[STR8-6IX]

200 pounds will be noticeable when braking.

[bNks334]

Originally Posted by sono0312

i would like to know if i just need to add '+SPBR' into vo attribute to have an ideal performance after replacing normal brake with bp brake.

my car is e90 325i sedan, and the car has bp brake integrated for both front and rear. the rear was not normal option but the size of roter (center ring) was modified to be fitted.

Yes, use winkfp to add the BBK attribute to your VO "+SPBR" ????

Then use NCSExpert to code the entire car. All modules will change settings to reflect the new hardware you added to your VO.

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by feuer

Do you have photos?

Hello,
Here are phtos for the calipers fitted to my car. the product # would be 34110444769 that will cover both front x2 and rear x2.

Front: 6-piston aluminum fixed-calipers
http://cdn.snsimg.carview.co.jp/mink...t=b12892fc6df6

Rear:2-piston aluminum fixed-calipers
http://cdn.snsimg.carview.co.jp/mink...t=b12892fc6df6

thanks

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by bNks334

Yes, use winkfp to add the BBK attribute to your VO "+SPBR" ????

Then use NCSExpert to code the entire car. All modules will change settings to reflect the new hardware you added to your VO.

Hello,
thanks for the confirmation.
i hope this will apply to the retrofit of bp brake for E90 as well. do you think the changes take effect when dsc/abs functions are triggered? in other words, the brake feel will not be changed in normal usage?

br//

[feuer]

Originally Posted by MPI_Jack

The Performance brakes for the E9x chassis are the 135i 6 piston calipers with the slotted/dimpled 338mm rotors. It's not the same as we have done with our cars with the F series performance brakes.

Originally Posted by sono0312

Hello,
Here are phtos for the calipers fitted to my car. the product # would be 34110444769 that will cover both front x2 and rear x2.
Front: 6-piston aluminum fixed-calipers
Rear:2-piston aluminum fixed-calipers

I'm interested to see this:
"the rear was not normal option but the size of roter (center ring) was modified to be fitted"

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by feuer

I'm interested to see this:
"the rear was not normal option but the size of roter (center ring) was modified to be fitted"

Here is the picture i took from a shop web page. they put a small ring inside the roter by welding to make it fitted as the rear roter may not be fitted to normal 325i chassis.
http://www.bplus-bmw.com/blog/data/upfile/3533-1.jpg

cheers//

[feuer]

Originally Posted by sono0312

Here is the picture i took from a shop web page. they put a small ring inside the roter by welding to make it fitted as the rear roter may not be fitted to normal 325i chassis.
http://www.bplus-bmw.com/blog/data/upfile/3533-1.jpg

cheers//

You need to market this ring. Guys with 165mm rear brakes have been crying for solution like this!

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by bNks334

Yes, use winkfp to add the BBK attribute to your VO "+SPBR" ????

Then use NCSExpert to code the entire car. All modules will change settings to reflect the new hardware you added to your VO.

Hello,

thankyou for the information. wonder if vo value is exactly ‘+SPBR’? my concern is that the rear caliper is not a standard option as described previously (in the thread, rotor ring modified smaller). each parameter for this change coded by the ncsexpert may not be fitted to what it (bp brake) was installed.

thanks//

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by feuer

You need to market this ring. Guys with 165mm rear brakes have been crying for solution like this!

yes, i love to support if a certain # of people are eager to do so...

[bNks334]

Originally Posted by sono0312

Hello,

thankyou for the information. wonder if vo value is exactly ‘+SPBR’? my concern is that the rear caliper is not a standard option as described previously (in the thread, rotor ring modified smaller). each parameter for this change coded by the ncsexpert may not be fitted to what it (bp brake) was installed.

thanks//

I was just Quoting the other guy who said ‘+SPBR’ That is apparently the attribute you need to add to your VO to retrofit the BMW performance brakes. From what I understand, BMW reuses the VO attributes across models. That means that if both an F-series and E-have a big brake retrofit (BMWP Brakes) then they both probably get coded with '+SPBR' The settings will just vary automatically depending on the DME. Google around a bit, you'll find plenty of euros discussing coding BBK.

Obviously there isn't any special code for aftermarket BBK. You'll just have to code the attribute for the BMWperformance brakes. ‘+SPBR’ will at least change your factory settings CLOSER to a more performance oriented brake setup (more front bias).

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by bNks334

I was just Quoting the other guy who said ‘+SPBR’ That is apparently the attribute you need to add to your VO to retrofit the BMW performance brakes. From what I understand, BMW reuses the VO attributes across models. That means that if both an F-series and E-have a big brake retrofit (BMWP Brakes) then they both probably get coded with '+SPBR' The settings will just vary automatically depending on the DME. Google around a bit, you'll find plenty of euros discussing coding BBK.

Obviously there isn't any special code for aftermarket BBK. You'll just have to code the attribute for the BMWperformance brakes. ‘+SPBR’ will at least change your factory settings CLOSER to a more performance oriented brake setup (more front bias).

