[SennaZ]

I'm not sure in this very long thread if this has been mentioned, but one can file an online complaint with the NHTSA. My understanding is that most of the time the complaints are simply tabulated and no action is taken until a certain number is reached, but with the number of members on this forum, I'm sure some great numbers could be generated.

For those interested the online complaint form can be found here:

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/Consumer.cfm


Edited to add: because these complaints are supposed to involve safety issues, you should mention (as others have commented in this thread) that drivability is compromised and that low speed passing in heavy traffic has been made more dangerous - and other characteristics that made the car unpredictable when driving it.

[slubu]

Originally Posted by RBBMWE46M3

I want to say this...after yesterday it is very and I mean VERY IMPORTANT that everyone in here document the fact that BMW advertises "we have eliminated turbo lag altogether". If anyone goes for a ride with the BMW engineers and the customer relation people, don't try to give them the "I know over 50 people on a forum" or "Autoblog has an article" keep it as simple as showing them the lag and showing them the page of BMW's ad that says "we have eliminated lag altogether" and simply state FIX IT. After all the crap I tried to get through to them yesterday, they were VERY forceful with me trying to tell me that:

1. Q. What kind of gas do you use? A. I use nothing but Amoco Ultimate. R. Well we have lots of problems with people who use Amoco Ultimate, its bad gas...

2. Q. Did you test drive a step or man (my car is a 6spman) A. I test drove a step. R. Well a step is different than a man it is faster...(that is really what they said)

3. Q. Did you do anything to your car (tune, mod) A. Absolutely not.

"Do you know of anyone else with a turbo lag problem"
I swear to God I asked them this question as we were riding in my car and there response was "You are the first"
Another thing that floored me was they ripped this forum. They told me that they have "several" people on this forum who watch and read what we communicate with each other. "Its allot of FALLACY" was there response...


THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THIS WHOLE PAGE......................................


Ok, we were sitting in the car and after all the temper flaring and over talking (which the customer relation guy was a professional at) I got to the simple point which was..."I have turbo lag. BMW advertises that they have eliminated lag altogether" There response was, and for the love of God please read this carefully....

"WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT BMW HAS ELIMINATED TURBO LAG?" I tell them "I got it off of BMWNA website" They say "Really, we don't believe you" I say "lets go inside and log on and Ill show you" they say "ok" We get a sales associate and he gets us an empty booth and I log on and show them the page where it says "we have eliminated lag altogether"

They hung there heads in DEFEAT. After all the crap we went through, there attitudes changed after I pressed the magic button on that computer. "Mr. Hoosier, we are going to blah, blah, blah...Really take care of you..

That being said...If you go for a ride, keep it civil and simple to the fact that they advertise no lag and you have it. Go no farther. Tell them to "fix it" "I'm not happy"

PM me with any questions

I still don't have a feeling weather they will fix this or not. The engineer told me that he did not know of any new ecu upgrade in the future. Europe has much different programs than the USA cause the "emissions are different and other things"

"IN FACT WE HAVE ELIMINATED TURBO LAG ALTOGETHER" ------BULLSHIT!!!

I think you just nailed it on the head right there.

[tryangles]

Originally Posted by RBBMWE46M3

I want to say this...after yesterday it is very and I mean VERY IMPORTANT that everyone in here document the fact that BMW advertises "we have eliminated turbo lag altogether". If anyone goes for a ride with the BMW engineers and the customer relation people, don't try to give them the "I know over 50 people on a forum" or "Autoblog has an article" keep it as simple as showing them the lag and showing them the page of BMW's ad that says "we have eliminated lag altogether" and simply state FIX IT. After all the crap I tried to get through to them yesterday, they were VERY forceful with me trying to tell me that:

1. Q. What kind of gas do you use? A. I use nothing but Amoco Ultimate. R. Well we have lots of problems with people who use Amoco Ultimate, its bad gas...

2. Q. Did you test drive a step or man (my car is a 6spman) A. I test drove a step. R. Well a step is different than a man it is faster...(that is really what they said)

3. Q. Did you do anything to your car (tune, mod) A. Absolutely not.

"Do you know of anyone else with a turbo lag problem"
I swear to God I asked them this question as we were riding in my car and there response was "You are the first"
Another thing that floored me was they ripped this forum. They told me that they have "several" people on this forum who watch and read what we communicate with each other. "Its allot of FALLACY" was there response...


THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THIS WHOLE PAGE......................................


Ok, we were sitting in the car and after all the temper flaring and over talking (which the customer relation guy was a professional at) I got to the simple point which was..."I have turbo lag. BMW advertises that they have eliminated lag altogether" There response was, and for the love of God please read this carefully....

"WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT BMW HAS ELIMINATED TURBO LAG?" I tell them "I got it off of BMWNA website" They say "Really, we don't believe you" I say "lets go inside and log on and Ill show you" they say "ok" We get a sales associate and he gets us an empty booth and I log on and show them the page where it says "we have eliminated lag altogether"

They hung there heads in DEFEAT. After all the crap we went through, there attitudes changed after I pressed the magic button on that computer. "Mr. Hoosier, we are going to blah, blah, blah...Really take care of you..

That being said...If you go for a ride, keep it civil and simple to the fact that they advertise no lag and you have it. Go no farther. Tell them to "fix it" "I'm not happy"

PM me with any questions

I still don't have a feeling weather they will fix this or not. The engineer told me that he did not know of any new ecu upgrade in the future. Europe has much different programs than the USA cause the "emissions are different and other things"

"IN FACT WE HAVE ELIMINATED TURBO LAG ALTOGETHER" ------BULLSHIT!!!

props go to you for taking it this far man. Thanks for keeping us all informed about the situation.

[Cobu]

Thanks for the great post RBBMWE46M3. I have an appt. schedule with my dealer on Monday and will do exactly what you said in your write up. I am afraid though that they will not be able to do anything about the turbo lag (unless willing to download the old s/w version - which I highly doubt they'll do). I am also afraid that this saga will have to end in a buyback or some deal of that nature as I will not be willing to continue to make payments for altered performance car. That Audi 5 series will the entire sudden look like a much more attractive option.

My question to you is - have you noticed the difference in car performance with cold vs. warm engine ? The reason I am asking is that in order for me to show them the turbo lag I will have to have the engine warmed up to aprox 220F. Dealership is very close to my house and I might not reach that temp by the time I get there or whenever it is that they decide to take the car for a ride. So - I will have to specifically tell them to keep driving past the 220F temp to notice the turbo lag.

[paltomare]

Originally Posted by Cobu

Thanks for the great post RBBMWE46M3. I have an appt. schedule with my dealer on Monday and will do exactly what you said in your write up. I am afraid though that they will not be able to do anything about the turbo lag (unless willing to download the old s/w version - which I highly doubt they'll do). I am also afraid that this saga will have to end in a buyback or some deal of that nature as I will not be willing to continue to make payments for altered performance car. That Audi 5 series will the entire sudden look like a much more attractive option.

My question to you is - have you noticed the difference in car performance with cold vs. warm engine ? The reason I am asking is that in order for me to show them the turbo lag I will have to have the engine warmed up to aprox 220F. Dealership is very close to my house and I might not reach that temp by the time I get there or whenever it is that they decide to take the car for a ride. So - I will have to specifically tell them to keep driving past the 220F temp to notice the turbo lag.

FYI,
I have not noticed a difference in a cold or warm engine. I have lag all of the time since the s/w upgrade. I live in Long Beach, CA. This morning I started my car, drove 1 block to the beach parking lot, put it in DS, turned off DTC/DSC and the air cond. and floored it....lag big time; previously the wheels would break loose, but no more. It was about 70 degrees here this morning. Needless to say it set my mood for the day....bastards!

[RBBMWE46M3]

Originally Posted by paltomare

FYI,
I have not noticed a difference in a cold or warm engine. I have lag all of the time since the s/w upgrade. I live in Long Beach, CA. This morning I started my car, drove 1 block to the beach parking lot, put it in DS, turned off DTC/DSC and the air cond. and floored it....lag big time; previously the wheels would break loose, but no more. It was about 70 degrees here this morning. Needless to say it set my mood for the day....bastards!

Unfourtanalty, me either. My car has lag when it is cold and when it is warm. It does sound a little better when it is warmed up ( a little throatier) but no difference when cold to warm.

[Kruz]

Page 49 and to be honest Ive read only 20 some pages....can someone please summarize which 335is are affected here?

I have a July 07 6MT production and I believe my Idrive main screen is brown. I was in for an oil change a few weeks back and insisted they did not reprogram anything since everthing is working fine and I do not believe I have lag. When running through the gearbox and not powershiting, the acceleration is smooth and linear. I hear the turbos whistling from about 1500rpms as well.

The 08 335xi coupe (step) loaner they gave me though may have had the lag. It did not have Idrive, but when floored (button pushed under throttle) it REALLY seemed to push me back all of a sudden over 3,000 rpms. This was either lag or the auto downshifting 2 gears much faster than I can or want to do manually. I noticed the tach sweep really fast to redline. I also noticed the loaner had a slightly meaner growl from the exhaust.

Do these conditions point to my car not having 29.2 and the loaner having it?



My car

[slubu]

Originally Posted by paltomare

FYI,
I have not noticed a difference in a cold or warm engine. I have lag all of the time since the s/w upgrade. I live in Long Beach, CA. This morning I started my car, drove 1 block to the beach parking lot, put it in DS, turned off DTC/DSC and the air cond. and floored it....lag big time; previously the wheels would break loose, but no more. It was about 70 degrees here this morning. Needless to say it set my mood for the day....bastards!

paltomare, would you be interested in comparing cars? i live not to far away from you, i am interested in seeing what the automatics are like. Can you drive 6MT?

[shaddai]

Originally Posted by RBBMWE46M3

Unfourtanalty, me either. My car has lag when it is cold and when it is warm. It does sound a little better when it is warmed up ( a little throatier) but no difference when cold to warm.

+1 - severity of lag is independent of engine temperature.

[ezatnova]

Originally Posted by RBBMWE46M3

Unfourtanalty, me either. My car has lag when it is cold and when it is warm. It does sound a little better when it is warmed up ( a little throatier) but no difference when cold to warm.

+1 to all this business.

[HighVoltage]

Originally Posted by slubu

paltomare, would you be interested in comparing cars? i live not to far away from you, i am interested in seeing what the automatics are like. Can you drive 6MT?

Its a problem with the 6AT as well. I have also noticed a difference in throttle response/power between cold and warmed up but the lag is constant. I purchased mine as a CPO (07 335i w/8000 mi) but I am fairly certain the software was updated prior to purchasing because the AT6 I test drove months earlier did not exhibit this lag.

[Cobu]

Well, I certainly feel a huge difference when the engine gets warmer. I almost just look forward to the first 5-10 minutes of driving as it brings back memories of once an explosive beast. I have a May 2007 335i 6MT build ... for what it's worth.

[paltomare]

Slubu, I did the comparo thing already, as High Voltage states, seems to be a problem with both

[clivem2]

Excellent post RBBMWE46M3. I'm in the UK, I'm interested to find out whether the European map is different to the US one, which presumably takes CA emissions laws into account. My E93, a July build, is to be delivered on the 9th - it has 30.0.2 installed. They won't quite get v31 in time but they are willing to install it once I have a some miles on the car. The car I test drove for 2 days was an April build so this should have had the lag, I don't believe it did but I wasn't looking for it (I've run a laggy turbo some years back).

It's interesting that European BMW sites don't claim lag free performance for the N94, highly responsive etc but they don't quite say they've eliminated lag. This is surprising as the US is more litigious than Europe so I'd expect the BMW US to be more cautious with their claims.

[dmboone25]

So, I just got off the phone with Dan at BMWNA again....it seems as though it will now be 45-60 days to see my regional tech. And there is no set schedule. And I was told that I would not be allowed to speak to him/her when they were at the dealer.

So I ask--what if the regional tech tells me that there is no problem? He says--well that is basically the end of the line--there is no one else to complain to. When you complain to the dealer--they hook you up to machines which say there is no problem. They take a ride in your car that drives like other cars on the lot. They tell you to contact BMWNA--that is all they can do....on the other end, BMWNA, who I am contracted with, tells me to use my relationship at the dealer to solve the problem....which is hilarious--around and around we go.....

So, meanwhile, as I wait the 45-60 days for the RT to show up, who I can't ride with or talk to in order to explain my complaint in detail, I get to make two more payments on a car that acts fundamentally different than the one I made my purchasing decision on, and the finger-pointing between BMW and my dealer continues....

I tell you what, if this is not cleared up, and it won't be, and they don't take care of me, and they won't, I guess that will be it for my Roundel purchases. I have tried to stay level-headed and let the process play out before feeling this way--but there seems to be no remedy in my future. I keep getting told I am an anomoly with this problem (not that it should matter) and so now they are acting like it is all in my head.

32 months remaining on the lease, and I couldn't be more dissatisfied......

[Prof3ssor]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

So, I just got off the phone with Dan at BMWNA again....it seems as though it will now be 45-60 days to see my regional tech. And there is no set schedule. And I was told that I would not be allowed to speak to him/her when they were at the dealer.

So I ask--what if the regional tech tells me that there is no problem? He says--well that is basically the end of the line--there is no one else to complain to. When you complain to the dealer--they hook you up to machines which say there is no problem. They take a ride in your car that drives like other cars on the lot. They tell you to contact BMWNA--that is all they can do....on the other end, BMWNA, who I am contracted with, tells me to use my relationship at the dealer to solve the problem....which is hilarious--around and around we go.....

So, meanwhile, as I wait the 45-60 days for the RT to show up, who I can't ride with or talk to in order to explain my complaint in detail, I get to make two more payments on a car that acts fundamentally different than the one I made my purchasing decision on, and the finger-pointing between BMW and my dealer continues....

I tell you what, if this is not cleared up, and it won't be, and they don't take care of me, and they won't, I guess that will be it for my Roundel purchases. I have tried to stay level-headed and let the process play out before feeling this way--but there seems to be no remedy in my future. I keep getting told I am an anomoly with this problem (not that it should matter) and so now they are acting like it is all in my head.

