ESS Supercharger Update

ZeroSum · 09-08-2016, 09:20 AM

/popcorn

Tom Droze · 09-08-2016, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeroSum

/popcorn

If you get a large popcorn there are free refills.

hobbit382 · 09-08-2016, 11:12 AM

Stock n51's have more problems than n52's, hopefully it's something simple.

On a side note, why can't the n51's run on alpha N AJ?

hassmaschine · 09-08-2016, 11:14 AM

It uses a (slightly) different computer. MSV81 IIRC.

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick100

So I'm guessing the many dyno sheets we have seen here with AA headers, before and after are all lies ...Unless you are referring to headers with SC combo only

I find hard to believe all the dyno sheets with proven gains from the AA headers alone are lies ...

Anyways , its hard to take you guys seriously sometimes with so little information and videos on this kit. I do not want to hear how it sounds , its pointless, I want to see what the acceleration is like .

As per the 99 % customer satisfaction , I really do not know , so far all the reviews I have seen here start with a tuning problem. I still have to see one with somebody starting with " this kit is working right". Maybe the satisfied customer are not posting here , who knows .

I know one person that is running this kit and he also has issues with the tuning . I m not sure if those issues ever got fix as I met him at a meet but I know he was not too happy with it

A tuning problem? There has never actually never been a tuning problem on these kits. There has been a throttle body/connection issue, a MAF problem, wiring issue from install, fuel pump, a coil pack gone bad or something similar. The cars we have corrected have not had a tuning problem, they have had some form of hardware issue and these cars are very few and far between vs total kits sold. Most N52's run perfect right off the bat. We have gone through 3 major software revisions where we have improved a few things like cold start operation without MAF, upgraded fuel injector calibrations, MAF vs MAP settings etc. However these were just a polish, original revisions still function just fine and every kits ships with E-flash so people can upgrade to the latest revision on their own for free.

If you have a friend that supposedly have a problem, you should tell him to contact us for diagnostics as I have not heard from him. Instead of trying to create a problem publically that does not exist, lets instead just get to the bottom of it. Unless you have some ulterior motive?

We even offer a 30 day 100% money back guarantee on these systems, so if your "friend" has issues, why don't he simply send it back to us?

And no, headers have not made significant power on these engines from any testing we have done (N52 328 and 330, usually 5-7whp) AFR control is usually all over the place. Below is a 2010 328i manual with headers and Stage 2 software (knock control was even effectively disabled after 4500RPM in this software, something we advocate strongly against doing). This was Chad D's car when it came to us:

[IMG]

imagur[/IMG]

After standard VT1 SC kit (120mm) on 91AKI :

[IMG]

post img[/IMG]

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

It uses a (slightly) different computer. MSV81 IIRC.

Correct, MSV80.1.

Taskmaster · 09-08-2016, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick100

So I'm guessing the many dyno sheets we have seen here with AA headers, before and after are all lies ...Unless you are referring to headers with SC combo only

I find hard to believe all the dyno sheets with proven gains from the AA headers alone are lies ...

Anyways , its hard to take you guys seriously sometimes with so little information and videos on this kit. I do not want to hear how it sounds , its pointless, I want to see what the acceleration is like .

As per the 99 % customer satisfaction , I really do not know , so far all the reviews I have seen here start with a tuning problem. I still have to see one with somebody starting with " this kit is working right". Maybe the satisfied customer are not posting here , who knows .

I know one person that is running this kit and he also has issues with the tuning . I m not sure if those issues ever got fix as I met him at a meet but I know he was not too happy with it

It's not worth engaging, this is Tom's thread.

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAxiom

It's not worth engaging, this is Tom's thread.

You should, as I would love to actually get to the bottom of this once and for all. We have absolutely no motive against headers if they worked correctly on the N52. However we have to advice against it as it simply doesn't function correctly in any configuration we have seen. You should also bring in a car so we can do some actual testing of what exactly is going on in your car (for free). I will even let you guys operate the dyno and walk you through the issues we found on setups we have seen come through.

Ruddigger · 09-08-2016, 01:13 PM

Why isnt there an AFR readout on the SC dynosheet? (Honest question, I dunno if it's relevant.)

