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      03-01-2021, 05:45 AM   #1
Markos ZimZimma
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Anything more compliant on UK roads than M Sport suspension?

Hi all, got my MOT due in a couple of weeks time and will be asking the garage to have a close inspection of the rear suspension components as manhole covers and potholes can sometimes unsettle the rear when driven over at 40+ mph. This sort of behaviour would normally have me question the shocks but they're not leaking and a 'push-down' test on the rear doesn't throw up any issues. Whilst driving this weekend for the first time ever I heard some noises from what appeared to be the nearside rear, so perhaps things are getting worse and the pre-MOT inspection might discover exactly what's going on.

I can change like for like if shocks etc need changing although I'm not a fan of the ride in this car over poor road surfaces. It has the M sport suspension and it does handle well when pushed but compliance over bad surfaces is really poor I think. Years back I had an E46 M3 and that handled well and dealt with poor surfaces very well (tapered springs), so BMW can do it if they try!

So has anyone swapped out M Sport springs or shocks (or both) for something that deals with bad surfaces better, rather than simply being lower or sportier?

I've seen a few M Sport E91s advertised wit the full original spec list and I've seen 'M Sport suspension deletion' more than once. No idea if the regular suspension gives a 'boaty' ride as well as better compliance...

Car is a 2010 325i E91 M Sport with 58k and is completely standard.

Any thoughts appreciated
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      03-01-2021, 11:55 AM   #2
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FWIW - I would contact Centre of Gravity near Coventry and speak to them about your set-up.
They specialise in M-cars and Porsche and prep road, track and race cars. The skill they have in transforming how a car drives is other-worldly.
The process they go though is to understand how you use the car, what kind of roads you drive on and then take the car out for a test drive. This part shows the skill they have and then they spend a day setting the car up. The test drive after is another amazing drive, for me it has always been like getting a different car back. I've used them on Porsche 993's and my E91 will be going to them later in the spring. -http://www.centregravity.co.uk
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      03-01-2021, 01:33 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulla View Post
FWIW - I would contact Centre of Gravity near Coventry and speak to them about your set-up.
They specialise in M-cars and Porsche and prep road, track and race cars. The skill they have in transforming how a car drives is other-worldly.
The process they go though is to understand how you use the car, what kind of roads you drive on and then take the car out for a test drive. This part shows the skill they have and then they spend a day setting the car up. The test drive after is another amazing drive, for me it has always been like getting a different car back. I've used them on Porsche 993's and my E91 will be going to them later in the spring. -http://www.centregravity.co.uk
Thanks Fulla, I know of CG thanks to the Porsche boys who really rate them. It's quite a trek but I've gone from London to Maidstone/Swindon/Leicester for highly rated specialists before so it's not impossible. My wallet does fear the worst though with them!

Depending on what's discovered this Saturday I'm not sure if I'll have to sort something just for the MOT, but we will see. Keep us posted on when you go with the E91, do you know exactly what you're looking for? For me this is a family car and it just needs to ride a bit more like one
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      03-01-2021, 02:53 PM   #4
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Bilstein B4’s are far more complient then the stock suspension. Al least that’s my experience last month after changing the tired old stock suspension with new Bilsteins.

I kept my springs, renewed al the extra parts (bushings, top mounts, couple nuts & bolts). Car sits about 0,5 inch higher since (OEM top mounts were collapsed).
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      03-01-2021, 02:56 PM   #5
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I know that without parts for them to work their magic it is circa £300. But I'd pay that and more for what they do to the car.
Last time I was with them they set up my 993 C4S and I decided to spend the day exploring Coventry....a day I will never get back...glad I went to the Two-Tone museum and I did find an odd place with shipping container shops where I got some great vinyl but part from that what a hole.
When I take the E91 up I am going home the same day via train and will then train back the next day to get the car.

If you can afford it or scrape the money together over time I'd just go to them. They are the only people I would use for chassis work just don't expect much if you choose to spend the day in Coventry..
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      03-01-2021, 03:00 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markos ZimZimma View Post
Keep us posted on when you go with the E91, do you know exactly what you're looking for? For me this is a family car and it just needs to ride a bit more like one
Sorry missed this bit in the reply...my E91 is my family car, well wife and the dog. So it needs to be comfortable and sporty. I'll go with what CofG advise and haven't discussed it yet with them. My other car is a 997 GT3 CS and I think that is comfortable so I am probably not the best person to get advise from on set-ups for comfy cars...
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      03-02-2021, 01:47 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vester86 View Post
Bilstein B4’s are far more complient then the stock suspension. Al least that’s my experience last month after changing the tired old stock suspension with new Bilsteins.