32 months remaining on the lease, and I couldn't be more dissatisfied......

Bro I feel your pain. I should take a picture of all the shit my BMWNA rep sent me. Jackets, backpack, umbrella, etc. They are basically trying to get rid of me by sending me material shit. I call everyday and everyday I ask if anyone else reported this and they say "no." I just want to drop the car off and never look back. My rep already drove the car and reported no issues so I am at the end of the line. This is my 1st BMW and will be my last after the way this issue has been handled by my dealership and BMWNA.

[slubu]

I'd urge you all to keep a diary of sort of what you are going through. Especially with respect to the payments you are making.

[Mr. 5]

I'm just going to chime in here and give my experience with the 29.2.
I was actually very surprised because I've read so much about how bad it sucks.
I drove Slubu's car about a week ago and I felt the lag, but it really wasn't that bad. There was a tad bit of lag, but I was expecting a huge difference.
I offered to give him a ride in mine but he didn't want to feel what he was missing. I honestly don't know if he would have felt much of a difference except for the DPs and more power since I don't have the 29.2 program. But, as far as the lag, I was thinking that mine was just a tad quicker to react.

I really am sympathetic to those who are going through these frustrations but unless some cars are behaving much differently than Slubu's, I'm wondering if some are making a much bigger deal than they should.

[PiperG]

My car was a 3/08 build, so I'm almost certain it came with 29.2 and V81. Down low it simply isn't the same car as 3000k and above. Having said that, it doesn't bother me as much as the other guys because this car is STILL pretty darn fast. I'd rather give up some low end power and have my motor last me longer, but that's just me.........

[tek818]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

I'm just going to chime in here and give my experience with the 29.2.
I was actually very surprised because I've read so much about how bad it sucks.
I drove Slubu's car about a week ago and I felt the lag, but it really wasn't that bad. There was a tad bit of lag, but I was expecting a huge difference.
I offered to give him a ride in mine but he didn't want to feel what he was missing. I honestly don't know if he would have felt much of a difference except for the DPs and more power since I don't have the 29.2 program. But, as far as the lag, I was thinking that mine was just a tad quicker to react.

I really am sympathetic to those who are going through these frustrations but unless some cars are behaving much differently than Slubu's, I'm wondering if some are making a much bigger deal than they should.

I should've let you drive my car when it was extremely laggy... I can certainly attest to the validity of the claims made in this thread. The measurement of the wastegate duty cycle is hard evidence...

[slubu]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

I'm just going to chime in here and give my experience with the 29.2.
I was actually very surprised because I've read so much about how bad it sucks.
I drove Slubu's car about a week ago and I felt the lag, but it really wasn't that bad. There was a tad bit of lag, but I was expecting a huge difference.
I offered to give him a ride in mine but he didn't want to feel what he was missing. I honestly don't know if he would have felt much of a difference except for the DPs and more power since I don't have the 29.2 program. But, as far as the lag, I was thinking that mine was just a tad quicker to react.

I really am sympathetic to those who are going through these frustrations but unless some cars are behaving much differently than Slubu's, I'm wondering if some are making a much bigger deal than they should.

I agree, I don't think mine is as bad as everyone makes it out to be. That said, there may be some difference between my car for example, and some other folks. The hardest hit seem to be people who went pre 29.2 to post 29.2, not me who came with MSD81 and 29.2.

PS. The CDV thing is fantastic, can't even tell I did it, it is that smooth now. Thanks again sir!

Originally Posted by tek818

I should've let you drive my car when it was extremely laggy... I can certainly attest to the validity of the claims made in this thread. The measurement of the wastegate duty cycle is hard evidence...

No worries man, I think I'll be up there again in a few weeks. Especially if you can put the V3 in valet mode, and presumably let the 29.2 go strong, I should be able to tell.

[RBBMWE46M3]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

I'm just going to chime in here and give my experience with the 29.2.
I was actually very surprised because I've read so much about how bad it sucks.
I drove Slubu's car about a week ago and I felt the lag, but it really wasn't that bad. There was a tad bit of lag, but I was expecting a huge difference.
I offered to give him a ride in mine but he didn't want to feel what he was missing. I honestly don't know if he would have felt much of a difference except for the DPs and more power since I don't have the 29.2 program. But, as far as the lag, I was thinking that mine was just a tad quicker to react.

I really am sympathetic to those who are going through these frustrations but unless some cars are behaving much differently than Slubu's, I'm wondering if some are making a much bigger deal than they should.

Ah what the hell, why make a big deal after I just bought a 50k car and It dosent perform ANYTHING LIKE THE DEMO I TEST DROVE.