E90Post
 


Extreme Powerhouse
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N57 / M57 Turbo Diesel Discussions - 335d > No start but turns over



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-01-2016, 11:02 PM   #1
WreckerX5d
Warrant Officer
WreckerX5d's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
1,347
Posts

Drives: Deezul
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (4)

No start but turns over

So my car got stuck just now, was about to leave and it won't start. It cranks over yet no fuel gets to the engine. It was running completely fine before that. What could cause this? I did have an undercarriage wash earlier but that's the only change. Hopefully it drys out tomorrow and will start back up, or at least the ECU resets and sleeps.

My luck so far this year has been damn shitty (other than Bohl replacing my DPF and ECU).
__________________
Deleted, ATM I/C and tuned by B.R.R.
Appreciate 1
      02-02-2016, 05:55 AM   #2
Mik325tds
Major
Mik325tds's Avatar
United_States
654
Rep
1,081
Posts

Drives: 335d M-Sport
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Greater Detroit

iTrader: (0)

That is strange. Whitbread had the same problem a couple of months ago. We read the fuel pressure with Ediabas and there was nothing. We then swapped the pressure regulator valve on the pump itself with mine, still no start. After swapping back we packed in for the night. After a little while Matt tried a last time before leaving the shop and she started right up as if nothing ever happened. We never found root cause.
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 06:31 AM   #3
HeatherM35d
Second Lieutenant
99
Rep
250
Posts

Drives: X5d and 335d
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: upstate NY

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrecker335d
So my car got stuck just now, was about to leave and it won't start. It cranks over yet no fuel gets to the engine. It was running completely fine before that. What could cause this? I did have an undercarriage wash earlier but that's the only change. Hopefully it drys out tomorrow and will start back up, or at least the ECU resets and sleeps.

My luck so far this year has been damn shitty (other than Bohl replacing my DPF and ECU).
Try pulling the quick connect fuel fitting from driverside down low. Put it in a bottle or something of the sort and have someone hit the start button, to key on, and then try cranking..check and see if you've got fuel spraying out of that line
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 07:43 AM   #4
BB_cuda
Brigadier General
BB_cuda's Avatar
587
Rep
3,075
Posts

Drives: 2011 335D Msport, 2013 X5D
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Clear Lake, Texas

iTrader: (0)

IGNORE THIS IF YOU HADN'T MESSED WITH FUEL FILTER LATELY:

Did anyone mess with connection from lifting pump to fuel pump module? When trying to power my pump directly, I FUBAR'd the contacts in the connector and then car wouldn't start. Changed contacts and it was like nothing bad had ever happened? I recall Whitbread did the direct power to pump method with an ATV battery but didn't know if he powered directly to pump's pins or through the connector. Before changing the contact pins, the fit between connector and module was loosey goosey. After pin change, connection felt pretty solid.

Heather wants you to show that the lifting pump is providing flow to inlet of filter.

Last edited by BB_cuda; 02-02-2016 at 08:07 AM..
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 08:33 AM   #5
HeatherM35d
Second Lieutenant
99
Rep
250
Posts

Drives: X5d and 335d
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: upstate NY

iTrader: (0)

I'm actually referring to the quick connect fitting after the fuel filter before the hpfp, it's possible to reach with a car in a parking lot standing up top
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 09:33 AM   #6
335dsleeper
Banned
356
Rep
1,633
Posts

Drives: 09' 335d 10'35D
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Suffolk, va

iTrader: (0)

Sorry about you situation. If you can, pull your rear seat and verify you have power to you fuel pump and verify its pumping. If not, its most likely the relay, which you can make a jumper wire for. Or maybe the fuel pump.

I recently did preventative fuel pump swaps on both my 335d and my 35D and to my surprise, the 35D had been drawing too much amperage causing the 12v positive wire to melt and had melted the the plastic housing on the pump. It was a matter of time before it left me stranded. So, pop the seat and and remove the 4-10mm nuts on the passenger side access cover. You'll see the fuel pump and wiring there. You should be able to determine if the pump is pumping and if you have power to the pump.

