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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > Msv70 Ews ( To Hassmaschine )



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      09-01-2019, 12:32 PM   #1
Timothydevisser
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Msv70 Ews ( To Hassmaschine )

Hey,

Can i use a msv70 to run a n52b30a engine from after 2007 ?
Normal this engine wil run with a msv80..
dont know where are the diffrense but thought iT was a change in engine head.

Last edited by Timothydevisser; 10-27-2019 at 03:04 AM..
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      09-02-2019, 03:34 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothydevisser View Post
Hey,

Can i use a msv70 to run a n52b30a engine from after 2007 ?
Normal this engine wil run with a msv80..
dont know where are the diffrense but thought iT was a change in engine head.
No it will not work without hardware and software changes.

Why do you ask? What are you trying to achieve?
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      09-03-2019, 02:10 AM   #3
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I am planning on a swap from n46b20b to n52b30a.
I have all the components except the engine.
I already have a dme msv70 but now I can get a engine but itís from 2009 sow it should run the msv80.
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      09-03-2019, 09:25 AM   #4
hassmaschine
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MSV70 can run the engine. The question is, does your car have EWS3 or EWS4? MSV70 won't work easily on later years, you'd have to swap out a bunch of other modules.

There's a couple electronics on the motor that are different (MAF and throttle off the top of my head) but nothing that would prevent you from using the motor itself.
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      09-03-2019, 11:24 AM   #5
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Regardless of the DME, you will need to sort out the CAS/EWS and perhaps VO programming. As Hass mentioned, the MSV70 may not support your car.

If it was my project, I'd convert the engine to work with the MSV80 and find someone that could prep an MSV80 to match your car. When you are done, everything will work like an OEM setup.

The engine conversion will be pretty easy, start with the MAF and throttle body but check real OEM for the rest of the sensors. You might find one or two more that need changed. 30 minutes research, max.

The DME and CAS programming, Find someone that can Match the EWS keys in your CAS and while they are setting it up, get a tune designed for the three stage manifold you surely have on your new motor.

Have you replaced the gaskets? If the valve cover is coming off.....MILVS while the motor is still on a stand.
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      09-04-2019, 02:40 AM   #6
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I already have someone for the isn writing from cas to dme.

The shitty thing is just i already got the dme and now i can get a engine from above 2007.

The only thing missing at this point are engine and transmission. All the other parts i already have.
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      09-04-2019, 02:24 PM   #7
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I told you. The DME will run the engine. You may have to swap a couple sensors but that's not what is stopping you.

you can't run an MSV70 on a car made for an MSV80 though. The EWS system is different (and the ISN is a different length). But we don't even know what year you car is..
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      09-04-2019, 04:29 PM   #8
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I am sorry,

Its for my e91 2006
So this one should run a msv70.
Because its pre facelift.
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      09-04-2019, 06:35 PM   #9
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Ahh! Yes, MSV70 will work for your car.

You'll need to check which sensors need to be swapped over for the earlier versions (I know the MAF and throttle body - you may not even need a MAF depending on your DME). Also there may be wiring differences but they should be minor and easily corrected using the TIS.
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      09-05-2019, 01:19 AM   #10
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Transmission is ordered gs6-37bz tjep.
Now only the engine, because i only can find engines from the UK i buyed a wiring loom from a EU car so i have to swap the whole wiring.
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      09-06-2019, 03:49 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hassmaschine View Post
Ahh! Yes, MSV70 will work for your car.

You'll need to check which sensors need to be swapped over for the earlier versions (I know the MAF and throttle body - you may not even need a MAF depending on your DME). Also there may be wiring differences but they should be minor and easily corrected using the TIS.
Could probably get the MSV80 throttle body to work fine. I don't think the signaling is any different.

I think the ignition coils are different, but if the dwell maps in the DME are the same, that probably doesn't matter. MSV80 uses a digital MAF instead of an analog one, but as you said, that can just be deleted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hassmaschine View Post
you can't run an MSV70 on a car made for an MSV80 though. The EWS system is different (and the ISN is a different length). But we don't even know what year you car is..
CAS3+ can be made to run in EWS 3 mode (facelift E60 M5 is proof of this), but I don't know what it entails to actually switch the mode, and whether or not the 2-byte ISN can be derived from the 16-byte one.
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      09-06-2019, 04:15 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terraphantm View Post
Could probably get the MSV80 throttle body to work fine. I don't think the signaling is any different.

I think the ignition coils are different, but if the dwell maps in the DME are the same, that probably doesn't matter. MSV80 uses a digital MAF instead of an analog one, but as you said, that can just be deleted.



CAS3+ can be made to run in EWS 3 mode (facelift E60 M5 is proof of this), but I don't know what it entails to actually switch the mode, and whether or not the 2-byte ISN can be derived from the 16-byte one.
Maf delete ???
I can just get a maf sensor from the old n52b30, sound a lot more easy.
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      09-06-2019, 11:10 PM   #13
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Many EU market cars never came with a MAF - the N52 was designed to not need it in the first place. I haven't run one on my 330i for years.
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      09-07-2019, 01:38 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hassmaschine View Post
Many EU market cars never came with a MAF - the N52 was designed to not need it in the first place. I haven't run one on my 330i for years.
Can i just delete iT with Ncsexpert or do i need a tuner ?
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      09-07-2019, 10:47 AM   #15
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It's part of the calibration. There are many factory tunes that do not use it.

NCSEXPERT is mostly useless for the DME.
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      09-07-2019, 10:51 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hassmaschine View Post
It's part of the calibration. There are many factory tunes that do not use it.

NCSEXPERT is mostly useless for the DME.

So how do i remove it ?
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      09-07-2019, 11:16 AM   #17
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You flash a factory tune that doesn't use the MAF
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      09-07-2019, 05:08 PM   #18
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This is new territory for me, can I flash this with winkfp or something like that ? And where do I find that..
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      09-10-2019, 02:03 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hassmaschine View Post
You flash a factory tune that doesn't use the MAF
Will the MSV70 be able to work with the disa valves ?
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      09-10-2019, 02:26 PM   #20
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330i was originally MSV70, yep!
If you use a new MSV70, or a used one from a 330i, you can use the factory 330i flash and control the DISA valves.
If you use a used MSV70 from a 325i, you'll probably need a modified 330i flash using one of the tunes on bimmerlabs (unless the MSV70's powerclass can be changed... for MSV80 it can't easily)
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      09-10-2019, 03:26 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vilord View Post
330i was originally MSV70, yep!
If you use a new MSV70, or a used one from a 330i, you can use the factory 330i flash and control the DISA valves.
If you use a used MSV70 from a 325i, you'll probably need a modified 330i flash using one of the tunes on bimmerlabs (unless the MSV70's powerclass can be changed... for MSV80 it can't easily)
Nothing to do with the donor DME. The power class value in your CAS will need to match the power class value of the calibration file/ tune or you will need modified files from Bimmerlabs or some other tuner.
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      09-10-2019, 03:41 PM   #22
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yeah the donor DME can be from basically anything, as long as it's an MSV70.
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