I kept my springs, renewed al the extra parts (bushings, top mounts, couple nuts & bolts). Car sits about 0,5 inch higher since (OEM top mounts were collapsed).
Thanks vester86, is yours an M Sport? From reading on other posts on the forum it looks like the B4 comes in regular and Sport versions (Sport versions for M Sport cars), just wondered which you went with?
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      03-02-2021, 01:56 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulla View Post
I know that without parts for them to work their magic it is circa £300. But I'd pay that and more for what they do to the car.
Last time I was with them they set up my 993 C4S and I decided to spend the day exploring Coventry....a day I will never get back...glad I went to the Two-Tone museum and I did find an odd place with shipping container shops where I got some great vinyl but part from that what a hole.
When I take the E91 up I am going home the same day via train and will then train back the next day to get the car.

If you can afford it or scrape the money together over time I'd just go to them. They are the only people I would use for chassis work just don't expect much if you choose to spend the day in Coventry..
Your love of Coventry made me lol!

£300 isn't bad at all, as long as they don't recommend Ohlins all round maybe they are an option! I'm going to call them today to see how familiar they are with E9X M Sport suspension woes...

997 sounds lovely... and I bet it's not as crashy as the E91... My old Z4M Coupe with 60k on it had a rock hard drive yet still wasn't as crashy as this damn wagon... I had adaptive magride on an Audi a few years back and that was insanely good at ironing out UK roads, shame they like to leak so much though...
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      03-04-2021, 10:46 AM   #9
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OP - what tyres are your car shod with?

If you have runflats, taking them off for non-RFT will help.
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      03-04-2021, 11:16 AM   #10
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OP - what tyres are your car shod with?

If you have runflats, taking them off for non-RFT will help.
Michelin PS4s, non RFTs. it helped ditching the RFTs but it wasn't night and day for me. Some non RFTs are stiffer than others I guess.
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      03-04-2021, 11:17 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulla View Post
Sorry missed this bit in the reply...my E91 is my family car, well wife and the dog. So it needs to be comfortable and sporty. I'll go with what CofG advise and haven't discussed it yet with them. My other car is a 997 GT3 CS and I think that is comfortable so I am probably not the best person to get advise from on set-ups for comfy cars...
I had a good chat with CG today, chap called Pete. Very knowledgable and happy to spend some time chatting on the phone. After this Saturday's MOT I'll decide what to do.
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      03-05-2021, 06:12 AM   #12
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Just to say...
I have a 2011 E90 lci 320d ED with 175,000 miles

I noticed going over bumps/manhole covers etc the DSC light would flash at me

Given the mileage, I got all 4 shocks replaced with oem.

What a difference! no more DSC lights, but also, straight line acceleration is much better than ever ( I've had it 4yrs ), because the back doesn't drop and front lift anymore, all the power goes to the road instead of the springs.

I also notice about 5mpg avg better, again I assume because I'm not wasting power compressing the springs.
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      03-05-2021, 06:38 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wotsupnow View Post
Just to say...
I have a 2011 E90 lci 320d ED with 175,000 miles

I noticed going over bumps/manhole covers etc the DSC light would flash at me

Given the mileage, I got all 4 shocks replaced with oem.

What a difference! no more DSC lights, but also, straight line acceleration is much better than ever ( I've had it 4yrs ), because the back doesn't drop and front lift anymore, all the power goes to the road instead of the springs.

I also notice about 5mpg avg better, again I assume because I'm not wasting power compressing the springs.
Some significant improvements there! The MPG gain is crazy but at least it's paying for the suspension refresh!
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      03-05-2021, 07:08 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wotsupnow View Post
Just to say...
I have a 2011 E90 lci 320d ED with 175,000 miles

I noticed going over bumps/manhole covers etc the DSC light would flash at me

Given the mileage, I got all 4 shocks replaced with oem.

What a difference! no more DSC lights, but also, straight line acceleration is much better than ever ( I've had it 4yrs ), because the back doesn't drop and front lift anymore, all the power goes to the road instead of the springs.

I also notice about 5mpg avg better, again I assume because I'm not wasting power compressing the springs.
Yeh i get the DSC light on speed bumps sometimes. My fronts were replaced couple years ago but rears are original at 132k. I'll have to make an order then....
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      03-06-2021, 09:43 AM   #15
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MOT passed with no problem! I know the guys at the MOT garage so had a good chat with them about the handling. They think that's just how the M Sport suspensions are on this car and replacing like for like won't help. They also thought the rear tyres are wearing slightly more on the inside but said they'd have been surprised if it wasn't doing that as they do that ("They all do that, sir" )

Centre Gravity suggest the negative rear camber that they're set up with means the inside of the rear tyre walls do most of the tyre absorption rather than the whole width of the tyre, and so that may well be part of the cause of the rear feeling unsettled over imperfections. The initial suggestion is to let them adjust that negative rear camber and give it a full alignment. Next step would be Sachs Super Touring SE spec dampers and Eibach progressive pro springs, and this would probably leave my car's ride height very close to where it is now. Will have a think on what to do...
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      03-08-2021, 01:42 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markos ZimZimma View Post
Thanks vester86, is yours an M Sport? From reading on other posts on the forum it looks like the B4 comes in regular and Sport versions (Sport versions for M Sport cars), just wondered which you went with?
yes, mine’s an Msport and i went with the B4 sport version

these are the bilstein parts numbers.
left front: 22-135032
right front: 22-135049
rears 2x: 19-135052
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      03-08-2021, 03:41 AM   #17
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I used to use CG all the time and yes knowledgeable but extremely expensive. I had a bit of a falling out with Jayne as their recommendations to remove an issue didn't sort it and she took offence of me asking for a discount on the alignment as the £500 parts they'd recommended didn't work.

I now use Matt@Spires in Leamington Spa and he'll do exactly the same for a lot less money personally.
If not happy with the current setup maybe look at going with some different springs initially and see how that goes. Eibach Prokit springs are progressive and will slightly stiffen it but maybe more compliant for what you are after.
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      03-08-2021, 11:50 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RajB View Post
I used to use CG all the time and yes knowledgeable but extremely expensive. I had a bit of a falling out with Jayne as their recommendations to remove an issue didn't sort it and she took offence of me asking for a discount on the alignment as the £500 parts they'd recommended didn't work.

I now use Matt@Spires in Leamington Spa and he'll do exactly the same for a lot less money personally.
If not happy with the current setup maybe look at going with some different springs initially and see how that goes. Eibach Prokit springs are progressive and will slightly stiffen it but maybe more compliant for what you are after.
Interesting RajB. For the lack of hassle and time it will take to be going up to CG I'm tempted to go to a recommended local alignment place and perhaps give that a go first before any shocks/springs replacement (it's had an alignment at a normal tyre shop about a year/5k miles ago). The ride isn't unbearable and I could just leave it as is, but it's weighing up cost and hassle of trying to get it riding better for me, even though there's no guarantee that it will be significantly improved after throwing money at it.
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      03-08-2021, 12:12 PM   #19
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I have an E91 it's an SE and I swapped out the SE suspension for eibach pro springs, plus m sport bump stops with Bilstein B4 ( msport spec) and although I like the ride as the handling is great, you can not compare the compliance with the SE suspension. The SE suspension is much better over crappy pot holes roads, the handling is fine, you still have plenty of grip. However you don't get the same sporty firm ride.

If you have a family with smallish kids and are after more a comfortable ride then only SE spec will give this. Unless you pay for a big upgrade with a specialist which will cost you thousands.

Think your first port of call is to make sure everything is ok and set up correctly, starting with a full alignment and then inspect all the suspension bushes, springs shocks etc. Once you know everything is ok then you can see what the car drives Ile then decide how you want to change it.
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      03-08-2021, 02:41 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markos ZimZimma View Post
Interesting RajB. For the lack of hassle and time it will take to be going up to CG I'm tempted to go to a recommended local alignment place and perhaps give that a go first before any shocks/springs replacement (it's had an alignment at a normal tyre shop about a year/5k miles ago). The ride isn't unbearable and I could just leave it as is, but it's weighing up cost and hassle of trying to get it riding better for me, even though there's no guarantee that it will be significantly improved after throwing money at it.
Tbh I’d agree buddy. It’s a lot of money and time for something a decent local place can sort initially. It needs to be set up correctly first and see how that goes. Then start to look at upgrading parts.
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      03-09-2021, 03:37 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Streek View Post
I have an E91 it's an SE and I swapped out the SE suspension for eibach pro springs, plus m sport bump stops with Bilstein B4 ( msport spec) and although I like the ride as the handling is great, you can not compare the compliance with the SE suspension. The SE suspension is much better over crappy pot holes roads, the handling is fine, you still have plenty of grip. However you don't get the same sporty firm ride.

If you have a family with smallish kids and are after more a comfortable ride then only SE spec will give this. Unless you pay for a big upgrade with a specialist which will cost you thousands.

Think your first port of call is to make sure everything is ok and set up correctly, starting with a full alignment and then inspect all the suspension bushes, springs shocks etc. Once you know everything is ok then you can see what the car drives Ile then decide how you want to change it.
Thanks Silver Streek, that's some really useful info. I do have a little one in the back and so I do see it as more a family type car. I've had my fair share of harder, firmer rides in sports cars but I could just do without constantly looking at the road surface to actively dodge sunken manhole covers and potholes in an estate car!
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      03-09-2021, 05:21 AM   #22
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If you want to get rid of the flashing DSC and have a comfy ride try 17" wheels.

My 335i has Eibach springs and M Sport dampers with non runflat tyres and it soaks up shitty UK roads without any traction lights.

I've had a mix of different BMWs and I think the 335i has the best setup so far for doing big miles. The steering isn't as direct and it rolls more in corners than my previous M Sport E92 with 18" wheels but I wince a lot less when driving over rough surfaces.
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