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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > It used to be 150k, then 100k now our E9x & Modern BMWs start dying at 50k



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      04-09-2019, 11:30 AM   #1
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Exclamation It used to be 150k, then 100k now our E9x & Modern BMWs start dying at 50k

This may come off as a rant but this specific forum usually get a fair amount of traffic and new postings from curious shoppers trying to decide on what BMW E9x to buy as a first or next car.

It is important to state what our cars really are like to own!

When buying a used BMW with over 30k miles and over 5 years old expect to be replacing or repairing a lot of minor and major things BMW owners used to replace/repair back in the 1990s/2000s when cars had 100k miles or more and been beating around the road for over a decade.

I've been seeing this said from a lot from various BMW mechanics (on/off YouTube) even the BMW Dealership service guys will tell you it’s becoming normal for belts, pulleys, oil gasket seals, alternator/batteries and water pumps to be replaced on relatively new BMWs with 60k miles or less.
As someone that owned three generations of BMW 3 series (1995 to 2001 and now a 2011) this is my dreadful reality behind my many happy Instagram pictures showing my fun to drive ultimate driving machine.

My current 2011 335i is at 57k miles and I've come to realized I’ve already replaced and repaired as much under the hood if not more [wear/tear] parts on the engine/drive-train than my previous 1995 318i when I had it at 165,000 miles and my 2001 330i when I had that car at 100,000 miles.

Worse is at my car's mileage had I done ALL of my work at the BMW Dealership I would have already spent close to $10,000 in simple repair and basic maintenance expenses on a car that I owned from 40,000 miles when it was just over 5 years old to 57,000 miles now at 8 years old.

Over all the design and built quality has greatly improved in the E90 and modern BMWs but if BMW can quit their love affair with cheap under-the-hood plastic parts and cheap oil seals and gaskets then these cars would be true ultimate driving machines.
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      04-09-2019, 11:38 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarco View Post
This may come off as a rant but this specific forum usually get a fair amount of traffic and new postings from curious shoppers trying to decide on what BMW E9x to buy as a first or next car.

It is important to state what our cars really are like to own!

When buying a used BMW with over 30k miles and over 5 years old expect to be replacing or repairing a lot of minor and major things BMW owners used to replace/repair back in the 1990s/2000s when cars had 100k miles or more and been beating around the road for over a decade.

I've been seeing this said from a lot from various BMW mechanics (on/off YouTube) even the BMW Dealership service guys will tell you it’s becoming normal for belts, pulleys, oil gasket seals, alternator/batteries and water pumps to be replaced on relatively new BMWs with 60k miles or less.
As someone that owned three generations of BMW 3 series (1995 to 2001 and now a 2011) this is my dreadful reality behind my many happy Instagram pictures showing my fun to drive ultimate driving machine.

My current 2011 335i is at 57k miles and I've come to realized I’ve already replaced and repaired as much under the hood if not more [wear/tear] parts on the engine/drive-train than my previous 1995 318i when I had it at 165,000 miles and my 2001 330i when I had that car at 100,000 miles.

Worse is at my car's mileage had I done ALL of my work at the BMW Dealership I would have already spent close to $10,000 in simple repair and basic maintenance expenses on a car that I owned from 40,000 miles when it was just over 5 years old to 57,000 miles now at 8 years old.

Over all the design and built quality has greatly improved in the E90 and modern BMWs but if BMW can quit their love affair with cheap under-the-hood plastic parts and cheap oil seals and gaskets then these cars would be true ultimate driving machines.
I agree with you that E90s especially the turbo versions require extensive maintenance usually before 100k.

However i think BMWs are getting alot more reliable. The f platform has gotten better not worse. I think there was a dip with E platform.
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      04-09-2019, 11:39 AM   #3
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My car's 9 years old at 112,000 and the most I spent on a single repair was just under $2,000 for a clutch, transmission mounts, and fluid.

I spent $80-100 on belts/pulleys, water pump was under warranty, VANOS was under warranty, OFHG was under warranty, and I decided to upgrade my control arms for around $350 though i didn't need to.

All in all I may have spent $3,000 max on parts and upgrades. It's only broken down once when my water pump died.
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      04-09-2019, 11:52 AM   #4
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With the push for more environment friendly materials and fluids (less waste as well) the cars tend to suffer.

Yes they are better for the environment and manufacturers are being shoved and forced into a corner to do that but the longevity of parts or full systems tends to suffer (crappier/lighter oils+longer intervals, more and complex systems to manage emissions/efficiency, metals/gasket materials either won't last as long or can't handle the same.

