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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > Regional Forums > UK > M57 & Timing Chain



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      06-17-2015, 04:37 PM   #23
mr-modster
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Does anyone know roughly what sort of price it is to have it replaced my cars hit 93k with remap ect.. Would like to get it done hearing all this for peace of mind cheers
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      06-17-2015, 04:44 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr-modster
Does anyone know roughly what sort of price it is to have it replaced my cars hit 93k with remap ect.. Would like to get it done hearing all this for peace of mind cheers
+1 on a 335d
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      06-17-2015, 04:46 PM   #25
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Not seen VAG engines snap but have seen stretch. The 3.2 as in the r32 can stretch quite badly, but you can measure the stretch with diagnostic software apparently to see if it's within tolerance.
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      06-17-2015, 05:31 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by cupraraj View Post
i doubt if a car has full bmw history and 80k and if the other has no service history and 80k means the full history one is more secure from chain snapping...when its time to go its time to go and i really doubt theres anything that we can do to prevent it like starting to service every 6 months or always take it to bmw for work now
We can do one thing that's service the cars as often as we can CBS IMO is good for marketing/selling cars especially for the fleet buyer as the car spends less time off road more time on the road earning its keep.... well at least on paper. Thing is having been where I am now for 3 years lengthy gaps inbetween services equal future potental issues.

But from what I've seen as an owner there's little that can be done bar getting the tensioner repalced to stop this sort of thing happening it would appear.

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Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
Steve does this affect 335D? How many labour hours to replace the timing chain if done as a preventative measure?
There from the same family. Re measures service the car and if in doubt at least take time out to ensure the tensioners sorted.

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Originally Posted by cupraraj View Post
unless there is a new chain BMW have made to prevent this from happening why would you try fix something thats not broken?

apparently these chains can take 200-250k miles but now some are failing at a third of what they are quoting so even putting a new one on might be pointless?
We've got several M57's on good mileages only on Monday we had one of our regulars in with his 208.000 mile 335d in for an oil service and its fighting fit. He changes oil at least twice a year

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Originally Posted by Markcaughey View Post
has there ever been any report of chains going in any of the petrol 6 cylinders ? as i would imagine its the same chain ?
Petrols seem more durable... on paper at least. 4 cylinder units have issues there's a sticky on the very subject for the 4 cylinder units, re the 6's they seem durable, but that's not to say they won't have issues. I've read about a few but compared with the well documented diesels they seem to be more under control. But re petrols here's one that followed CBS but had only covered 30k or so. Its a 4 cylinder though from an 09 plate 320i





trust me if your car does 4000 miles a year change the oil every year don't wait for the CBS indication light to tell you it needs a service. When we got the above car it rattled like a pig if you can avert your eyes form the sludge build up this one rattled like a pig the tensioner leaked and the chain was slack plus we had Vanos issues.

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Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Does that mean..... I should go for Merc or Audi (gays car) next time ?

BMW should make it serviceable item at 100K!
Merc's seem more durable Sam, I'm honestly not a big fan of Audi's or VW group cars when it comes to engines we've had 1.4TFSI chain issues which took over 13 hours to sort plus a 1.2 FSI engine that was repalced due to a timing chain issue(engine on exchange off the shelf) these units stretch its well known. TBH not a big fan of their engines from what I;ve seen VAG stuff is complex.

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Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
I have a feeling that chances are less on petrol variants. My gut feeling is due to less torque on Petrol cars.... Same as DMF and clutch plates go on diesel cars more than petrol cars.
Could be. We see plenty of 320d's with clutch/flywheel issues(done one today)turbo's are as we know well versed too. Petrols seem more durable IMO, but there not without their issues

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Originally Posted by Dan-danGT View Post
This is pretty worrying for me as I don't want mine to snap, I service it probably very early 5k but didn't own the car for the first 79k, however it's now got no dpf and has done a few trackdays so possibly won't help it.

As for the mercedes comment, I can vouch for the 651 engine as seen in the A, B, C, E, ML etc we have the same engine in the vans. Some of our customer have 300-400,000 miles on the clock with no chain stretch issues at all. Not sure on Audi stuff, but Mercedes don't suffer timing chain snapping.
What can you do. Honestly if you were to worry about it you'd never buy a car. Sounds hard but if you look at the amount of cars out there look at the issues written about in the real scheme of things when we read things like this its not actually that bad... however at the same time its not exactly welcoming news either.

Merc's I can say hand on heart seem to assemble a more durable package.

But re a question asked earlier by makkann re the engine well hope these pic's answer

We had some time so the engine was rotated 180 degrees the sump was removed for a nose around.




As you can see below sump's off



and if you've got sharp eyes you'll notice that everything on this is in decent shape had a close up peak of the bottom end/shells etc. all looked in good order.

I can say after looking / talking to the guys who tackled the job is that this was a failure totally unexpected
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      06-17-2015, 05:36 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr-modster View Post
Does anyone know roughly what sort of price it is to have it replaced my cars hit 93k with remap ect.. Would like to get it done hearing all this for peace of mind cheers
It will be real money look to replace the tensioner would be perhaps the simplest course of action. To go the whole ho is expensive though reassuring as I've said from the start until the other day I'd neverseen one of these let go consider the numbers sold v these sort of issues its a small minority and though sad I'd really not worry too much about it. All I'd say is preventions better than cure get the tensioner checked out/replace it for peace of mind do a regular service and enjoy your car.

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Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
+1 on a 335d
See above

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason_ View Post
Not seen VAG engines snap but have seen stretch. The 3.2 as in the r32 can stretch quite badly, but you can measure the stretch with diagnostic software apparently to see if it's within tolerance.
Yep heard of R32's haven't seen one yet but they are costly/complex to do compared with BMW's

What I will again say is these are in my eyes low in numbers we know about the N47 issues, these M57 issues are or would seem to be rare consider how many years the engines been produced overall they are durable. We are seeing/discussing what I've seen plus there's another post on here re the exact same issue, for which I've posted with some advice. Overall its not a bad power plant re the chain.

All I'd say is its good info to read but please don't fall out of love with your car based on what I've posted. Overall they are a good unit re this area of the engine I thought though it would be worth posting to highlight/advise only
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      06-18-2015, 03:16 AM   #28
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What sort of price would i be looking at for tensioners being replaced? Cheers
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      06-18-2015, 04:38 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by mr-modster View Post
What sort of price would i be looking at for tensioners being replaced? Cheers
As we've not done the tensioner on its own I wasn't certain when I posted yesterday as the only time we replace these is when the chain/guides need attention.

Time wise just doing this is over 34 workshop hours, which is not too far from the chain and all the parts
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      06-18-2015, 05:06 AM   #30
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What exactly is big money though thousands? If so id just buy a replacement engine if mine fails
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      06-18-2015, 05:26 AM   #31
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What exactly is big money though thousands? If so id just buy a replacement engine if mine fails
Sadly yes it would be sailing on to the low 2k area based on what I've discovered this morning plus parts of course.

Sadly when they go they seem to cost.
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      06-18-2015, 08:23 AM   #32
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I think 2k plus parts is an expensive preventative maintenance item.

Is there anything else preventative that we could do (apart from proper routine servicing) that costs less than 500?
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      06-18-2015, 09:01 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
I think 2k plus parts is an expensive preventative maintenance item.

Is there anything else preventative that we could do (apart from proper routine servicing) that costs less than 500?
If this was a petrol things would be so much more simplistic as your looking at around 40+VAT and say an hour tops to sort it these diesels sadly are a different animal re prevention I guess all you can do is keep your end of the bargain and change the oil regularly and breather for that matter but apart from that and I'm not usually list for words but I can't think of anything else that can be done on a min serviceable part I'm afraid to say
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      06-18-2015, 10:24 AM   #34
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Well i changed the breather and always change oil every 7-10k so fingers crossed!
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      06-21-2015, 06:03 AM   #35
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      06-21-2015, 06:23 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
Well i changed the breather and always change oil every 7-10k so fingers crossed!
Its all you can do to Mo thing is with these cars nowadays we are seeing more issues like this emerging,quite why but it's seems to be happening.

Clean oil is essential big miles you'll be perhaps driven by the advice re service schedules on the dash but for small mileage change the oil if you can once a year or like me twice a year at least you're bit.

If you'd of had a petrol Mo the tensioner easy being but sadly on the diesel setup it's a whole different ball game
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      07-22-2019, 11:03 AM   #37
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someone very well familiar with servicing these engines said that majority of these failures are usually due to long intervals between oil changes and that goes on for turbo reliability....not sure if it's true, but I am thinking to order oil asap seeing this...
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      07-24-2019, 01:00 AM   #38
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10000mi/annually (whichever is sooner) is roughly where you should be for oil changes, though I'm dubious about how much it'll really affect the chains. The turbo is way more sensitive, for obvious reason. Make sure it's the right stuff too, obviously!

Main stresses on chains:

Turning the engine backwards; don't leave it in gear when parked, or at least select the gear which will turn the engine forwards if the car rolls.

Start-up (and stopping); don't start and stop the engine constantly if you can...within reason.

Jerky driving; easy on the clutch, always. The clutch and dmf will thank you too.

High revs, especially when cold; there's just no need to ring out an M57 anyhow!
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