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      04-23-2023, 01:57 PM   #1981
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Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
I'm sure I'll get booted if I respond with political commentary, so I'll refrain from explaining these errors of thought. But simply, subsidies are just the Government taxing industry less than it really wants to. Personal tax rebates for EV are just compensating for the price delta between the cost of ICE and EV (battery cost) to make EV somewhat affordable to adopt. The next forcing function to adopt to EV is a massive increase in the motor fuel tax. Just wait.
More accurately subsidies are picking specific industries it considers to represent strategic or political importance and to support them using tax revenues collected from everyone. The government has been doing this for decades. This is nothing new. Why is there ethanol in our gasoline? We expend far more energy to produce ethanol than the energy we derive from it. Yet thanks to the corn lobby we are all forced to put gasoline in our cars that is laced with that crap. We provide billions every year to our farmers because of the agricultural lobby. We provide billions in subsidies to defense contractors to preserve jobs in specific states by acquiring weapons even the pentagon does not want. We bail out banks that foolishly made risky and illegal bets. We provide them interest free loans for tens of trillions of dollars so they can lend the money to small businesses revive the economy and do nothing when they take those interest free loans and buy treasury bonds and get interest from the same government that gave them the money for free. Most of these don't even represent some strategic future significance for us. At least with EVs we are investing in an industry that will make the US more competitive against foreign rivals.

EVs are here, and in the very near future they will dominate the autos driven on US roads. Whether the US decides to manufacture those autos and batteries will not change that reality. In the 80's and 90's Taiwan, Korea, Japan, Singapore,... all subsidized their semiconductor industries and now dominate those industries. Is that what you want to happen with EVs?
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      04-23-2023, 02:03 PM   #1982
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Originally Posted by Patton250 View Post
Dang! Our first thread elitist!!!! Where have you been hiding? Dealing with people like you in person face to face is a complete and total blast. It usually ends with the elitist storming out of the room.
I guess when you can't debate topics on their merit the name calling starts. Typical course of action for your kind. Instead of politicizing and resorting to infantile name calling how about we just stick to a debate about the topic on hand?
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      04-23-2023, 02:05 PM   #1983
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Originally Posted by akin67 View Post
I guess when you can't debate topics on their merit the name calling starts. Typical course of action for your kind. Instead of politicizing and resorting to infantile name calling how about we just stick to a debate about the topic on hand?
Thatís not name-calling. I was calling you out for your remarkably offensive slam to that member. But then you know that.
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      04-23-2023, 02:05 PM   #1984
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Originally Posted by Patton250 View Post
He knows that brother. There is no doubt in my mind. It’s just what he wrote sounds good to him plus he hears it all the time from the news outlets he watches so it must be true.
The news outlets you watch just paid out $780 million dollars for their lies. They also admitted in court that their journalists are not journalists and are just there for entertaining content. So yeah you keep getting your news (alternate reality) from them and let's see how far that gets you in life.
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      04-23-2023, 02:07 PM   #1985
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Originally Posted by akin67 View Post
The news outlets you watch just paid out $780 million dollars for their lies. They also admitted in court that their journalists are not journalists and are just their for entertaining content. So yeah you keep getting your news (alternate reality) from them and let's see how far that gets you in life.
And we are done
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      04-23-2023, 02:09 PM   #1986
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Originally Posted by Patton250 View Post
That’s not name-calling. I was calling you out for your remarkably offensive slam to that member. But then you know that.
So I guess in your world when someone accuses my comment of being computer generated CharGPT I should not respond in kind? If you are so concerned about calling out offensive remarks, why didn't you call out his comments? Oh thats right, since he was defending your train of thought he couldn't possibly do wrong no matter how offensive his comments. And yes we are definitely done.

Last edited by akin67; 04-23-2023 at 02:22 PM..
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      04-23-2023, 02:14 PM   #1987
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Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX View Post
the usual handwringing about the grid
Looking at our present circumstances and projecting when they will improve to where we need them to be to facilitate our transition to EVs is not hand-wringing.

There is a difference between hand-wringing and acknowledging functional reality.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/addin...160838257.html
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      04-23-2023, 02:25 PM   #1988
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
Looking at our present circumstances and projecting when they will improve to where we need them to be to facilitate our transition to EVs is not hand-wringing.

There is a difference between hand-wringing and acknowledging functional reality.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/addin...160838257.html
Maybe the governments both state and federal desire to increase the amount of electric vehicles on the road, will light a fire up their butts to improve the grid, which, as most people who live in reality know, is already in massive trouble, even if there was no such thing as electric vehicles.
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      04-23-2023, 02:33 PM   #1989
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Originally Posted by BGM-M3COMP View Post
I remember that top gear UK piece from like 15 years ago when Jeremy Clarkson was like, ďsooner or later weíll all be driving Chinese cars.Ē

Guess he might be right after all.

But china already has some pretty cool ev.

We need America to keep pushing to compete! We need to take over with our evís!!!!
I donít mean to slam Chinese manufacturing but most of the stuff that comes from over there is absolute junk. Most of it is hella cheap versions of stuff they copied and ripped off from other countries manufactures. Iím sure their electric vehicles are no different. They will probably produce an incredibly cheap version of some technology they stole from Tesla and call it their own. So I agree with you and I hope US manufacturers take the lead on innovation when it comes to electric vehicles. You know German and Japanese manufactures will. Just like theyíve done with ice.
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      04-23-2023, 04:16 PM   #1990
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patton250 View Post
Um…….Ah……This stuff really seems to fly over your head. Let me help you out.

How is not allowing any more combustion engine vehicles to be built after 2035 not forcing people to buy electric vehicles?

I don’t hate electric vehicles. I bet MOST of the people here arguing against them being made mandatory to manufacture through unguided emotional legislation don’t hate them either.
talk about flying over someones head...lmao

do you really think anybody on this board is going to out live ICE cars built today??
Do you think all the ICE cars are headed to the crusher on Jan 1, 2035?

YOU will never be forced to buy an EV in your lifetime, but someday you may finally realize they aren't the devil and actually own one

You seem to be more worried about future generations right to buy new CO2 spewing ICE vehicles than the air they breath and the planet they will inherent

Last edited by SoCal_NSX; 04-23-2023 at 04:28 PM..
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      04-23-2023, 04:39 PM   #1991
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX View Post
talk about flying over someones head...lmao

do you really think anybody on this board is going to out live ICE cars built today??
Do you think all the ICE cars are headed to the crusher on Jan 1, 2035?

YOU will never be forced to buy an EV in your lifetime, but someday you may finally realize they aren't the devil and actually own one

You seem to be more worried about future generations right to buy new CO2 spewing ICE vehicles than the air they breath and the planet they will inherent
Thank you for verifying that you donít get it. Iíll stop trying to explain it to you now. I know you didnít do it on purpose, but this last post of yours has been very helpful.
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      04-23-2023, 05:31 PM   #1992
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patton250 View Post
Thank you for verifying that you donít get it. Iíll stop trying to explain it to you now. I know you didnít do it on purpose, but this last post of yours has been very helpful.
talk about not getting it...you are absolutely clueless about anything EV yet you spew hyperbolic nonsense nonstop on here like about how they will never make it to 2035 becuese they cant fill up in 5 minutes....

I'm done...

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      04-23-2023, 05:35 PM   #1993
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I'm done...
:-)
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      04-23-2023, 06:09 PM   #1994
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A. One of my current cars (courtesy) is a plug in hybrid (330e),the ride quality is nice and the electric miles are quiet.
B. I've driven the model 3 and y. Ride quality is not my type. Too much road noise and transmitted noise into cabin from imperfect road surfaces.
C I've travelled in a friends model s for around 2000 miles. Ride quality ok but interior is mondeo/skoda level.
D. When I step into my US built German SUV's all is forgotten. Enough power Enough convenience Enough comfort Enough space etc. The only thing lacking is that I pay more per mile and in a straight line I'm.slower but those really don't matter to me at the moment.
The biggest worry is the write off rate of ev and that no one wants to buy a second hand one and dealers don't wish to stock used ones etc.
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      04-23-2023, 07:35 PM   #1995
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Governments in Australia are now looking at new taxs for EVs, to combat their huge revenue drops on fuel taxs. Fucken crazy.
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      04-23-2023, 07:58 PM   #1996
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2035 on the move!!!!

Big updates coming soon!!! Can't wait for 2028-2030!

The holy fuck it's really happening moment will soon come!

Let's go EV POWER!
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      04-23-2023, 08:50 PM   #1997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX View Post
talk about flying over someones head...lmao

do you really think anybody on this board is going to out live ICE cars built today??
Do you think all the ICE cars are headed to the crusher on Jan 1, 2035?

YOU will never be forced to buy an EV in your lifetime, but someday you may finally realize they aren't the devil and actually own one

You seem to be more worried about future generations right to buy new CO2 spewing ICE vehicles than the air they breath and the planet they will inherent
Come on SoCal, please, you drive a V8 Jeep Wrangler and a 2-seat Cayman. If anyone is unconcerned about the air we breathe and the planet it's you. You admitted you bought the Tesla for the acceleration and not the Green. It's fine to argue, just be consistent.
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      04-23-2023, 08:50 PM   #1998
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Originally Posted by Alpine* View Post
Governments in Australia are now looking at new taxs for EVs, to combat their huge revenue drops on fuel taxs. Fucken crazy.
Was always coming..
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      04-23-2023, 09:02 PM   #1999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Come on SoCal, please, you drive a V8 Jeep Wrangler and a 2-seat Cayman. If anyone is unconcerned about the air we breathe and the planet it's you. You admitted you bought the Tesla for the acceleration and not the Green. It's fine to argue, just be consistent.
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      04-23-2023, 09:20 PM   #2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Come on SoCal, please, you drive a V8 Jeep Wrangler and a 2-seat Cayman. If anyone is unconcerned about the air we breathe and the planet it's you. You admitted you bought the Tesla for the acceleration and not the Green. It's fine to argue, just be consistent.
I wish it was a 392....it's just a 2.0T

Just cuz I have ICE cars doesnt mean I'm naive to the fact that EV's are the future and much better for the planet at the end of the day...I have kids and hope to have grandkids someday....would hope they will have same beautiful planet that we got to enjoy

I will be fine if those are the last ICE vehicles I ever own....to be honest, I hardly ever even drive the 718 anymore and will probably sell it soon...the M3P has been an eye opener for me and has completely jaded my senses of what a car is supposed to do when you hit the gas pedal and not going to gas stations with these gas prices is just a bonus at this point
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      04-23-2023, 09:51 PM   #2001
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"Enjoy the same beautiful planet we got to enjoy"

I just don't understand verde priorities, or maybe beauty is in the eye of the beholder? Hey, y'all check boxes for it. Rock on!
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      04-23-2023, 11:26 PM   #2002
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Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
"Enjoy the same beautiful planet we got to enjoy"

I just don't understand verde priorities, or maybe beauty is in the eye of the beholder? Hey, y'all check boxes for it. Rock on!
Yeah, the homelessness issue is a whole nother issue and I'm sorry if that is the world you see everyday, but has nothing to do with antartica warming at an alarming rate...burying our heads in the sand and carrying on like bussiness as usual isnt going to help

Over the course of the Earth's 4.5-billion-year history, the climate has changed a lot. This is true. But the rapid warming we're seeing now can't be explained by natural cycles of warming and cooling. The kind of changes that would normally happen over hundreds of thousands of years are happening in decades.


https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
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