E91 M Sport · 09-08-2016, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AJ@ESS

Another interesting find from a few weeks back that relates to this matter. In the MB C63 M156 market headers are famed to make a huge difference, and since we have just released a new supercharger kit for this engine we decided to test it out in person. So we bought what seemed to be the most popular long tube/x-pipe header combo on the market and installed it on a 2012 C63 PP EU spec car. Results :

free pic

Not trying to beat up on ya but if you google C63 header dyno you'll see a stock c63 puts down around 360-370 so the one labeled "stock" in your graph is most definitely not.

Taskmaster · 09-08-2016, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E91 M Sport

Not trying to beat up on ya but if you google C63 header dyno you'll see a stock c63 puts down around 360-370 so the one labeled "stock" in your graph is most definitely not.

A full bolt on C63 with headers is a 460whp+ car, including those with the AMG Black series ECU. I actually went and pulled a few dyno sheets from MB world on the M156 from different owners.

bmw201113 · 09-08-2016, 01:49 PM

Damn I've been wanting to supercharge my car now I'm skeptical as he'll smh I just hope some FI route that is reliable comes out

W37V · 09-08-2016, 01:58 PM

Thread summary:

:

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruddigger

Why isnt there an AFR readout on the SC dynosheet? (Honest question, I dunno if it's relevant.)

It's still running the headers, O2 feedback/adaptation is not correct. I just limited adaptation span to +- 10% so it could not do any damage on his way home. Chad installed OEM manifolds after he got back home and updated to normal +- 30% adaptation range software again through E-Flash.

Here is a bone stock N52 330i w/OEM manifolds running a standard ESS VT1 Gen.2 with 110mm pulley. This shows the capacity of the fuel system and AFR control in the ESS kit :

[IMG]

image hosting site over 5mb[/IMG]

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E91 M Sport

Not trying to beat up on ya but if you google C63 header dyno you'll see a stock c63 puts down around 360-370 so the one labeled "stock" in your graph is most definitely not.

But it is, bone stock P31 C63 EU spec. The 370whp cars are not P31.

Here is after we removed headers and ECU tuned it :

[IMG]

image hosting free[/IMG]

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 02:15 PM

Here is a non P31 US spec C63 before and after ECU tuning. All stock car :

[IMG]

image sharing[/IMG]

E91 M Sport · 09-08-2016, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AJ@ESS

But it is, bone stock P31 C63 EU spec. The 370whp cars are not P31.

Here is after we removed headers and ECU tuned it :

[IMG]

image hosting free[/IMG]

The P31 is only a 30hp bump though if I'm not mistaken. The math doesn't add up.

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw201113

Damn I've been wanting to supercharge my car now I'm skeptical as he'll smh I just hope some FI route that is reliable comes out

What are you talking about? Show me one single US ESS N52 customer that has problems that is not sorted out? If you do, I will personally fly there and go over his car and pay for local dyno of it.

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E91 M Sport

The P31 is only a 30hp bump though if I'm not mistaken. The math doesn't add up.

Listen, I actually have a C63 BS myself. I know these engines like the back of my own hand. That is a BONE STOCK C63 P31 EU dyno with OEM log style manifolds. If headers made strong power without issues on a M54/N52 and C63 we would make them ourselves in a hearbeat. We are just trying to present reality, the internet is way to full of hype and BS. The US spec cats are a bit of a restriction, so is the US airboxes, but that has nothing to do with headers. Install HFC or EU cats and a ROW/EU airbox w/filters along with some well made ECU tuning and your M156 P31 is a rocketship.

Here is our new M156 C63 AMG SC kit :

[IMG]

photo upload sites[/IMG]

imagehosting

Tom Droze · 09-08-2016, 02:35 PM

AJ, with all the posting you're doing is it safe to assume my car is ready to be picked up?

AJ@ESS · 09-08-2016, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Droze

AJ, with all the posting you're doing is it safe to assume my car is ready to be picked up?

