do a full detail
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 09:25 AM   #56
fisherbln
Captain
12
Rep
859
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i Coupe
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: USA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dday View Post
My take on it is this.

1. Do a good detail and apply sealant/wax in November
2. Use touchless wash a couples times/month during winter to remove salt as best as possible
3. Hope my sealant/wax holds up until warm enough to hand wash
4. Hand wash once I get a warm day an do a full detail
I use this method too, but I also do a hand wash any time the temperature is above freezing on the weekend.
__________________
2007 335i SG Coupe
2009 128i AW
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2011, 05:07 PM   #57
StealYourFace
Lieutenant Colonel
United_States
260
Rep
1,794
Posts

Drives: F30 328i M 6mt, E36 M3
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Shakedown Street, Buffalo NY

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post
Unfortunately you just scratched the sh&%^ out of your paint. Touchless takes of the loose salt etc. Look at the corners of your windsheild after touchless to see what is left. If you took that off without soap and water you will have left millions of fine scratches. Its all ametter of how picky you are. Know a couple of guys that hand washa nd dry with a leaf blower to avoid more contact with the finish.
You think so? I sprayed the car really well with the QD (like using it as a dry wash on a fairly clean car) and used a couple clean towels that I sprayed with QD before wiping off.

The car was in my body shop under fairly unforgiving lights and it didn't look scratched up.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2011, 10:36 AM   #58
Bobble
Major
Bobble's Avatar
No_Country
56
Rep
1,232
Posts

Drives: Whatever POS the wife leaves
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by StealYourFace View Post
You think so? I sprayed the car really well with the QD (like using it as a dry wash on a fairly clean car) and used a couple clean towels that I sprayed with QD before wiping off.
Might I suggest instead of the QD substitute a waterless wash (ONR or PB S&W) then something with a wax or sealant boost like Optimum Spray Wax or Aqua Wax or a QD with a wax. That way you will get in clean and mimizes the scratches (the ONR or PB have more lubricating agents and cleaners in them) and add a boost of protection with the spray wax addition. Of course this is all based on you polish and seal right prior to winter. Will take you 20 minutes instead of 10 but seems safer in the long run but heck I don't live where there's a real winter so 20 minutes may be too long.
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2011, 12:06 PM   #59
pHo_e92
Captain
pHo_e92's Avatar
Canada
32
Rep
878
Posts

Drives: SGM e92
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: 905

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
2008 BMW 335i  [7.26]
2000 BMW 323i  [6.00]
1997 Honda Civic HB  [10.00]
2007 BMW X5 4.8  [10.00]
i get free car washes at a soft-cloth wash cause i use to work there and the owners are cool with me. i get to park my car to the side and grab the clean towels to dry my car myself!
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2011, 12:13 PM   #60
dday
Captain
33
Rep
856
Posts

Drives: 2014 Alpine White 335 M-Sport
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MA

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pHo_e92 View Post
i get free car washes at a soft-cloth wash cause i use to work there and the owners are cool with me. i get to park my car to the side and grab the clean towels to dry my car myself!
Anything that uses cloths in the wash is going to do small amounts of damage over time. The cloths might be soft but the sand caught in them is not.
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2011, 01:29 PM   #61
pHo_e92
Captain
pHo_e92's Avatar
Canada
32
Rep
878
Posts

Drives: SGM e92
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: 905

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
2008 BMW 335i  [7.26]
2000 BMW 323i  [6.00]
1997 Honda Civic HB  [10.00]
2007 BMW X5 4.8  [10.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dday View Post
Anything that uses cloths in the wash is going to do small amounts of damage over time. The cloths might be soft but the sand caught in them is not.
ya i know what you mean but i cant complain its FREE!. plus i have paint protection so hopefully that will help reduce the damage: haha.
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2011, 01:29 PM   #62
Dr. G
Major General
Dr. G's Avatar
277
Rep
5,062
Posts

Drives: Black e92 335i
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brampton, Ontario

iTrader: (32)

Garage List
e92 BMW 335i  [8.84]
Its surprising how many people I see messing up their paint when I goto car washes.

I see people pull out of the touchless, pull out some old tiny microfiber then dry down the whole car, then apply tons of sprays to the car.

I ALWAYS see someone with paper towels drying their car with it:| or their windows.


