E90Post
 


 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Dyno #'s PRE and POST Dinan Stage II



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-19-2009, 05:17 PM   #45
E82tt6
Colonel
E82tt6's Avatar
103
Rep
2,626
Posts

Drives: '08 Black Saphire Z4 MC
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
Not when you only run rich under boost. Washdown is only an issue if it runs excessively rich at idle, cruise, etc,.

Shiv
My concern with running that rich in a DI engine would be:

A. Fuel Dilution, especially for your average non-forum Dinan user on 15,000 mile intervals.

B. Carbon despoits on Intake valves, seeing as their is no fuel to clean them.

C. Damage to cats? Guess it's hard to tell how the AFR is while crusing, but the car adds A LOT of fuel very, very fast under load.

IMHO, a fuel curve like that shows sloppy/lazy tuning in general, and I wouldn't be comfortable with it.
__________________
'08 Black Saphire/Black Z4 M Coupe
RIP Gretta: Blue Water/Lemon 135i. Died to save me.
-ChuckV
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2009, 05:18 PM   #46
OpenFlash
United_States
1733
Rep
17,960
Posts

Drives: A Lot
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: SF Bay, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by 335e92tx View Post
There still is being raw gas dumped into the oil system. Fuel dilution in Oil will serverly reduce its lubrication ability... increasing wear especially if extended oil change intervals are used.
Absolutely, but we're talking about 10-11:1 AFR in this case. And only under max boost when being control/monitored in a closed loop system. Washdown wouldn't even begin to be a concern to me in this situation.

Don't get me wrong. That AFR trace is pretty ridiculous. But no more ridiculous than other stock tune DI and nonDI cars I've seen.

Shiv
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2009, 05:38 PM   #47
smartys
Lieutenant
46
Rep
591
Posts

Drives: 07 e93 335i
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto, on

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winston Wolf View Post
thanks!

I remember that now, i did view it a while back....

Hmm, I wonder why the difference in gains....again, My HPFP? can't be THAT much of a diff in gains for i vs xi?

I wunder............
__________________
SG | Coral Red | 6MT | Sports Pkg | CA | PDC | KWV2 | Dinan Stage II | Morr VS8 | Aero Lip |
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2009, 05:39 PM   #48
smartys
Lieutenant
46
Rep
591
Posts

Drives: 07 e93 335i
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto, on

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
Absolutely, but we're talking about 10-11:1 AFR in this case. And only under max boost when being control/monitored in a closed loop system. Washdown wouldn't even begin to be a concern to me in this situation.

Don't get me wrong. That AFR trace is pretty ridiculous. But no more ridiculous than other stock tune DI and nonDI cars I've seen.

Shiv
Interesting....Wondering Shiv on your thoughts about how the AFR measurement was taken, ie. tailpipe vs right behind O2 sensor, and only ONE at that....?
__________________
SG | Coral Red | 6MT | Sports Pkg | CA | PDC | KWV2 | Dinan Stage II | Morr VS8 | Aero Lip |
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2009, 06:23 PM   #49
RynoDyno312
Private
0
Rep
86
Posts

Drives: 2007 AW 335i Stepronic
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Santa Barbara/Orange County, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu View Post
Don't get me wrong. That AFR trace is pretty ridiculous. But no more ridiculous than other stock tune DI and nonDI cars I've seen.

Shiv
I've heard that stock EVO X AFR is 9:1 at full boost/wot. The huge gains from a reflash make a lot of sense if that is the case.
__________________
Alpine White/Black E90 335i ZSP Stepronic; DCI/JB+
Appreciate 0
      03-20-2009, 06:12 PM   #50
smartys
Lieutenant
46
Rep
591
Posts

Drives: 07 e93 335i
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto, on

iTrader: (1)

So I spoke to Dinan's Engineering Dept and forwarded them my Dyno results and this is what he wrote back:

The dip at 2500 rpm might be due to the knock sensors. This rpm range is where the boost dramatically ramps up, and because the engine is turning so slowly, it allows more time for detonation to develop. When the knock sensors go off, the computer will alter the fuel delivery & ignition timing to decrease power, to protect the engine. The tuning changes depending on the severity of the knock sensor signal.



On the dyno, this is usually caused by inadequate cooling. You’re probably doing the dyno run in 5th gear, where the transmission is 1:1, which means the car is going well over 100mph. On our dyno, we use a fan that’s taller than the car, and it can still only get 70-80mph of airflow, even with ducting that directs the air right at the radiator (see the second picture at http://www.dinancars.com/bmw/technia...ern-bmw-engine). If the fan you were using is smaller (which is very likely), then the radiator & intercooler would be heating up excessively, which leads to a hotter engine and intake air, which raises the likelihood of detonation. So what you see on the dyno may not be a true representation of what happens on the road. What was the setup used during the dyno test?



Also, fuel quality will have an effect too. If available, you should try a higher octane (or at least a different brand of fuel), and see if this “dip” goes away.



Please feel free to contact us if you have further questions. Thank you!

James Leong
Dinan Engineering Inc.

With regards to the AFRs, he also stated that tailpipe measurements of AFRs are essentially useless and inaccurate.....

So what's your verdict guys? Seems plausible, but what about others' Dyno results that DON'T have that dip?

I wonder if I should try Sunoco 94......I just don't want to take a chance with that friggin Ethanol in their gas......
__________________
SG | Coral Red | 6MT | Sports Pkg | CA | PDC | KWV2 | Dinan Stage II | Morr VS8 | Aero Lip |
Appreciate 0
      03-20-2009, 06:22 PM   #51
E82tt6
Colonel
E82tt6's Avatar
103
Rep
2,626
Posts

Drives: '08 Black Saphire Z4 MC
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Why did he state that tailpipe AFR measurements are useless and inaccurate?
__________________
'08 Black Saphire/Black Z4 M Coupe
RIP Gretta: Blue Water/Lemon 135i. Died to save me.
-ChuckV
Appreciate 0
      04-03-2009, 03:00 AM   #52
ElliottP
Private First Class
United_States
26
Rep
196
Posts

Drives: 2008 E92 335i
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Baltimore, MD

iTrader: (0)

Just to clarify. What do the terms 'rich' and AFR mean in this context?
__________________
My introduction: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=246615
Stats: 2008 E92 335i | Manual | Style 230 19" wheels | Black Sapphire Metallic | Black Leather | Gray Poplar | I-Drive | Cold Weather | Premium | iPod USB
Mods: Dinan Stage II ECU | 30% Tint | Breyton 18" Race GTS winter setup | Black Grilles | Keyhole-less Driver's Door
Appreciate 0
      04-03-2009, 04:44 PM   #53
smartys
Lieutenant
46
Rep
591
Posts

Drives: 07 e93 335i
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto, on

iTrader: (1)

AFR = Air Fuel Ratio
"Rich" means its running with relatively high amounts of fuel (ie. Air:Fuel ratio is low)
__________________
SG | Coral Red | 6MT | Sports Pkg | CA | PDC | KWV2 | Dinan Stage II | Morr VS8 | Aero Lip |
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:04 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST