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      08-15-2019, 11:30 AM   #1
Beisofmarko
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Multiple speaker wiring help

Hello,

I'm in the progress of installing jehnert doorboards which
include 3x 6,5" speakers per door.
I'm looking for some help with the wiring.

I'm running front as 3-way active and have another 2-channel amplifier
for doorboads, 1-channel to each crossover at doorpanel.

My problem is:
- How do i wire each set of 3x 6,5" speakers from the crossover?
- Instructions show a wiring diagram for 4x 6,5" speakers (underseats are connected
to same wiring in this case)
- Speakers are 4 ohm, amplifier is 2-channels 330wrms @4ohm so 110wrms per speaker.

Here is a piece of art, demonstrating the my current wiring and where i need guidance:




Thanks!

Last edited by Beisofmarko; 08-15-2019 at 11:55 AM..
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      08-15-2019, 12:05 PM   #2
Beisofmarko
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I guess it's not simple as this?
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      08-15-2019, 12:07 PM   #3
ctuna
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As I recall the one or two that did doorboards here used two channels
for the 6.5's per side. One channel was shared by one underseat and one of the doorboard speakers. That would mean you would need three sets of wires
running into the doors.(for active)or two for semi active. Why don't you call Jehnert and see what they say.
That would mean you would need 2 ohm stable channels if wiring n parallel.
Didn't the doorboards come with some instructions.
This is going to depend on if you have a 2ohm stable amp .
Otherwise series parallel combinations that add up to 4 ohms per channel.
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      08-15-2019, 12:31 PM   #4
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
As I recall the one or two that did doorboards here used two channels
for the 6.5's per side. One channel was shared by one underseat and one of the doorboard speakers. That would mean you would need three sets of wires
running into the doors.(for active)or two for semi active. Why don't you call Jehnert and see what they say.
That would mean you would need 2 ohm stable channels if wiring n parallel.
Didn't the doorboards come with some instructions.
This is going to depend on if you have a 2ohm stable amp .
Otherwise series parallel combinations that add up to 4 ohms per channel.
I did contact them but i'm waiting for the reply.
They came with instructions but this is the only wiring diagram it has:


I assume my amp is stable at 2ohm's, it says:
2 x 330 W RMS @ 4 ohm
2 x 550 W RMS @ 2 ohm
2 x 852 W RMS @ 1 ohm

However i mentioned that i allready run front as 3-way active via pp82dsp
and was recommended ~300wrms amp @4ohm for doorboards?
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      08-15-2019, 12:44 PM   #5
biz77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beisofmarko View Post
I did contact them but i'm waiting for the reply.
They came with instructions but this is the only wiring diagram it has:


I assume my amp is stable at 2ohm's, it says:
2 x 330 W RMS @ 4 ohm
2 x 550 W RMS @ 2 ohm
2 x 852 W RMS @ 1 ohm

However i mentioned that i allready run front as 3-way active via pp82dsp
and was recommended ~300wrms amp @4ohm for doorboards?
If your amp is 1 ohm stable then just wire the three door woofers in parallel, which should give you a nominal 1.33 ohm load. See configuration as posted in post #2.
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      08-15-2019, 01:04 PM   #6
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biz77 View Post
If your amp is 1 ohm stable then just wire the three door woofers in parallel, which should give you a nominal 1.33 ohm load. See configuration as posted in post #2.
Yeah it says "it's stable @1ohm and can be used to run several speakers and difficult loads"

My only concern as i'm not experienced with these is that will it be
too much power for speakers then?
If they recommend ~2x 300wrms @4ohm for those doorboards?

That would be around 100wrms per speaker and with 1 ohm load
i would feed ~284wrms per speaker?

this is from their site:

POWER HANDLING NOMINAL/PEAK
2 x 300 / 500 Watt

RECOMMENDED AMPLIFIER POWER
ab 2x 200 300 Watt / 4 Ohm

Thanks!
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      08-15-2019, 01:59 PM   #7
ctuna
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what is the amplifier?

what is the amplifier?

That sounds like it might be sub amp which is not ideal
for mids and tweeters.

The first diagram shows series parallel two speakers in series
and the combined series pairs on one channel.

How well does bridging channels work with that amp would be my question.

Last edited by ctuna; 08-15-2019 at 02:08 PM..
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      08-15-2019, 02:57 PM   #8
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
what is the amplifier?

That sounds like it might be sub amp which is not ideal
for mids and tweeters.

The first diagram shows series parallel two speakers in series
and the combined series pairs on one channel.