Hello,
Thakyou for the information.
I really want to try this but I have a little concern on the effect to see if it is really functioning after attribute is added. My understanding is that the feature is triggered only when the car reach a certain speed with DSC/abs activated. Can I know if it is functioning after this change is made?
Sorry for many question...

Cheers//

[bNks334]

Originally Posted by sono0312

Hello,
Thakyou for the information.
I really want to try this but I have a little concern on the effect to see if it is really functioning after attribute is added. My understanding is that the feature is triggered only when the car reach a certain speed with DSC/abs activated. Can I know if it is functioning after this change is made?
Sorry for many question...

Cheers//

It's would probably be such a subtle effect you won't even notice.

You could dump your .TRC file before and after the coding to verify things changed.

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by bNks334

It's would probably be such a subtle effect you won't even notice.

You could dump your .TRC file before and after the coding to verify things changed.

thankyou.
Just one things to confirm. which ecu module will be affected by adding +SPBR in vo for those comparisons of .trc? such as dsc? or others?

thanks//

[juld0zer]

To make things more interesting, in ISTA/P i retrofitted sport brakes to my 135i. Yes, the option is there but unlike retrofitting an AGM or larger battery there is no undoing the change.

The main difference i noticed was the pedal was lighter. Travel is similar. If anything, i actually dislike it because they feel more difficult to modulate.
Im still new to coding and hacking the car's software but one day I will try and undo it by removing the SPBR parameter described earlier. I took a dump of the TRC file before i started fiddling with the various options too and compared it to the comparison document linked earlier. There isnt anything that stands out..

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

To make things more interesting, in ISTA/P i retrofitted sport brakes to my 135i. Yes, the option is there but unlike retrofitting an AGM or larger battery there is no undoing the change.

The main difference i noticed was the pedal was lighter. Travel is similar. If anything, i actually dislike it because they feel more difficult to modulate.
Im still new to coding and hacking the car's software but one day I will try and undo it by removing the SPBR parameter described earlier. I took a dump of the TRC file before i started fiddling with the various options too and compared it to the comparison document linked earlier. There isnt anything that stands out..

thankyou for the information.
we are not able drastically to feel the change when it is activated. however i think that this will take effect when dsc is activated in the condition where the wheels are slippy speed. what do you think?

[david in germany]

Originally Posted by sono0312

thankyou for the information.
we are not able drastically to feel the change when it is activated. however i think that this will take effect when dsc is activated in the condition where the wheels are slippy speed. what do you think?

I disagree, in my wife's 328i it is a drastic change in feel. Initial bite is a significant change from stock. After the coding it gives me the perception of twice the braking speed and capability.
If someone coded this and did not feel the difference than something went wrong with the coding.

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by david in germany

I disagree, in my wife's 328i it is a drastic change in feel. Initial bite is a significant change from stock. After the coding it gives me the perception of twice the braking speed and capability.
If someone coded this and did not feel the difference than something went wrong with the coding.

thanks for the comment.
i really want to test it. i read a thread, saying that 'Just add +SPBR to the VO and reflash the DSC'. is this what we need when sport brakes are introduced? reagardless of types of sport brake - i know that there are several types on the sport brake in e series - adding +SPBR is the only option to have function activated?

[david in germany]

Originally Posted by sono0312

thanks for the comment.
i really want to test it. i read a thread, saying that 'Just add +SPBR to the VO and reflash the DSC'. is this what we need when sport brakes are introduced? reagardless of types of sport brake - i know that there are several types on the sport brake in e series - adding +SPBR is the only option to have function activated?

With Ista-P it codes the FRM, CAS, and I think DSC modules. I believe +SPBR is the only option.

[juld0zer]

Ok so i finally did enough research and read enough guides to settle my nerves and harden my balls to modify the VO to delete +SPBR from my 135i.

For those wanting to code their car for sport brakes, this is what you do:

**Park your car on a flat level surface** (see below for note)
In NCS expert, Add "+SPBR" to your VO without the inverted commas. Write that FA to the CAS and FRM or in my case it was the NFRM. Then default code the DSC (code the DSC ECU only, rather than the whole car).
Next, open INPA and do all the sensor calibrations (steering sensor, yaw sensor, acceleration sensor, and calibrate the input and output valve characteristics).

The recalibrations are easier in ISTA/D because it gives you a guide on what you need to reset or do and in what order. But INPA will get the job done.

Anyway, i am glad that +SPBR is no longer active on my 135i. I really dont know why the option existed in ISTA/D.
- Brake response is now sharper, it delivers similar stopping power with about 10mm shorter pedal stroke. It feels like how Brembos should feel. I dare say it feels better than an M135i.
- Jabbing the brake in reverse feels the same as moving forward. With +SPBR it felt like unbedded brakes in reverse
- I didnt get a chance to dump the DSC's trace file to see if the default code operation undid all my previous tinkering (disable brake fade compensation, disable ready alert brake etc)
- Please note that i had a shit baseline to begin with (DSC valve module issues, stuck caliper pistons and more)

In short, DO NOT enable +SPBR on 135i models.
I have to drive the car more to determine if my pedal inconsistency has been resolved but so far so good. Sometimes the dealer software holds you back
Aside from the DSC module differences (Mk60 basic for 4cyl, Mk60E5 for 6cyl, Mk60E5 motorsport version for 8cyl models), there must be something different in the base programming that we cannot access via the commonly available software. Because if you folks with the 4cyl models get a soft pedal and weak brakes after adding the 6/2 piston 135i equivalent BBK, but get a drastic positive change after adding +SPBR, there must be more to it. Even after i played around with the pressure model settings, i couldnt get it to feel proper. The control unit has a massive influence on pedal feel and brake response on these cars. The entire experience is computer controlled and can easily mislead troubleshooting resulting in a lot of wasted time and money replacing good parts.

For 7DCT models (and possibly 6AT), you MUST be parked on flat level ground before you recalibrate the yaw and acceleration sensors. If your car is pointing nose downhill when you recalibrate the sensors, the DSC will tell the transmission you are driving uphill when you are actually driving on flat level road. So it will choose a lower gear, use more fuel, make more noise etc. It will also hold gears for longer before upshifting.
All models AFAIK have a hill holder function. Calibrating the sensors with the car pointing downhill creates an interesting situation. The hill holder will activate on level ground because it thinks the car is on a slope, so as you accelerate to take off there is a 2s delay and you feel the brakes suddenly release and the car takes off. It allows you to accelerate and build boost. You could use this as a sort of brake launch at traffic light grand prixs. Downside is it is very annoying in stop/go traffic.

sono0312: I actually have an answer for this one. It may affect how DSC intervenes (eg how strongly it brakes a wheel to maintain intended vehicle trajectory). Adding/removing the +SPBR attribute affects mainly pedal feel and brake response via a modified pressure curve. Think of it as modifying the axes on a graph to achieve a higher pressure with less input. If you want to modify how aggressively traction control intervenes, try modifying the coding in your DSC - druckmodell/pressure model is what you are after. I discovered this by accident. Setting it to wert_01 for HA Druckmodel and VA Druckmodel resulted in less traction control sensitivity. It felt like i had an open diff despite not disabling the ediff!
I dont have enough open space here to test DSC intervention so do so at your own risk. I couldnt fault it in everyday driving except it seemed too happy to spin the inside wheel merging out haha

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

sono0312: I actually have an answer for this one. It may affect how DSC intervenes (eg how strongly it brakes a wheel to maintain intended vehicle trajectory). Adding/removing the +SPBR attribute affects mainly pedal feel and brake response via a modified pressure curve. Think of it as modifying the axes on a graph to achieve a higher pressure with less input. If you want to modify how aggressively traction control intervenes, try modifying the coding in your DSC - druckmodell/pressure model is what you are after. I discovered this by accident. Setting it to wert_01 for HA Druckmodel and VA Druckmodel resulted in less traction control sensitivity. It felt like i had an open diff despite not disabling the ediff!
I dont have enough open space here to test DSC intervention so do so at your own risk. I couldnt fault it in everyday driving except it seemed too happy to spin the inside wheel merging out haha

great! thankyou for your detailed information. it is very useful.
would you please let me know if the sensor caliblations are required on dsc module only? when we reprogrammed dsc by accident i made a "DSC unit adjustment" by using ista/d to eliminate the alarms. it took 5-10 minutes to complete. i understand that the caliblation is necessary if some alarms appear after flashing. because flashing is required once +SPBR added to vo.

[juld0zer]

Yes, you calibrate them via the traction control menu in ISTA/D or DSC menu in INPA anyway. The acceleration sensor (and tilt sensor?) is inside the DSC control unit but the yaw sensor is beneath the passenger seat on a RHD car. I am not sure if they kept it under the driver seat in a LHD car. Replace either sensor and you must recalibrate the acceleration and yaw sensor.

Replace DSC control unit or complete module with pump/valve block and you have to recalibrate the valves and pump (DSC unit adjustment) in addition to recalibrating the acceleration and yaw sensors, after the module is coded to the car. This is the one you just described that took 5mins.

If you are just coding (tweaking), you should be fine with just recalibrating acceleration and yaw sensors. Modify VO and i would do all the recalibrations.

[sono0312]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

Yes, you calibrate them via the traction control menu in ISTA/D or DSC menu in INPA anyway. The acceleration sensor (and tilt sensor?) is inside the DSC control unit but the yaw sensor is beneath the passenger seat on a RHD car. I am not sure if they kept it under the driver seat in a LHD car. Replace either sensor and you must recalibrate the acceleration and yaw sensor.

Replace DSC control unit or complete module with pump/valve block and you have to recalibrate the valves and pump (DSC unit adjustment) in addition to recalibrating the acceleration and yaw sensors, after the module is coded to the car. This is the one you just described that took 5mins.

If you are just coding (tweaking), you should be fine with just recalibrating acceleration and yaw sensors. Modify VO and i would do all the recalibrations.

for calibration which module should be chosen to execute what you have mentioned above? By DSC, valves and pump; By which modules, acceleration and yaw sensors? i probably use an ista/d tool to do calibrations

thanks//