The car runs just fine as it is, I have ordered a new MAF sensor/screen to try to eliminate the small idle variation when AC engages. MAF less is not an option on N51 engines like you have. I am not sure it will be in today, but I will check. If you need a car, just rent one locally. We will pay for it. Another option is to pick up your car and drop it back off again when the MAF sensor/screen arrives.

rick100 · 09-08-2016, 02:47 PM

In summary

All the different dyno sheets from before and after AA headers or any other headers are a lie

. All the guys running AA headers that have given positive reviews ( including me) must be lying , placebo effect maybe , oh well.

Im done with this thread. Still no videos of ESS SC. wonder why... Still customers of ESS SC complaining , nothing new here
Back to the turbocharge thread , funny enough BPC are also AA dealers and they don't seem to have such a problem .

09-08-2016, 09:20 AM	#67
ZeroSum First Lieutenant 31 Rep 331 Posts Drives: E90 328i/MR2 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Tennessee iTrader: (0)	/popcorn __________________ 2008 Monaco Blue 328i Sedan / Charcoal Delete / K&N Drop In Filter / RM Intake Boot / AA Tune 1993 MR2
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09-08-2016, 11:12 AM	#69
hobbit382 New Member 0 Rep 12 Posts Drives: ... Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Phoenix,AZ iTrader: (0)	Stock n51's have more problems than n52's, hopefully it's something simple. On a side note, why can't the n51's run on alpha N AJ?
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09-08-2016, 11:14 AM	#70
hassmaschine Major General 3973 Rep 7,215 Posts Drives: "NBO" 330i Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: earth iTrader: (0)	It uses a (slightly) different computer. MSV81 IIRC.
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09-08-2016, 01:13 PM	#75
Ruddigger Major 694 Rep 1,302 Posts Drives: 2012 E91 Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: SoCal iTrader: (0)	Why isnt there an AFR readout on the SC dynosheet? (Honest question, I dunno if it's relevant.) __________________ My build thread. It's a wagon with stuff on it.
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09-08-2016, 01:49 PM	#78
bmw201113 Private First Class 23 Rep 149 Posts Drives: Bmw 328i coupe Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Arizona iTrader: (0)	Damn I've been wanting to supercharge my car now I'm skeptical as he'll smh I just hope some FI route that is reliable comes out
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09-08-2016, 01:58 PM	#79
W37V [Oo=\|\|=oO] 1103 Rep 2,470 Posts Drives: e92n52 & f15n57 Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: DMV iTrader: (0)	Thread summary: :
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09-08-2016, 02:15 PM	#82
AJ@ESS Second Lieutenant 29 Rep 230 Posts Drives: E60 M5 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	Here is a non P31 US spec C63 before and after ECU tuning. All stock car : [IMG]image sharing[/IMG]
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09-08-2016, 02:35 PM	#86
Tom Droze Major 413 Rep 1,286 Posts Drives: 2012 BMW 328i (e92) Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Scottsdale, Arizona iTrader: (0)	AJ, with all the posting you're doing is it safe to assume my car is ready to be picked up? __________________ 2012 Jet Black 328i Coupe / ESS Tuning Gen. 2 Supercharger / Evolution Racewerks Oil Cooler / BMS Oil Catch Can / BMW Performance Exhaust with Dinan Y Pipe / Eibach Pro Kit Springs / Koni FSD Shocks / MFactory LSD & Differential Bushings / Performance Rear Trailing Arms / BMW Performance Strut Brace / Stop Tech Slotted Rotors / Hawk HPS 5.0 / SS Brake Lines / Brass Guide Pins / M3 Front Control Arms, 28 MM FSB, Engine Cowl, and DCT Paddle Shifters / Michelin PSS / APEX ARC-8
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09-08-2016, 02:47 PM	#88
rick100 Colonel 551 Rep 2,293 Posts Drives: 328 Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: canada iTrader: (0)	In summary All the different dyno sheets from before and after AA headers or any other headers are a lie . All the guys running AA headers that have given positive reviews ( including me) must be lying , placebo effect maybe , oh well. Im done with this thread. Still no videos of ESS SC. wonder why... Still customers of ESS SC complaining , nothing new here Back to the turbocharge thread , funny enough BPC are also AA dealers and they don't seem to have such a problem .
	Appreciate 0 Quote