[ayyy]

Originally Posted by ayyy

anyone have recommendations for a wheel and tire setup for my pre-LCI e92 335xi on airlift performance? I'm looking at 19" specifically and am leaning towards a square setup to allow for tire rotation and less understeer, while getting a lower offset in the rears to still get an aggressive look.

Bumping this, looking to buy somewhat soon. I see that a lot of you guys in this thread run a staggered setup but I'm trying to stay away from that especially since I'm an xi. Although if anyone can recommend a staggered setup that will still keep my rolling diameter between front and rears to <1% I would consider that

[igzekyativ]

Originally Posted by ayyy

anyone have recommendations for a wheel and tire setup for my pre-LCI e92 335xi on airlift performance? I'm looking at 19" specifically and am leaning towards a square setup to allow for tire rotation and less understeer, while getting a lower offset in the rears to still get an aggressive look.

if you have a different offset in the rear, you can't rotate all four unless you plan to unmount and remount the tires...

Originally Posted by ayyy

Bumping this, looking to buy somewhat soon. I see that a lot of you guys in this thread run a staggered setup but I'm trying to stay away from that especially since I'm an xi. Although if anyone can recommend a staggered setup that will still keep my rolling diameter between front and rears to <1% I would consider that

I am XI (e91) and I am running

Front Wheels - VMR Wheels V710 19x8.5 ET35 5x120 72.6
Rear Wheels - VMR Wheels V710 19x9.5 ET33 5x120 72.6
Front Tires - 235
Rear Tires - 265

This is what VMR told me.. I would ask them directly for your car as it may differ from mine.

"I would go with 235/265. If I can fit a wider tire, I will. The narrower tire in the front may tend to promote a little more understeer. Either way, they're both within the recommended rim width range for the 8.5/9.5 stagger. Technically, the difference in rolling diameter with the 225 front is less than with the 235 front, but they're both less than 1%."

[ayyy]

Originally Posted by igzekyativ

if you have a different offset in the rear, you can't rotate all four unless you plan to unmount and remount the tires...

Lol yeah sometimes my brain turns off. I'll probably have to go with a staggered setup instead of running a huge spacer in the rear with an 8.5" wide wheel then.

Thanks for posting those specs. I will contact VMR as I have also been looking at some V710s (and AG M359s) and mention what you posted. I'm hoping the specs will be real similar with e92 xi and e91 xi. And you're also pre-LCI like me.

Looking at some of your photos, I'm wondering if you think you can go even wider in the rear? Perhaps the same specs with just a slightly lower offset? I'm trying to be reasonably aggressive while still being able to tuck the rears without a crazy amount of camber. In fact my drive height at 40f 80r has been aligned to have 0º camber. The biggest priority is to be able to tuck both the rears and fronts (once I get those extended sway bar links in) while still being aggressive.

[igzekyativ]

Originally Posted by ayyy

Lol yeah sometimes my brain turns off. I'll probably have to go with a staggered setup instead of running a huge spacer in the rear with an 8.5" wide wheel then.

Thanks for posting those specs. I will contact VMR as I have also been looking at some V710s (and AG M359s) and mention what you posted. I'm hoping the specs will be real similar with e92 xi and e91 xi. And you're also pre-LCI like me.

Looking at some of your photos, I'm wondering if you think you can go even wider in the rear? Perhaps the same specs with just a slightly lower offset? I'm trying to be reasonably aggressive while still being able to tuck the rears without a crazy amount of camber. In fact my drive height at 40f 80r has been aligned to have 0º camber. The biggest priority is to be able to tuck both the rears and fronts (once I get those extended sway bar links in) while still being aggressive.

Good news is that, at least with my car, there is more space in pre-lci cars (not sure why).

I think i am fairly maxed out with tire and wheel sizes.. when I am lowered and tucking all four, it seems that everything just barely fits (I got very lucky as I had the wheels before the suspension!).

[Digitalize]

Pre-LCI E90/1 are 8 or 12mm narrower on the rear, not sure where the difference is and exact amount as I've seen both mentioned.

I'm running 9.5 et28 and 11 et35 static, not sure on tucking when aired out though.

[ayyy]

thanks guys. I've actually since switched my thinking and may pull the trigger on some staggered Alzor 030s. 8.5 et35 and 9.5 et40. I have been in touch with James from ECSTuning all morning and he thinks those will be perfect for me along with some 235/35/19s and 265/30/19s. I may run a spacer in the rear after measuring to see how much I can go out with still being able to tuck. I just don't think I can shell out the money right now as I'm about to move and this whole air ride thing kinda bankrupted me haha

[igzekyativ]

Originally Posted by ayyy

thanks guys. I've actually since switched my thinking and may pull the trigger on some staggered Alzor 030s. 8.5 et35 and 9.5 et40. I have been in touch with James from ECSTuning all morning and he thinks those will be perfect for me along with some 235/35/19s and 265/30/19s. I may run a spacer in the rear after measuring to see how much I can go out with still being able to tuck. I just don't think I can shell out the money right now as I'm about to move and this whole air ride thing kinda bankrupted me haha

Fair warning, be careful with 235/35 and 256/30 tires.. This is what I have, but several potholes later, and 3 of my rims are bent... not a whole lot of protection with these tires. They are a little stretched and not very tall. If I did it all over, I would probably go for the flow formed VMR wheels (instead of just the regular ones) for their extra strength.

[ayyy]

Originally Posted by igzekyativ

Fair warning, be careful with 235/35 and 256/30 tires.. This is what I have, but several potholes later, and 3 of my rims are bent... not a whole lot of protection with these tires. They are a little stretched and not very tall. If I did it all over, I would probably go for the flow formed VMR wheels (instead of just the regular ones) for their extra strength.

While that does worry me a bit, I feel like 235/35 and 265/30 are by far the most common dimensions I've seen e9x owners have with 19s. Now granted I'm basically getting reps so I'm sure I'll be at more risk, but I've heard nothing but good things about Alzors for the price. So at the end of the day, I guess I'd rather spend 140 on a new wheel if it gets bent than 400 for a new VMR/AG (for now at least).

[ayyy]

Originally Posted by igzekyativ

ayyy the custom end links worked out great! I set the end links to 310mm long and it is perfect. The car tucks the fronts nicely.

The length of threaded rod I bought was able to make 4 center bars, 210mm long each (the center bars that came with the kit were ~162mm long). I can sell you the extra two center bars I had made if you want them; they are cut and ready to go.

Just want to thank you igzekyativ again for selling me those lengthened sway bar endlink center bars. Just swapped em out and mounted my brand new VMR v705s and Hankook Ventus V12 Evo2s!



Specs on wheels for anyone interested:

19" 8.5 et35 front 9.5 et33 rear
225/35/19 front 255/30/19 rear

I can definitely go about 5mm wider in the front and maybe 8mm in the rear while still being able to tuck.

[igzekyativ]

Originally Posted by ayyy

Just want to thank you igzekyativ again for selling me those lengthened sway bar endlink center bars. Just swapped em out and mounted my brand new VMR v705s and Hankook Ventus V12 Evo2s!



Specs on wheels for anyone interested:

19" 8.5 et35 front 9.5 et33 rear
225/35/19 front 255/30/19 rear

I can definitely go about 5mm wider in the front and maybe 8mm in the rear while still being able to tuck.

Looks awesome! Glad it worked out

[RoyceE90]

Originally Posted by ayyy

... aaand a photo:



Fullsize:

View post on imgur.com

looks nice man heres a pic of mine i love it but its being split and sold

[ayyy]

Originally Posted by RoyceE90

looks nice man heres a pic of mine i love it but its being split and sold

beautiful! bummer about it being sold tho. Anyway here's another of mine taken with a better camera

[RoyceE90]

Originally Posted by ayyy

beautiful! bummer about it being sold tho. Anyway here's another of mine taken with a better camera

I couldn't resist not test fitting the wheels I had planned for it so here's a few shots

[Digitalize]

Has anyone gone from a coilover to air? I'm wondering how much wider the front bag is compared to a spring, as at the moment my wheel only just missed my adjuster and I'm worried I'm going to need to space the wheel with air.

Also is the longer ARB droplink just an XI thing or all models?

[bf15]

Im thinking about getting bags for my e93. Is there a kit anyone knows of that has a compressor that will fit in the trunk of the e93 with the top down? Or possible an engine bay mounted one?

[Digitalize]

I think you can fit the compressor in the side recesses?

[ayyy]

Hey everyone,

I've been on airlift performance for over 3 months now on my 08 e92 335xi. I was wondering what you guys do to improve performance/handling on your air ride-equipped vehicles. I'm basically hopping down the road under aggressive driving sometimes even triggering my traction control light (which I feel should never happen on dry pavement with AWD. A few questions below:

1) How firm is your damping setting if you use airlift performance 30-way adjustable damping shocks? My ride height is 42 PSI front and 77 PSI rear. Damping is at 22/30 front and 15/30 rear.

2) Do you have any other suspension upgrades done? M3 subframe bushings? Upgraded sway bars? Upgraded strut tower brace? I should mention I've done the custom extended sway bar endlink mod pioneered by igzekyativ which lengthened them by about 50 mm.

3) As a general rule, do you guys notice a firmer ride quality with less PSI in the bags or more? I thought the lower the PSI, the less spring travel would occur and therefore equal more firm and better handling, but others have told me the more PSI, the less the bag can flex therefore equalling a firmer ride. It would be unfortunate if the only way to achieve superior handling would be to raise the height of the car, negating the advantage of a lower center of gravity.

Thanks and please let me know! A new photo of my car for your efforts:

[Digitalize]

The higher the PSI the higher the spring rate. If it's skipping over bumps then it's too stiff, or your dampening doesn't match the spring rate.

Air Lift have recommended pressures front/rear and dampening rates.

35-45 psi with 10/30 dampening for the front.
70 psi with 10/30 dampening for the rear.

So your dampening seems to stiff, and rear pressure is a little high. Try their recommended settings and go from there.

For anything but a perfectly smooth road a softer suspension setup will be faster than a stiff one.

Also worth looking at your tyre pressures, and have you had the car aligned at drive height?

Have you checked the sway bar location when at drive height? Lengthening the links for aired out might be fine but could put the sway bar in the wrong location when at drive height, this probably wouldn't cause your issue though.

[ayyy]

Originally Posted by Digitalize

The higher the PSI the higher the spring rate. If it's skipping over bumps then it's too stiff, or your dampening doesn't match the spring rate.

Air Lift have recommended pressures front/rear and dampening rates.

35-45 psi with 10/30 dampening for the front.
70 psi with 10/30 dampening for the rear.

So your dampening seems to stiff, and rear pressure is a little high. Try their recommended settings and go from there.

For anything but a perfectly smooth road a softer suspension setup will be faster than a stiff one.

Also worth looking at your tyre pressures, and have you had the car aligned at drive height?

Have you checked the sway bar location when at drive height? Lengthening the links for aired out might be fine but could put the sway bar in the wrong location when at drive height, this probably wouldn't cause your issue though.

Thanks for that very detailed reply. Lots of great info here.

The stiffer (higher) spring rate makes sense if there is a high PSI value. That would mean it needs more weight to compress, resulting in less spring travel and a more firm ride. However, I'm right around the recommended PSI settings for my bags, and actually under the level for the rears. So, if anything, shouldn't my ride quality be too soft? Even with my damping being set higher than recommended?

Speaking of which, shouldn't damping only affect how the shocks handle the spring travel? Meaning it shouldn't affect how stiff or soft my ride is, merely how long after I hit a bump it takes to level out? A very high damping setting (30/30) would mean there's zero 'bouce' after I hit a bump where a very low setting (0/30) would continue bouncing for too long? If anything, in order to stabilize the car, the damping value would need to increase at the cost of comfortability? I feel my car bounces too much after a bump, and would rather have the car be more stable instead of comfortable.

This leads me to a question about your statement "For anything but a perfectly smooth road a softer suspension setup will be faster than a stiff one." Surely softer suspension would cause more body roll and general instability as opposed to a stiffer-set suspension? Even with the occasional bumps? Is it just a matter of finding a middle ground?

I'm on 19s with 35 and 30 sidewall front/rear. Hankook Ventus V12 Evo2s. Pressure COLD is 35 front/37 rear, just a hair above BMW door card PSI values, and when hot are about 40 front/42 rear. So this would perhaps add to the reasoning for why I might hop or skip over a bump, that being my tires don't absorb as much of the impact and flex enough to compensate.

I had an alignment done after I initially installed the kit. Then a shop did some minor custom front end work (lengthening sway bar end links), but I did not get an alignment after that. It's possible that disconnecting the bottom of the strut from the knuckle and then re-connecting it was enough to get it out of alignment. The sway bar location at ride height undoubtedly changed as a result of this, perhaps rendering it less effective. I will need to get the car on jackstands and jack both of the front wheels up to see where it sits.

So, overall, while keeping my ride height the same, what would be your recommendations for a more sporty/autocross/stable suspension at the cost of comfortability? Also thanks for reading through this ridiculously lengthy post

[Digitalize]

Try setting your dampening to 0 and going for a drive, then do the same route with them set to 30, you'll see how dampening changes ride quality. It's quite a noticeable difference especially on hard/quick bumps. It won't make a difference to overall compression over time as that's what spring rate is for, but it makes the damper react slower or more accurately be more resistant to change. Essentially as you increase the dampening rate the hole that the oil needs to move through gets smaller.

Your spring rates all round are stiffer than I plan to run, but I'd try lowering just the rear down to 70psi.

When I say softer suspension I actually mean more compliant. Often people will make their car stiffer believing it will handle better, but if it's not compliant enough for the surface then you'll be reducing the amount of time your tyre is in contact with the road, thus handling worse.

I'd set everything back to recommended and go from there personally. But generally skipping over bumps is due to a mismatch of dampening/spring rate or them both too stiff.

There could be other potential problems causing it too I guess, worn bushes. Fitting Air will increase the wear rate as they'll be twisting more from the raising/lowering of the suspension, and sitting in unnatural positions etc.

[ayyy]

Originally Posted by Digitalize

Try setting your dampening to 0 and going for a drive, then do the same route with them set to 30, you'll see how dampening changes ride quality. It's quite a noticeable difference especially on hard/quick bumps. It won't make a difference to overall compression over time as that's what spring rate is for, but it makes the damper react slower or more accurately be more resistant to change. Essentially as you increase the dampening rate the hole that the oil needs to move through gets smaller.

Your spring rates all round are stiffer than I plan to run, but I'd try lowering just the rear down to 70psi.

When I say softer suspension I actually mean more compliant. Often people will make their car stiffer believing it will handle better, but if it's not compliant enough for the surface then you'll be reducing the amount of time your tyre is in contact with the road, thus handling worse.

I'd set everything back to recommended and go from there personally. But generally skipping over bumps is due to a mismatch of dampening/spring rate or them both too stiff.

There could be other potential problems causing it too I guess, worn bushes. Fitting Air will increase the wear rate as they'll be twisting more from the raising/lowering of the suspension, and sitting in unnatural positions etc.

Thanks again for the detailed response. So you think that I'm hopping maybe because my damping setting is too high (too resistant to oil flow), therefore making the airspring compensate for the change as opposed to the shock? Causing my car to "bounce?" In theory, would softening the damping, making it more ready to take the shock from the airspring? I've just found that by INCREASING my damping it makes my car bob less after hitting a bump, but maybe it's the other way around.

Do you think 7 PSI really makes a difference to lower the rears? I mean that's pretty much how much my 3P preset fluctuates when driving. But I can definitely try as that's easier than removing my entire trunk lining to access my rear damping adjustment.

Your compliant suspension makes total sense to me. Like you said in your initial response, unless you're on a track, you're gonna encounter bumps. So it is about finding a happy medium then for road driving?

Do you know of any obvious signs of bushings wearing? Aside from visually inspecting?

Thanks again for your help thus far

[Digitalize]

The 7psi wouldn't make as much difference as the dampening being too stiff. And if anything you might get better results by raising the spring rate to match the dampening, but ideally you want to lower the dampening. You should be able to just reach the tops of the struts to drop in the adjusters from the left and right side panels that remove, I can just.

I know for an MOT they jack the car up and try and move the wheel, it shouldn't really move in any direction when the bushes are good.

You want to find a suspension setup that doesn't roll too much but is keeping the tyre in contact with the road as much as possible.

Initially I thought your problem was stretched tyres but you don't have them so it's not that.

If the car bobs too much after a bump it's because the damper is too soft, not suppressing the springs natural bounce, it's often a problem people get after the damper is worn and failing. Pushing down on a corner of the car it should return to still after one or two rebounds.

Suspension isn't a simple thing and whilst air suspension is different, it follows the same rules as conventional suspension, so it might be worth researching how it all works or even talking to a specialist, who could also setup the car for a fee.