Just wait until all the electronics get too complicated and start failing or go out of date. You'll have to be an electrical engineer just to open a hood.

Either way we all keep buying cars; when they break we pay to fix or buy new and restart the cycle all over again. Manufacturers keep making money either way.

Also this isn't just cars; As an engineer dealing a lot with hydraulics we see this everywhere.
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      04-09-2019, 12:04 PM   #5
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I have far more experience with BMWs than you, over a longer period of time, over way more miles (900,000 total), with a broader spectrum of models. My two N52-powered BMWs have been more reliable and of better build quality than my '89 E30 and '97 Z3. My conclusions about BMWs is they do require more repair, but they last longer than other makes and remain in better shape at advanced age and miles if reasonably taken care of. Maybe your 335i has just been an poorly managed car.

The N52 E90 has shown it easily reaches 300,000 miles, and the turbo versions are showing 250,000 miles is easily attainable.

Last edited by Efthreeoh; 04-10-2019 at 05:16 AM..
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      04-09-2019, 12:25 PM   #6
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yes, more complex, forced induction, high plastic, "performance cars" will require more maintenance.

I think the golden era for tank like cars has past. 80s is long gone friend.

Enjoy your analog car while you can.

One day we'll all be on subscription-based, electric, no steering wheel, self driving, single caboose road trains.
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      04-09-2019, 12:34 PM   #7
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It seems like only the E9X generation that experiences the most problems. E9Xs start experiencing problems as early as 50k miles. I have a 2015 X5 with 60k miles and it has not experienced on single problem and only required minor maintenance and tune ups. I guess BMW figured out all of the fuel pump/fuel injector/turbo problems that plagued our cars.
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      04-09-2019, 12:35 PM   #8
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The japanese starting building more reliable and cheaper luxury cars in the 90s, so BMW switched their strategy from building craftmanship type cars to cars with advanced technology.

If you look at the main 3 german brands, BMW, Mercedes and audi they always introduce new tech in every generation versus the japanese and american companies that waits until the tech is more mature before introducing it to the mass market, the exception would be tesla.

So with more advanced and unmature tech you will have more issues. Also germany has stricter environmental laws thats why you have more leaky gaskets compared to american and japanese suppliers. The question about BMW plastics breaking...its only because BMW is cheap.

To the people who say why doesnt BMW build simple lighter cars, the answer is new BMW car buyers dont want that. They want more space and more tech and their willing to pay new car prices.

BMW doesnt care about the second or third owner of these cars want.

Newer cars will become even more complex and advanced with more components...until everything is electric and it'll become a cell phone where all the functions are done on one board and you just swap out the board if it goes bad. With electric cars it'll basically become the board, battery and electric motor...so either the board, battery or motor is bad and you just swap it out.

Last edited by TemjinX2; 04-09-2019 at 12:44 PM..
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      04-09-2019, 12:40 PM   #9
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in the future people with the space will probably have a gasoline car they love for the weekends and daily drive a electric.

My future plan is to get a F87 M2 6spd, pay it off and just daily drive a model S.
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      04-09-2019, 12:44 PM   #10
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I think you have it wrong... 100,000 miles used to be the limit of the car.
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      04-09-2019, 12:45 PM   #11
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look at it this way.

You get to buy a new bmw every 5 years!
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      04-09-2019, 12:48 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e91-330xi View Post
look at it this way.

You get to buy a new bmw every 5 years!
if you rebuild your BMW with fceuro parts...you have a BMW with lifetime warranty...
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      04-09-2019, 12:51 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TemjinX2 View Post
in the future people with the space will probably have a gasoline car they love for the weekends and daily drive a electric.

My future plan is to get a F87 M2 6spd, pay it off and just daily drive a model S.
I agree as well. Electric cars is fantastic car for commuting and things. But I don't see myself having as much fun even though it's so fast, you need exhaust and shifting IMO and all that.
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      04-09-2019, 12:57 PM   #14
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I agree as well. Electric cars is fantastic car for commuting and things. But I don't see myself having as much fun even though it's so fast, you need exhaust and shifting IMO and all that.
too be honest, i only want the tesla for auto pilot for when i move back to california traffic lol. Other then that, i dont care that its electric.
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      04-09-2019, 12:59 PM   #15
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TLDR

THIS GARBAGE AGAIN?

I mean, come on. Same stuff you insert in every thread you post in, but now we have this dedicated thread...

You know what’s changed?

The time value of money and you. You bought one of the most expensive to maintain BMWs for a song and you sound like every other first timer on here when they get their first bill from a BMW dealer.
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      04-09-2019, 01:02 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlow98 View Post
TLDR

THIS GARBAGE AGAIN?

I mean, come on. Same stuff you insert in every thread you post in, but now we have this dedicated thread...

You know what’s changed?

The time value of money and you. You bought one of the most expensive to maintain BMWs for a song and you sound like every other first timer on here when they get their first bill from a BMW dealer.
thats true...if your the second or third owner of these cars and you only bought it for 6-11k...they cant really complain. Even with every common issued fixed at the dealership it still wouldnt add up to the price of the car new or 3yr depreciation the first owner took lol.
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      04-09-2019, 01:04 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlow98 View Post
TLDR

THIS GARBAGE AGAIN?

I mean, come on. Same stuff you insert in every thread you post in, but now we have this dedicated thread...

You know what’s changed?

The time value of money and you. You bought one of the most expensive to maintain BMWs for a song and you sound like every other first timer on here when they get their first bill from a BMW dealer.
I agree. If the engine or turbo doesn't go... it's not that terrible to maintain from DIY. It's to be expected tho you spend 10k if you would not DIY and use dealer.

That is why the car depreciates... to account for dealer cost fixing it. But you can cheat that by learning to do it yourself and then you got a great car most other people wouldn't be able to afford.
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      04-09-2019, 03:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarco View Post
...As someone that owned three generations of BMW 3 series (1995 to 2001 and now a 2011) this is my dreadful reality...My current 2011 335i is at 57k miles and I've come to realized I’ve already replaced and repaired as much under the hood if not more [wear/tear] parts on the engine/drive-train than my previous 1995 318i when I had it at 165,000 miles and my 2001 330i when I had that car at 100,000 miles.
Without knowing the particular components you have replaced on your 2011 335i, we can't learn much from your "single-vehicle" experience. Also, you are comparing normally-aspirated 318i and 330i to a turbo. Further, there have been a LOT of added "gizmos"/options since 2001, and those are basically something additional to have to maintain.

Aside from gasket leaks and issues with the serpentine belt tensioner, the 328i/xi seems to quite often remain reliable and trouble-free to 150,000 miles and beyond. What's "F30"'s mileage now -- 350,000?

My own 2007 328xi E91 looks, handles & performs as new at 12+ years & 134,000 miles, with what appear to be original shocks, struts, and suspension members. Only thing I've done to it in last 25 months is plug change and fluid/filter changes. Absolutely NO VCG leak, NO OFHG leak, and minimal seepage at RR of oil pan gasket. NO Fault Codes since changing plugs two years ago, when High RPM misfires occurred due to enlarged plug gap.

YMMV, and my own mileage WILL vary at some point, but I plan to maintain it properly (as I enjoy regular forays to 6,000 RPM in 1st & 2nd) and see how long it lasts, and do my own diagnosis & repair. Since WOT acceleration in lower gears is hard on the transmission & transfer case, and THOSE are the components I am NOT equipped to rebuild, I may reduce my "forays," some day.

George
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      04-09-2019, 04:22 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbalthrop View Post
Without knowing the particular components you have replaced on your 2011 335i, we can't learn much from your "single-vehicle" experience. Also, you are comparing normally-aspirated 318i and 330i to a turbo.
This is a HUGE factor of comparison. NA vs forced induction.
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      04-09-2019, 04:30 PM   #20
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Remember the n54 was the first mass produced turbo engine they produced and it introduced many new or early development technologies like direct injection, of course it will be unreliable even if Toyota were to do the same except they never would.
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      04-09-2019, 05:13 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbalthrop View Post
Without knowing the particular components you have replaced on your 2011 335i, we can't learn much from your "single-vehicle" experience. Also, you are comparing normally-aspirated 318i and 330i to a turbo.
This is a HUGE factor of comparison. NA vs forced induction.
+1. I have a 2009 328i N52 and I have replaced/repaired exactly what I expected to replace based on the research I have done. No surprises. Love your car and it will love you back. Looking to get 200,000+ easily.
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      04-09-2019, 05:49 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal View Post
I agree. If the engine or turbo doesn't go... it's not that terrible to maintain from DIY. It's to be expected tho you spend 10k if you would not DIY and use dealer.

That is why the car depreciates... to account for dealer cost fixing it. But you can cheat that by learning to do it yourself and then you got a great car most other people wouldn't be able to afford.
Such an excellent point. Well done.
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