How well does bridging channels work with that amp would be my question.
Amplifier is Audio System X-330.2 (recommended by jehnert)
- 2 x 330 W RMS @ 4 ohm
- 2 x 550 W RMS @ 2 ohm
- 2 x 852 W RMS @ 1 ohm
- 1 x 1100 W RMS @ 4 ohm
- 1 x 1650 W RMS @ 2 ohm

This amp will run 6x 6,5" doorboards alone, tweeters, 4" mids and underseats are ran by pp82dsp
and probably by helix p six dsp or v8 in the future.

So would the smartest and easiest way for me be to wire these like
in post #2 (@1.33ohm) and then adjust gain and measure so i won't feed too
much wattage to them?
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      08-15-2019, 03:44 PM   #9
ctuna
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I would go with the 2ohm load just because I
would not be comfortable going lower.
2 x 550 W RMS @ 2 ohm which also give stereo.
But Jehnert should know best.
which means two sets of two speakers in series
and each set of two in series in parallel with each other.
Assumes you use the other 6.5 for an under seat.
That is still 125's watt per speaker.

They sell the doorboard's with two or 4 6.5 with the fourth
intended for the under seat position.

If it was me I would just run two 6.5's in each door and a
xe-200 for the underseat to get a little more midbass.

Last edited by ctuna; 08-15-2019 at 03:53 PM..
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      08-16-2019, 08:39 AM   #10
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
I would go with the 2ohm load just because I
would not be comfortable going lower.
2 x 550 W RMS @ 2 ohm which also give stereo.
But Jehnert should know best.
which means two sets of two speakers in series
and each set of two in series in parallel with each other.
Assumes you use the other 6.5 for an under seat.
That is still 125's watt per speaker.

They sell the doorboard's with two or 4 6.5 with the fourth
intended for the under seat position.

If it was me I would just run two 6.5's in each door and a
xe-200 for the underseat to get a little more midbass.
If i went with 2 ohm load with 4 speakers per side, would the wiring go
as in picture at post #4 ?
That would give around 137wrms per speaker therefore underseat XE-200
would get a nice upgrade aswell.

How would it work having one 8" midbass mixed with three 6,5's ?
Jehnert crossover giving the same play band for 8" and 6,5's ?


So at ~1.33ohm 3x 6,5's per side wired parallel or
at ~2ohm 4x 6,5's (1x 8") per side wired like in picture at post #4 ?
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      08-16-2019, 11:06 AM   #11
ctuna
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"How would it work having one 8" midbass mixed with three 6,5's ?
Jehnert crossover giving the same play band for 8" and 6,5's ?"

I would assume if you did the above you would keep the underseats
on a seperate channel so you could still apply DSP eq to the underseats
separate from the doors.

I would also run this by Jehnert.


You should be able to figure out the impedence for yourself.
Series adds parallel divides(by the sum of the reciprocals). Two 4 ohm speakers in series = 8 ohms
two in parallel = 2 ohms.

The total value of a parallel circuit is the sum of the reciprocals.

https://www.swtc.edu/Ag_Power/electr...l_circuits.htm

The picture in post 4 is series parallel and it assumes that one of
the 6.5 is in the underseat location. At least I think that is what they
intended. When they ship that kit with 4 speakers I think they intend
one to go in the underseat position.

Last edited by ctuna; 08-16-2019 at 11:20 AM..
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      08-16-2019, 01:37 PM   #12
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
When they ship that kit with 4 speakers I think they intend
one to go in the underseat position.
That is correct, however i've had their flatline kit for few years allready
so they tailored a package for me with just the 6x 6,5's + crossovers + doorpanels.

Also i just noticed that the 8" XE-200 is 6 ohm speaker as the 6,5's are 4ohm,
would this mess things up if wiring together?


Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
I would go with the 2ohm load just because I
would not be comfortable going lower.
Out of curiousity, why is that? or just personal preference?

I'm just thinking that if my amplifier is advertised as "stable at 1ohm stereo,
can be used to run multiple speakers and difficult loads",
it should work just fine?

With wiring doorboards 3x 6,5's (4 ohm) parallel, it would be 1.34 ohm load to amp
and it should be able to handle that just fine, right?
That way would be easiest way for me to wire doorboards.

If i wire them parallel as said above, i would feed each door maximum of 852wrms
which would be 284wrms per speaker that would be abit over the recommended.
But i could just measure with multimeter and play with gain to get the
wattage i feed them to around 300-400 wrms per Door.

Correct me if i'm missing something here.
Thanks!
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      08-16-2019, 02:27 PM   #13
ctuna
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If you measure the coil on the XE-200 the resistance is
6.5 ohms (I have a set also great speakers) But the impedance
which is the speaker rating for audio is 4 ohms I believe.

Look at the specs on there website.

"With wiring doorboards 3x 6,5's (4 ohm) parallel, it would be 1.34 ohm load to amp
and it should be able to handle that just fine, right?
That way would be easiest way for me to wire doorboards."

If your amp says it can handle it you should be fine.
For xe-200's

Below 2 ohm loads make me nervous but it isn't based on science.

The other speakers are on separate channels coming of your 82dsp
so it isn't going to be much different with a the setup you have now.

All the channels have gain controls on the 82dsp and I assume your
other amp just start out a minimum gains and go thorugh the dsp
setup procedure as described by Helix or

DSP


http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1384218
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1383653
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1381697





Also the Jehnert guys suggested this is correct.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...hlrW-jM2Ru2kAu

says 4 ohm in the above document.

Last edited by ctuna; 08-16-2019 at 02:50 PM..
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      08-16-2019, 03:22 PM   #14
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
The other speakers are on separate channels coming of your 82dsp
so it isn't going to be much different with a the setup you have now.
I assume by this you mean that they are still powered by pp82dsp ~55 watts, right?
Well my plan was to upgrade pp82dsp with helix p six dsp or v8 in the future but will see..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post

Also the Jehnert guys suggested this is correct.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...hlrW-jM2Ru2kAu

says 4 ohm in the above document.
Thanks for looking up, only technical data i found was from their store and it said 6 ohm at the XE-200.


Now i'm having hard time deciding what would be smartest way to go;
1) 3x 6.5's parallel @ 1 ohm ( rest of the speakers through pp82dsp)
2) 3x 6.5's + 8" underseat series/parallel @ 4 ohm (picture at post #4)
3) some other way @ 2 ohm amplifier load perhaps?

With option 2, the one provided with instructions. I would get ~82,5 watts
per speaker, is that too little? still more than 55 watts from pp82dsp to underseats.
- Also with this wiring since 3x 6,5's and 8" underseat would be played through jehnert
3-way frequency crossover. That would mean 8" plays between same crossover points
as 6,5's. Is that okay as 8" is rated 42-4000hz and 6.5's 49-5000hz.

Thanks!

Last edited by Beisofmarko; 08-16-2019 at 03:34 PM..
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      08-16-2019, 05:23 PM   #15
ctuna
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No matter how you hook it up you will go deaf with
that much power and speaker area.
Plenty of power for everything no matter how you hook
it up with the suggested setups.

If you have an 82dsp and you are going active why would
use a passive crossover at all?
you have 8 channels right . And some of the Helix's have
extra DSP channels to feed another amp or subs.
I could see maybe using the tweeter to 4 inch door crossover
for those two components .
But you would just DSP eq the rest.

2 channels to tweeter
2 channels to front door 4 inch
or 2 channels to tweeter/4 inch pair with the two way
crossover they provided for the doors.
2 or 4 channels to door boards and underseats
depending on what you want to do.
No passive crossovers.
Which is a better way to go for control of eq and delay.

Last edited by ctuna; 08-16-2019 at 05:39 PM..
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      08-17-2019, 04:31 AM   #16
Beisofmarko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
No matter how you hook it up you will go deaf with
that much power and speaker area.
Plenty of power for everything no matter how you hook
it up with the suggested setups.

If you have an 82dsp and you are going active why would
use a passive crossover at all?
you have 8 channels right . And some of the Helix's have
extra DSP channels to feed another amp or subs.
I could see maybe using the tweeter to 4 inch door crossover
for those two components .
But you would just DSP eq the rest.

2 channels to tweeter
2 channels to front door 4 inch
or 2 channels to tweeter/4 inch pair with the two way
crossover they provided for the doors.
2 or 4 channels to door boards and underseats
depending on what you want to do.
No passive crossovers.
Which is a better way to go for control of eq and delay.
I guess you are right about the power.
I'm not sure why i didn't even think about leaving passive crossover out,
i thought i would need more channels if i went without but i dont
if i still wire the doors series/parallel like suggested in the instructions.


So i'm thinking it would go something like this then per side without passive crossovers, correct?
- 55watts at 4 ohm load to tweeter / 4 inch
- 87,5watts at 4 ohm load to doorpanels + underseats
- everything run through dsp
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      08-17-2019, 10:29 PM   #17
ctuna
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Yep and that still gives you one set of channels.

Yep and that still gives you one set of channels.
(out of your 82dsp)
The alternative would be to run the underseat's off
that channel set.
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