The stuff you see on a nice day in winter at the car wash is amazing.
__________________
JB4 / OSS Angel Eyes / Downpipes / F1-Racewerks FMIC / Custom Meth Kit / BMS DCI / ER Chargepipe / HKS BOV / BMS Meth Elbow / BMW Performance Exhaust / Carbon Fiber Inlay Quad Tips / 19" Miro 111 / Front Aero Lip / M3 Sides / VRS CSL Trunk / Mtech Rear / DD CF Quad Finned Diffuser / LCI Tails / BBK / Smoked Reflectors / F1 Euphoria LED Interior / License LED's / GT 5000k Corners / 5000k HID Fogs / Air Scoops / LED Turn Signals / FK Silverline Coilovers / HPA endlinks / Vibrant Resonators / Osram CBI 5000k D1S
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2011, 09:13 PM   #63
MuttGrunt
Banned
United_States
27
Rep
872
Posts

Drives: beater;)
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: SE Michigan

iTrader: (0)

There is so much bad or misleading information in this thread I don't know where to begin. I'm not even sure what to comment on.

Every time you touch your clear coat, you're putting it at risk to be damaged with marring, swirls, and scratches. It doesn't matter what products or tools you use: higher quality products help to reduce risk, but there's no such thing as completely eliminating all risk.

Touchless washes strip your protection, which allows for etching damage and water spots to happen much more easily. Their harsh chemicals also aren't good for plastic and rubber trim.

Even air can cause damage much like touching your car can: it's not the air/microfiber/car duster/water blade/jelly blade/etc itself - it's what happens if there's any single grain of dirt. A single grain of dirt causes pitting type damage to your clear coat when it meets your vehicle at any velocity. Don't believe me? Drive 150 miles and hour and have a bucket of sand throw at your vehicle. At 70 miles an hour the damage is greatly reduced...but not completely eliminated.

The answer to car care is what is "better" not what is "best" as there isn't a best. There isn't perfect. There is only what level of damage and how many imperfections are acceptable to you. The only perfect is in a sterile air-free environment of protection in which your vehicle isn't moved after being perfectly polished.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 11:33 AM   #64
1sicke92
Captain
1sicke92's Avatar
69
Rep
656
Posts

Drives: 09 E92 N54
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Long Beach, CA

iTrader: (0)

your car will get scratched if you don't know what the fuck you are doing. even if you wash your car at home and dip your wash cloth in the soap bucket, EVERY TIME, without washing off the residue of grit into another clean water bucket. It is common sense and it WILL happen. Just be cautious, and patient. As for the "touchless" car wash it really depends on the soap compounds they use in the wash. Some use very friendly soaps and others use more commercial, and abrassive soaps( with a lower pH levels, making it more acidic, thus more of an enemy to your precious clear coat.) Conclusion: Wash your own car if you can. If not, go to a "reputable" touchless, i guess??? lol
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 11:36 AM   #65
Delta0311
Banned
7476
Rep
10,120
Posts

Drives: 2011 BMW 335xi E92 2016 228xi
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NJ

iTrader: (1)

I got to a spot near me that hand washes and hand dries the car for you. It's $20 and they do a good job.
Appreciate 0
      03-15-2011, 09:56 AM   #66
darkrom
Colonel
darkrom's Avatar
United_States
187
Rep
2,206
Posts

Drives: 135i
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: North Shore MA

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuttGrunt View Post
There is so much bad or misleading information in this thread I don't know where to begin. I'm not even sure what to comment on.

Every time you touch your clear coat, you're putting it at risk to be damaged with marring, swirls, and scratches. It doesn't matter what products or tools you use: higher quality products help to reduce risk, but there's no such thing as completely eliminating all risk.

Touchless washes strip your protection, which allows for etching damage and water spots to happen much more easily. Their harsh chemicals also aren't good for plastic and rubber trim.

Even air can cause damage much like touching your car can: it's not the air/microfiber/car duster/water blade/jelly blade/etc itself - it's what happens if there's any single grain of dirt. A single grain of dirt causes pitting type damage to your clear coat when it meets your vehicle at any velocity. Don't believe me? Drive 150 miles and hour and have a bucket of sand throw at your vehicle. At 70 miles an hour the damage is greatly reduced...but not completely eliminated.

The answer to car care is what is "better" not what is "best" as there isn't a best. There isn't perfect. There is only what level of damage and how many imperfections are acceptable to you. The only perfect is in a sterile air-free environment of protection in which your vehicle isn't moved after being perfectly polished.

Brilliant response. Also, I think people need to take the environment into account. Personally I use a touchless wash here in Massachusetts quite often. It leaves the car cleaner than I can do myself (not a detailer at all) and more importantly there is no chance of anything being scratched. If you are worried about the clearcoat, that's what sealant and waxes are for. Here in MA I'd take my chances with it "ruining my clearcoat" (something that is yet to happen on any car I've taken there) rather than letting salt and sand build up under the car. I'd rather have my clearcoat at 95% original strength or whatever slight reduction you MAY get from using supposed harsh chemicals, than letting sand and salt eat away the bottom of my car, something that has been proven WILL happen if left there to cake in.
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:15 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST