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      09-29-2014, 05:24 PM   #969
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Spreadsheet updated for BlackHawk Farms

I ran into coolent temp issues at BlackHawk Farms. I have no oil cooler on the car so I figure I'd start to resolve this issue with the Evolution Racewerks comp cooler and a better radiator.

Brakes also sucked so I'll have to do something about that. New rotors, pads, and fluids should do the trick.

I pulled a 1:28.000. Spec miata runs the track at 1:22:388
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      10-01-2014, 08:18 PM   #970
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Island rd,

120+ at that track is a feat! Was the south oval open? What mods do you have on that thing?

Very impressed.
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      06-18-2015, 10:09 AM   #971
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Originally Posted by Island Road View Post
Well looks like I can unfortunately Join this party. I went to NHMS this past weekend for BMW CCA HPDE and the max high temp for the day was 87, during the entire time I did not see my temps rise above 260F. I had 4 sessions that all went well until I started receiving limp mode. My first sessions was fine, this was earlier in the morning and it had not heated up just yet. The 2nd sessions was also good but the last lap I received limpmode. The last two sessions i was doing ok until 50% into the sessions limp mode CEL.

I don't believe I had an overheating issue as my temps were always constant. The error codes I received were the common 30FE and 3100. After much searching I always come to threads that really don't provide why this is happening.
  • Some say its waste-gate sticking and apply some hightemp grease.
  • Check all vacuum lines make sure there is no leak.
  • Test the boost solenoids to make sure they are not going bad.

I have never received these errors on the street, and I have tried replicating them and it's not possible but I know it happens at high RPM mostly going from 3rd to 4th getting up to 120+ on the track.

I have plenty of air going to my oilcooer, just a complete cutout. I have a vented hood, and 7" IC running Wedge map. Unfortunately I did not do any logging that day. Looks as though this is a common issue and I am not the only one to were this happens only at the track and not on the street.

Has anybody else had these issues on the track at all and resolved them?
I Get 30FF and 30FE codes at the track too. I think it's my wastegates sticking at high temp.
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      06-22-2015, 12:12 PM   #972
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Last time my car jumped into limp mode while accelerating out of a corner. I drove with DTC off (but DSC on) and I run a procede 2.5SE. After switching back into Map0 limp mode disappeared. At home I couldn't find any codes or informations.. may this be caused due to the DSC and Procede?
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      07-23-2015, 10:48 AM   #973
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I'm joining the limp mode party. 2008 BMW 335xi 98,000 miles. Took my car to Grattan raceway (MI) this past weekend (my first track day ever). Before I went to the track, I replaced breaks, break fluid, walnut blasting. No engine lights whatsoever. Not even when driving really hard on the street. Show up at Grattan and I'm with an instructor for the first couple of laps so I wasn't pushing it hard and made it to the checkered flag (20 minutes). Second time out an instructor is with me again, I start feeling more confident and start pushing it harder, about 10 minutes in, I'm coming up a hill and got the pedal down in 3rd gear heading towards the straight, shift into 4th gear, about 2 seconds later boom limp mode. I get off the track, turn it off and turn it back on, the error is gone. I pull the codes, and guess what? No codes. Check all service levels, oil looks good, temp looks good. I Google it and disable traction control completely (hold 3 seconds). So we eat lunch, I let the car cool off and go back out for the third session with traction control completely off, second lap in limp mode. #$## Raging now. Get off the track, pull code while light is still on, no codes (I'm using a cheap scanner OBDII scanner, not the expensive BMW ones). Turn it off, turn it back on no light / code, go back on track WITH traction control fully back on (normal) and the third lap this time I go into limp mode. Get really pissed, pull off and shut my car down for the day. Hang out for a while, talk to some BMW dudes who all tried pulling codes and couldn't find anything. So I drive home and no lights so far, I say what the hell let me see if I can recreate this... doing about 40 mph in 3rd gear down a back road, nail it up to 70 and boom limp mode. @$@#@! Pull over, turn it off and turn it back on. Drive home at 50mph in 4th gear and never popped up again. So my car sits in my garage for 2 days then, I jump back in it and drive somewhere for work, I let it get up to temp 245ish, then jump on it because why not? This time no lights and I can shift cleanly all the way up to 6th without issue. Limp mode happened on Sunday and it's now Thursday. I haven't gotten one limp mode since Sunday. Oh by the way my oil temps only went slightly higher than normal. When my car is warm it’s around 240-250. At the track it was barely over 250.

My car is stock besides 18” VMR 710 wheels. No modifications whatsoever to cooling or engine or suspension.

So here’s my dilemma, I want to track more and after reading everything in this thread I’m not entirely sure this is the car I can beat on for 1-2 straight at track. For the guys who have had a tons of limp modes similar to the above, how did you remedy this and start getting through ATLEAST a day at the track? I’m only talking about 3-5 20 minute sessions in 80-90 degree weather. Will a aftermarket oil cooler, radiator, etc really make a difference? I wanted to get some KW V1s but I'm not doing that now until I know this thing can handle at least a moderate track day.

Last edited by dbrizz; 07-23-2015 at 10:56 AM.
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      07-24-2015, 02:45 PM   #974
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Originally Posted by dbrizz View Post
I'm joining the limp mode party. 2008 BMW 335xi 98,000 miles. Took my car to Grattan raceway (MI) this past weekend (my first track day ever). Before I went to the track, I replaced breaks, break fluid, walnut blasting. No engine lights whatsoever. Not even when driving really hard on the street. Show up at Grattan and I'm with an instructor for the first couple of laps so I wasn't pushing it hard and made it to the checkered flag (20 minutes). Second time out an instructor is with me again, I start feeling more confident and start pushing it harder, about 10 minutes in, I'm coming up a hill and got the pedal down in 3rd gear heading towards the straight, shift into 4th gear, about 2 seconds later boom limp mode. I get off the track, turn it off and turn it back on, the error is gone. I pull the codes, and guess what? No codes. Check all service levels, oil looks good, temp looks good. I Google it and disable traction control completely (hold 3 seconds). So we eat lunch, I let the car cool off and go back out for the third session with traction control completely off, second lap in limp mode. #$## Raging now. Get off the track, pull code while light is still on, no codes (I'm using a cheap scanner OBDII scanner, not the expensive BMW ones). Turn it off, turn it back on no light / code, go back on track WITH traction control fully back on (normal) and the third lap this time I go into limp mode. Get really pissed, pull off and shut my car down for the day. Hang out for a while, talk to some BMW dudes who all tried pulling codes and couldn't find anything. So I drive home and no lights so far, I say what the hell let me see if I can recreate this... doing about 40 mph in 3rd gear down a back road, nail it up to 70 and boom limp mode. @$@#@! Pull over, turn it off and turn it back on. Drive home at 50mph in 4th gear and never popped up again. So my car sits in my garage for 2 days then, I jump back in it and drive somewhere for work, I let it get up to temp 245ish, then jump on it because why not? This time no lights and I can shift cleanly all the way up to 6th without issue. Limp mode happened on Sunday and it's now Thursday. I haven't gotten one limp mode since Sunday. Oh by the way my oil temps only went slightly higher than normal. When my car is warm itís around 240-250. At the track it was barely over 250.

My car is stock besides 18Ē VMR 710 wheels. No modifications whatsoever to cooling or engine or suspension.

So hereís my dilemma, I want to track more and after reading everything in this thread Iím not entirely sure this is the car I can beat on for 1-2 straight at track. For the guys who have had a tons of limp modes similar to the above, how did you remedy this and start getting through ATLEAST a day at the track? Iím only talking about 3-5 20 minute sessions in 80-90 degree weather. Will a aftermarket oil cooler, radiator, etc really make a difference? I wanted to get some KW V1s but I'm not doing that now until I know this thing can handle at least a moderate track day.
This is pretty typical. I am working on an upgraded oil cooler right now to see if that will fix my limp mode issues.
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      07-25-2015, 10:44 PM   #975
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I'm joining the limp mode party. 2008 BMW 335xi 98,000 miles. Took my car to Grattan raceway (MI) this past weekend...
Hey, I was as Grattan too on Sunday with my 335xi. I had even less luck as it threw the serpentine belt on the 2nd lap. Since the dealer had just replaced it, that indicated a more complex problem than I cared to fix at the track. I had it towed back to the dealer in Ann Arbor.
Anyway back to you...

If your troubles were on Sunday it is too bad I didn't hook up to try and help. First, tell us more about your car:

* Is it an automatic or manual?
* Is it the full sport model with the factory oil cooler?

When you say "scanned", was this a Universal scanner or a BMW specific scanner? I have the $60 "Carly for BMW" app.
Long story for another time, but I currently have two 2008 335xi; I just bought the 2nd one; I knew it has lots of problem but wanted to learn to fix various limp modes, codes and ECUs. Both are automatic and came factory without oil coolers. I have since retrofitted the OEM cooler to my 1st car.

I have encountered various limp modes in my two 335xi, both on track and on the road. Some will only show codes with a BMW specific scanner.

On the track I would almost always get limp mode due to either high oil temp and/or high water temp. The oil temp would get to 300F before I retrofitted the oil cooler. While there is no water temp gauge, the JB4 lets you "hijack" the fuel level gauge to show water temp instead. (I disable the JB4 boost by using Map 0 on the track.)

I have also gotten limp mode on both cars due to code 30FF which corresponds to turbo wastegate control. Dealer fixed one car by replacing the vacuum lines to the wastegate. Only a BMW specific scanner will show that code.

I've also gotten limp mode due to misfire caused by worn plugs.
I've also gotten limp mode due to a faulty low pressure fuel sensor which I have replaced on both cars. Again, a BMW specific code.

Granted I have not read the 900+ posts in this thread, but I get the feeling that the automatic trans 335xi without an oil cooler will generally enter limp mode on the track. I've been told that the factor oil cooler only came on manual cars, with the sport package and when ordered with 18" wheels.

In contrast my brother in Colorado (very active member IN54NITY) has a 2009 335xi with manual trans and factory oil cooler and has gotten a limp mode only once in 40+ track days.

My attempt to fix the limp mode problem so far consists of:
1. Installing the OEM oil cooler, which involves swapping the oil filter housing, which is not trivial. I also cut out the black plastic grill on the bumper to allow more air to the cooler.
2. Installing the Burger Tuning oil cooler valve which enables the cooler at all times instead of only above 220F (?).
3. Removing the under engine and above engine plastic covers. Not sure if this helps or hurts, but I plan to test it.

I had hoped to test these changes at Gratton, but the serpentine belt came off before I was even up to speed or temp.

Future plans include:
1. Try to use JB4 custom map 6 to create a lower-power tune with less boost which might then lower temperatures.
2. Get a bumper cover for a sport version as that has the proper cooling slots for the OEM oil cooler.
3. Install a bigger aftermarket radiator and oil cooler.

My wife suggested building/buying a track car, so that is possible too.
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      07-27-2015, 09:10 AM   #976
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Is it an automatic or manual? manual 6 speed

Is it the full sport model with the factory oil cooler? I'm not sure honestly. I know it has every option, sport package, cold weather etc. I know it doesn't have any aftermarket parts, stock aside from VMR 18" wheels.

When you say "scanned", was this a Universal scanner or a BMW specific scanner? It was with a cheap one that didn't get BMW codes the day of the track. I just configured the bimmer software with a dcan cable and pulled the codes below though.

Here are the codes I pulled. Once I reset them and rescanned they did not come back. These must of have been stored from the day of the track day.

Error Codes Present On Saturday, July 25, 2015 11:36:47 AM

Code,Type,Description

DME,DME Number: 07611397
29D2,2,Combustion misfires, cylinder 6
2A17,4,DMTL, system fault
30FE,8,Unknown
3100,8,Unknown
30FF,8,Unknown
29E1,8,Mixture control 2


What I would like to know, do Indy shops have the ability to see what's been done to the vehicle over the past 5 years? I would like to know if the HPFP / injectors / coils / plugs have ever been replaced. I've only had the car for a year. I'm thinking a dealer can only do that though. I read on here that there was a injector recall for my year / model so I'd like to know if that was ever done to my car. Turbos were replaced at 75k from previous owner.

I've also been thinking about a dedicated track car as well, but was hoping to get through at least one full track day with this car first.
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      07-27-2015, 02:38 PM   #977
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Code,Type,Description

DME,DME Number: 07611397
29D2,2,Combustion misfires, cylinder 6
2A17,4,DMTL, system fault
30FE,8,Unknown
3100,8,Unknown
30FF,8,Unknown
29E1,8,Mixture control 2

.
30fe is overboost, 30ff is underboost, 3100 is limp mode (caused by the boost faults and misfires.), 29d2 is misfire, 2a17- that's a DMTL fault, won't cause a limp mode and shouldn't be a problem on the track- that was likely already a code you had, and the 29e1 is fueling, could be an injector.
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      07-28-2015, 02:53 PM   #978
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Sweet.. so basically everything. Could be plugs / coils / injectors / turbos etc. I drove it hard today and no faults at all. I'm wondering if a shop can even find this without putting it through track conditions.
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      07-28-2015, 09:25 PM   #979
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Ordered plugs / coils today I'll let you know if that helps.
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      08-05-2015, 09:44 PM   #980
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Good that you have the 6 speed manual as does not produce extra heat from an automatic trans with converter.

As for the oil cooler, look at the front of your oil filter housing.
If it has two larges hoses connected to the front of it, those go to the oil cooler. If you have those hoses you have an oil cooler; else you do not.

A dealer can scan your key FOB and lookup all dealer service on the car; they might do it for free.

Yes, some 2008 have the upgraded injectors, some do not. I was told the part number is visible and therefore easy to check. I keep the engine cover off so that plugs, coils, injectors are easier to check and service.

As mentioned earlier I have two 335xi and both have thrown the 30FF (underboost) code. The dealer fixed the first one by replacing vacuum lines to the wastegate controller and I will have the dealer do the same with my 2nd car; it is estimated as a 2H job.

Do you plan to drive at Gratton again end of September? I plan to be there.
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      10-26-2015, 01:13 PM   #981
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Ok so I'm planning to head to the track for my first time in November in South Florida. Temps usually will be in the 70s during this time of the year. Anyway, I have a 08 335i AT and I just bought a '13 335i 335i. I was unaware of all these limp mode issues at the track but my original plan was to take my '08. I have a Cobb and run Stage 1 agressive map. Otherwise the car is stock.

My question for the more initiated is, should I even bother taking the '08 and instead take the '13 F30. The newer one is stock and AT.

I actually enjoy the E90 more when I'm agressive but don't want to pay a bunch of money getting the E90 ready to go just to go limp. I was thinking of changing the brake fluid to a higher BP and doing a valve cleaning. Whatcha all think? Thanks
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      10-26-2015, 03:05 PM   #982
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Ok so I'm planning to head to the track for my first time in November in South Florida. Temps usually will be in the 70s during this time of the year. Anyway, I have a 08 335i AT and I just bought a '13 335i 335i. I was unaware of all these limp mode issues at the track but my original plan was to take my '08. I have a Cobb and run Stage 1 agressive map. Otherwise the car is stock.

My question for the more initiated is, should I even bother taking the '08 and instead take the '13 F30. The newer one is stock and AT.

I actually enjoy the E90 more when I'm agressive but don't want to pay a bunch of money getting the E90 ready to go just to go limp. I was thinking of changing the brake fluid to a higher BP and doing a valve cleaning. Whatcha all think? Thanks
I have had no overheating issue with my stage 2 agressive N55 based 135i, on the track. I use the stock oil cooler, and BMS Oil thermostat bypass valve ($50 part and simple DIY).

Two friends with manual transmissions, so less heat to shed than with an automatic, take their N54 to the track and have had limp mode due to heat. One is stock (no tuning), and is considering an extra oil cooler.

Having fresh engine oil also helps with cooling. I change mine as soon as viscosity is too thin, and my N55 engine starts consuming oil. Usually every 6 full track days.

Agree with "Cloud9blue" regarding the OBD reader. It is a must if you hit the track want to read, interpret, and clear codes. Also keep a PDF copy of all the n54/n55 engine codes on your smart phone. It has helped me clear and ignore certain OBD codes, and get on with my lapping day...
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      10-26-2015, 03:16 PM   #983
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1. If you track, you need to log actively. Doesn't matter whether it is through JB4 or Cobb or MHD. Many things can cause a limp mode, and not all are heat related. But having a log and ability to pull codes, you can figure out what's the problem pretty easily. If you got a used car with decent amount of miles on it, it might be good idea to check the health of the your fuel system through a log and replace your spark plugs and coils.

2. Upgrading the oil cooler alone only solve half of the problem. CSF makes radiators for both AT and MT cars now (N54 and N55 uses the same radiator). They make a huge difference on track, and work even better with aftermarket oil cooler and PPK stage 2 auxiliary radiator.

3. Factory limp mode doesn't get triggered until oil temp hit above 300F (not that is a good thing though). Most of you guys are experiencing coolant temp overheat. That's why you need to upgrade the radiator as well.

4. All N54 and N55 will overheat eventually with stock cooling setup. If you haven't experienced one yet, means you are not driving it fast enough

5. I seriously recommend switching using JB4 as a boost controller and MHD as a backend flash for any N54 track car. Much easier to isolate tuning issues and you can make adjustment on the fly with a smartphone in regard to your wastegate duty cycle and fuel trims without dragging a computer with you.
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Last edited by Cloud9blue; 10-26-2015 at 03:22 PM.
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      10-28-2015, 11:45 AM   #984
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Quote:
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1. If you track, you need to log actively. Doesn't matter whether it is through JB4 or Cobb or MHD. Many things can cause a limp mode, and not all are heat related. But having a log and ability to pull codes, you can figure out what's the problem pretty easily. If you got a used car with decent amount of miles on it, it might be good idea to check the health of the your fuel system through a log and replace your spark plugs and coils.

2. Upgrading the oil cooler alone only solve half of the problem. CSF makes radiators for both AT and MT cars now (N54 and N55 uses the same radiator). They make a huge difference on track, and work even better with aftermarket oil cooler and PPK stage 2 auxiliary radiator.

3. Factory limp mode doesn't get triggered until oil temp hit above 300F (not that is a good thing though). Most of you guys are experiencing coolant temp overheat. That's why you need to upgrade the radiator as well.

4. All N54 and N55 will overheat eventually with stock cooling setup. If you haven't experienced one yet, means you are not driving it fast enough

5. I seriously recommend switching using JB4 as a boost controller and MHD as a backend flash for any N54 track car. Much easier to isolate tuning issues and you can make adjustment on the fly with a smartphone in regard to your wastegate duty cycle and fuel trims without dragging a computer with you.
Never logged but I'll look up how before I go to the track. I was hoping the E90 would be my track car but maybe not. I still may take it and see how it goes on my first day. Since I'm a newbie I may not go as hard as some of you guys.

I'm getting an oil change before I go many recommendations? My E90 has a stock oil cooler.
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      10-28-2015, 12:02 PM   #985
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Never logged but I'll look up how before I go to the track. I was hoping the E90 would be my track car but maybe not. I still may take it and see how it goes on my first day. Since I'm a newbie I may not go as hard as some of you guys.

I'm getting an oil change before I go many recommendations? My E90 has a stock oil cooler.
JB4 mobile app is the best way to go.

If you have a bone stock car and first time on a track, just take it easy. No need to hit the redline with this engine unless you have upgraded turbos. Just shift at 6100-6200 rpm to stay in the optimal power band. That way the oil doesnt get too hot either.
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      10-28-2015, 12:47 PM   #986
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JB4 mobile app is the best way to go.

If you have a bone stock car and first time on a track, just take it easy. No need to hit the redline with this engine unless you have upgraded turbos. Just shift at 6100-6200 rpm to stay in the optimal power band. That way the oil doesnt get too hot either.
I have a Cobb and not JB4, but I will probably not run the tune and instead run stock. If I don't overheat on the first run or two I may switch to a conservative stage 1 map. I'll look up how to log on the Cobb.

Any recommended engine oil for track use and that may aid in keeping the car a little cooler? Thanks!
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      10-28-2015, 01:15 PM   #987
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I have a Cobb and not JB4, but I will probably not run the tune and instead run stock. If I don't overheat on the first run or two I may switch to a conservative stage 1 map. I'll look up how to log on the Cobb.

Any recommended engine oil for track use and that may aid in keeping the car a little cooler? Thanks!
No engine oil is gonna make your car run cooler...

Shell Rotella T6 works great though.

Can't you just leave Cobb connected to the OBD and let it log? Not as clean as the JB4 but you get to log at least.
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      03-28-2016, 02:09 PM   #988
davidwarren
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Just ran my first event of the season. Happy to say I did not have a limp mode or any mechanical issues all weekend. I was running OTS MHD stage 2+ v6 beta in intermediate at NCM.
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      04-28-2016, 09:39 PM   #989
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Hi all,
I"m a newbie to BMW and have a pre-owned 2011 335i xDrive special edition, 6spd.

Loving it so far, and have never been to track with any car. I'm looking at going out to a track day June.

I have the BMW stage 1 performance kit, so mild tune. I'm noticing under hard driving just around the highway, hard accelerations, on/off ramps etc, a few times my car has thrown the orange/half engine symbol, but doesn't go into full limp mode. After turning the car off and restarting CEL is gone, normal operation.

Is this my engine oil heating up? Coolant getting high temp I suspect?

or is it a possible overboots code or misfire or something?

I have a OBD scanner, but it does not pick up any code even when the light is on (after tripping it).

What should I look out for here?

Lastly: I am considering putting the Dinan Stage 2 tune overtop of what I have. It runs the coolant pump at higher output more of the time. Do you think that would be enough to avoid CEL trip if it is the coolant temp? Should I run the coolant mix with a bit more water for track day (improves cooling).
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      04-29-2016, 10:05 PM   #990
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Having two 2008 335xi that I have tracked, worked on, tweaked with coded (with NCS Expert and Carly), here are my opinions based on my limited experience:

The "orange/half engine symbol" without limp mode, mentioned by DieselDrink is often the 30FF or 30FE code indicating Turbo under or over boost. I had it on both 335xi and in each case the dealer fixed it for around $250 by finding and replacing various vacuum lines. Short accelerations are not going to overheat anything.

The real limp mode many are experiencing without codes are due to high coolant temperature. What idiot designer removed the coolant temp gauge from these cars? Perhaps the same idiot that removed the oil dipstick.

Using something like the JB4 or adding a real gauge is the best way to monitor coolant temperature.

Ever since removing the lower plastic engine under-cover and the metal "tray" over the back of the engine, I have never had a limp mode at the track and the oil temp stays below 250 (with OEM cooler). That tray can be removed in less than 5 minutes using only a 8mm nut driver. Makes the engine sound better too.

You really need something like the Carly scanner to read all the BMW specific codes; a generic OBD scanner is nearly useless.
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