I have my old fuel pump I can send you if you need to try it.
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 4
      02-02-2016, 09:46 AM   #7
TDIwyse
Colonel
590
Rep
2,410
Posts

Drives: 2011 335d
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: MidWest

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 335dsleeper View Post
Sorry about you situation. If you can, pull your rear seat and verify you have power to you fuel pump and verify its pumping. If not, its most likely the relay, which you can make a jumper wire for. Or maybe the fuel pump.

I recently did preventative fuel pump swaps on both my 335d and my 35D and to my surprise, the 35D had been drawing too much amperage causing the 12v positive wire to melt and had melted the the plastic housing on the pump. It was a matter of time before it left me stranded. So, pop the seat and and remove the 4-10mm nuts on the passenger side access cover. You'll see the fuel pump and wiring there. You should be able to determine if the pump is pumping and if you have power to the pump.

I have my old fuel pump I can send you if you need to try it.
Wow. Thanks for posting this. Should be helpful to others as our vehicles age. Weird stuff like this can be a pain in the arse to debug...
__________________
2011 335d 11.68 @ 125.71 mph 1/4 mile NHRA certified track
Ram Cummins with lots-o-mods
Appreciate 1
      02-02-2016, 01:01 PM   #8
WreckerX5d
Warrant Officer
WreckerX5d's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
1,347
Posts

Drives: Deezul
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for the replies everyone. I'll look into this today before work (car is currently stuck there lol).
__________________
Deleted, ATM I/C and tuned by B.R.R.
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 01:12 PM   #9
335dsleeper
Banned
356
Rep
1,633
Posts

Drives: 09' 335d 10'35D
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Suffolk, va

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDIwyse View Post
Wow. Thanks for posting this. Should be helpful to others as our vehicles age. Weird stuff like this can be a pain in the arse to debug...
No problem.
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 06:19 PM   #10
Mik325tds
Major
Mik325tds's Avatar
United_States
654
Rep
1,081
Posts

Drives: 335d M-Sport
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Greater Detroit

iTrader: (0)

Fuel pump was not the problem in Whitbread 's case. We were able to activate it with Ediabas and could hear the fuel flowing, but nothing after the HPFP. So our thought was that it is either the bypass valve on the HPFP or the regulator on the fuel rail.
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 06:28 PM   #11
BB_cuda
Brigadier General
BB_cuda's Avatar
587
Rep
3,075
Posts

Drives: 2011 335D Msport, 2013 X5D
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Clear Lake, Texas

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatherM35d View Post
I'm actually referring to the quick connect fitting after the fuel filter before the hpfp, it's possible to reach with a car in a parking lot standing up top
Sorry heather. You were pointing an easier place to access than FF inlet.
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 06:43 PM   #12
WreckerX5d
Warrant Officer
WreckerX5d's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
1,347
Posts

Drives: Deezul
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (4)

So I did a little diagnosing before work, there's no power to the pump, and maybe some power to the tiny module that connects to the pump (my battery didn't last long enough). I'm gonna pull that apart tomorrow and see if anything is wrong with it.

At least power is somewhat easy to determine. I'll update my findings later on. It sucks I work full time and go to school full time so this will be annoying lol
__________________
Deleted, ATM I/C and tuned by B.R.R.
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 10:02 PM   #13
335dsleeper
Banned
356
Rep
1,633
Posts

Drives: 09' 335d 10'35D
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Suffolk, va

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrecker335d View Post
So I did a little diagnosing before work, there's no power to the pump, and maybe some power to the tiny module that connects to the pump (my battery didn't last long enough). I'm gonna pull that apart tomorrow and see if anything is wrong with it.

At least power is somewhat easy to determine. I'll update my findings later on. It sucks I work full time and go to school full time so this will be annoying lol
How did you check power? If its already primed you may have to crank the car to get 12v to the pump. I not sure though...
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2016, 11:29 PM   #14
WreckerX5d
Warrant Officer
WreckerX5d's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
1,347
Posts

Drives: Deezul
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (4)

I cranked the car and it didn't show any voltage readings.

I did a continuity test on the input/output for that little box, the negative shows a ping and the positive doesn't display anything. I opened it up but saw no obvious signs of an open circuit, so I'll just get a new one and hope it works.
__________________
Deleted, ATM I/C and tuned by B.R.R.
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2016, 05:33 AM   #15
Mik325tds
Major
Mik325tds's Avatar
United_States
654
Rep
1,081
Posts

Drives: 335d M-Sport
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Greater Detroit

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrecker335d View Post
I cranked the car and it didn't show any voltage readings.

I did a continuity test on the input/output for that little box, the negative shows a ping and the positive doesn't display anything. I opened it up but saw no obvious signs of an open circuit, so I'll just get a new one and hope it works.
Did you check your fuses?
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2016, 06:02 AM   #16
Persian Whisperjet
Kind of a Big Deal
United_States
132
Rep
809
Posts

Drives: 2011 335d
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Washington, D.C.

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mik325tds View Post
Fuel pump was not the problem in Whitbread 's case. We were able to activate it with Ediabas and could hear the fuel flowing, but nothing after the HPFP. So our thought was that it is either the bypass valve on the HPFP or the regulator on the fuel rail.
Mik what is the job name for priming the lift pump in EDIABAS?
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2016, 01:03 PM   #17
WreckerX5d
Warrant Officer
WreckerX5d's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
1,347
Posts

Drives: Deezul
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (4)

Fuses are good (when have those ever blown, lol), power goes into the module. 98% sure it's the module, part # (16147407513). They're $250.

My friend mentioned that the module tends to be the first thing to go out in a fuel related issue.
__________________
Deleted, ATM I/C and tuned by B.R.R.

Last edited by WreckerX5d; 02-03-2016 at 10:43 PM..
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2016, 05:01 PM   #18
Mik325tds
Major
Mik325tds's Avatar
United_States
654
Rep
1,081
Posts

Drives: 335d M-Sport
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Greater Detroit

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Persian Whisperjet View Post
Mik what is the job name for priming the lift pump in EDIABAS?
Look here:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...2&postcount=90
Appreciate 1
      02-03-2016, 06:54 PM   #19
torqueisking
Private First Class
Canada
27
Rep
138
Posts

Drives: 335D Sport and X5 35D
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 335dsleeper View Post
Sorry about you situation. If you can, pull your rear seat and verify you have power to you fuel pump and verify its pumping. If not, its most likely the relay, which you can make a jumper wire for. Or maybe the fuel pump.

I recently did preventative fuel pump swaps on both my 335d and my 35D and to my surprise, the 35D had been drawing too much amperage causing the 12v positive wire to melt and had melted the the plastic housing on the pump. It was a matter of time before it left me stranded. So, pop the seat and and remove the 4-10mm nuts on the passenger side access cover. You'll see the fuel pump and wiring there. You should be able to determine if the pump is pumping and if you have power to the pump.

I have my old fuel pump I can send you if you need to try it.

Thanks for the heads up on this. Any idea what current the pump should draw?
Appreciate 0
      02-04-2016, 07:35 PM   #20
BB_cuda
Brigadier General
BB_cuda's Avatar
587
Rep
3,075
Posts

Drives: 2011 335D Msport, 2013 X5D
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Clear Lake, Texas

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by torqueisking View Post
Thanks for the heads up on this. Any idea what current the pump should draw?
When i used a 12V battery with an inline fuse, a 4 amp slow blow would last about 12 seconds. Eventualy, ran it straight to pump pins with no fuse and ran for 2 minutes to purge air out after FF change. YMMV
Appreciate 1
      02-05-2016, 03:00 PM   #21
WreckerX5d
Warrant Officer
WreckerX5d's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
1,347
Posts

Drives: Deezul
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (4)

I replaced the module, no success. idrive gives an error of fuel pump now (it didn't before). Could this be a coding issue or the pump itself? I don't believe I had any issues with the current pump, although I am unsure of the symptoms of a dying pump.
__________________
Deleted, ATM I/C and tuned by B.R.R.
Appreciate 0
      02-05-2016, 03:25 PM   #22
BB_cuda
Brigadier General
BB_cuda's Avatar
587
Rep
3,075
Posts

Drives: 2011 335D Msport, 2013 X5D
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Clear Lake, Texas

iTrader: (0)

Something like this? This is what I got after mucking up the module contacts that connect to pump's wiring harness.
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:26 PM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST