E90Post
 


 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos > Abandoning the Germans



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      01-03-2023, 04:09 PM   #1
Schn3ll
Captain
Schn3ll's Avatar
359
Rep
711
Posts

Drives: '24 Carrera T
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Greenville, SC

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2009 135  [0.00]
Abandoning the Germans

Let me tell you, I've had a good run with German cars in my roughly 22 years of driving.

First was a 1993 Merc 190E, the baby Benz, great little car - floaty but fun, got it for about $3k from my grandparents neighbor (basically stolen).

Then I fell in love with BMW, specifically the e46 M3 and had to have one, probably sooner than I should have financially so I stretched myself and picked up a 2002 M3 coupe, carbon black with cinnamon leather (yes it was SMG...shhh).

After a rocky ride and a few expensive M3 fixes out of warranty, I sold it and ordered a 135i in 2008 (year 1 of the One). Alpine white over coral red - this time a manual and I taught myself how to drive it on the way home from the dealership. Car was a blast and I did just about ever bolt on and tune. But it wasn't an M car...

Then I found a clean manual 2008 Z4M coupe - loved the lines great little car, pure drivers car. Sold that and bounced around a few more semi practical cars (GTI, Mini cooper S) and eventually made my way to Porsche.

Picked up a 2018 Carrera T manual at the start of the pandemic for a song, $85k w/5k miles. Hell of a deal. Carbon buckets were very uncomfortable and I blew out my knee training and decided to sell during the crazy free money times of 2021.

Eventually picked up a Taycan as a do everything DD, but it was missing soul, and the charging nonsense was not fun to deal with. The current market for high end luxury EV's is crashing by the day. So I made my mind and decided it has to go for another fun DD preferably with manual.

I love the Porsche community but right now everything worthwhile is overpriced, I was not going to overpay for a 911 so I put money down on another Carrera T at sticker. But based on the allocations and my number at the dealer, the prospect of getting one of them was almost nil.

I considered the M2, but those won't be available until April and I felt I needed to dump the Taycan before then and so after much consternation, I landed on a CT4 V Blackwing.

I pondered the CT5 Blackwing, but dealers are asking upwards of $25k over sticker (yes, even today) they are very hard to get right now, with over a year waitlist.

So after much deliberation, I decided that the CT4 V Blackwing would be the right size, and give me everything I wanted:
- great manual (Tremac TR6060)
- enough power (472hp twin turbo v6)
- great features (HUD, heated/cooled/massage seats, multiple drive modes and traction modes)
- SMOOTH leather seats (looking at you M2)
- just enough interior tech (I don't need much more than car play and decent stereo)
- incredible handling and magnetic ride dampers (touring mode ride quality is on par with my Taycan with air suspension, it's that good)
- Mature looking (very under the radar)
- Extremely rare (only about 1,600 total made in 2022, 675 in manual, and Caddy has already said this will be the last generation of manual cars - going full EV) - cars are all numbered - I am #625 of the manual CT4's made in 2022.


I found a 2022 leftover (late 2022 production) that a close-ish dealer was actually willing to deal on, they had 3 other CT4 BW's but all had $5k ADM (no thanks) and a used 2022 with 13k miles for over sticker. So I was able to get a couple grand off sticker, and they gave me more for my Taycan than Porsche was offering. Black wasn't my first choice but it was $10k cheaper than the other manual car available, no brainer.

I feel like I made the right call, this car is everything I could ever need and I am not left wanting for anything (except maybe a bit more noise, but I am still in break-in). There is not one squeak or rattle and everything seems very solid, I had rattles on day 1 with my Taycan and 911 that I could never completely fix.

We still have a Porsche in the garage so I'm not completely abandoning the Germans, wife drives a Panamera eHybrid that no one will ever be able to pry from her hands. But for the value (I paid $70k OTD) I don't see much else with 4 doors that can compete. Will update later with further impressions.
Attached Images
       

Last edited by Schn3ll; 01-03-2023 at 04:21 PM..
Appreciate 27
M3 boi3201.00
swanson731.00
Bumpinjeep4667.50
chenry2319.50
nicholasn253.00
GERMAN M34078.00
chassis6005.00
NickyC16645.50
Red Bread4460.00
RM72768.50
E46ZHP249.50
wtwo317068.00
ntg442880.00
TonyTone197.00
Wolf 3352333.00
jmack539.50
Lady Jane62743.00
overcoil3036.00
stein_325i24846.00
Soul_Glo13086.50
DrFerry6119.00
S1nner118.00
Simple1132.50
      01-03-2023, 04:32 PM   #2
XutvJet
Major General
5248
Rep
5,255
Posts

Drives: 2011 Cayman Base, 2016 M235
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Kansas City

iTrader: (-1)

Brute of a car and can eat miles, but I give you less than 6 months before you tire of this given your prior car history. You're going to really miss driving a sporty 2 door 2 or 2+2 seater car. I think you'll miss driving a car with unique and sports car styling. This Caddy in black hides much of it's few sporty design cues. It is quite the sleeper, but driving sleepers gets old after a while.
__________________
The forest was shrinking, but the Trees kept voting for the Axe, for the Axe was clever and convinced the Trees that because his handle was made of wood, he was one of them.
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 04:42 PM   #3
Schn3ll
Captain
Schn3ll's Avatar
359
Rep
711
Posts

Drives: '24 Carrera T
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Greenville, SC

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2009 135  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by XutvJet View Post
Brute of a car and can eat miles, but I give you less than 6 months before you tire of this given your prior car history. You're going to really miss driving a sporty 2 door 2 or 2+2 seater car. I think you'll miss driving a car with unique and sports car styling. This Caddy in black hides much of it's few sporty design cues. It is quite the sleeper, but driving sleepers gets old after a while.
We'll see - it's fun for now and I forget about any sleeper exterior design once I'm behind the wheel of a fun car. I'll pick up another 911 but not for a couple years at least. I want to enjoy this, and I could always wrap in a different color if I get tired of black...
Appreciate 1
      01-03-2023, 04:47 PM   #4
Mason Hatcher
Captain
United_States
1003
Rep
616
Posts

Drives: BMW 230i
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: FW-TX

iTrader: (0)

The Caddy is sweet. Hope you'll come back and update us
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 05:02 PM   #5
gonzo
Lieutenant General
gonzo's Avatar
United_States
9915
Rep
14,305
Posts

Drives: as many as possible
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: TeXXXas

iTrader: (0)

Nice. Germany abandoned us, so...
I'd have to ppf that thing. Swirls are coming after it sitting in the dealer bay.

"You're going to get tired of this"
Odd coming from a complete stranger.

The newer color, sterling, is quite catchy.
To be honest, These are better looking than the 5. But that brute power!

Grats.
__________________
Crazy Diamond
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 05:07 PM   #6
erickonphoenix
Lieutenant
erickonphoenix's Avatar
1615
Rep
501
Posts

Drives: 2014 Gray 328xi Touring
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Houston TX

iTrader: (0)

At 57 years old I would have never thought Caddy could have rivaled the Germans in style and performance at a better price point but these new Blackwing series are a nice level up from an already competent and improved V series.

Congratulations on your purchase, and many happy miles!
__________________
Appreciate 2
swanson731.00
Soul_Glo13086.50
      01-03-2023, 05:08 PM   #7
erickonphoenix
Lieutenant
erickonphoenix's Avatar
1615
Rep
501
Posts

Drives: 2014 Gray 328xi Touring
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Houston TX

iTrader: (0)

At 57 years old I would have never thought Caddy could have rivaled the Germans in style and performance at a better price point but these new Blackwing series are a nice level up from an already competent and improved V series.

Congratulations on your purchase, and many happy miles!
__________________
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 05:43 PM   #8
chassis
Colonel
chassis's Avatar
6005
Rep
2,209
Posts

Drives: BMW G01 X3, 9Y0 Cayenne S
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: EinbahnstraŖe

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schn3ll View Post
Let me tell you, I've had a good run with German cars in my roughly 22 years of driving.

First was a 1993 Merc 190E, the baby Benz, great little car - floaty but fun, got it for about $3k from my grandparents neighbor (basically stolen).

Then I fell in love with BMW, specifically the e46 M3 and had to have one, probably sooner than I should have financially so I stretched myself and picked up a 2002 M3 coupe, carbon black with cinnamon leather (yes it was SMG...shhh).

After a rocky ride and a few expensive M3 fixes out of warranty, I sold it and ordered a 135i in 2008 (year 1 of the One). Alpine white over coral red - this time a manual and I taught myself how to drive it on the way home from the dealership. Car was a blast and I did just about ever bolt on and tune. But it wasn't an M car...

Then I found a clean manual 2008 Z4M coupe - loved the lines great little car, pure drivers car. Sold that and bounced around a few more semi practical cars (GTI, Mini cooper S) and eventually made my way to Porsche.

Picked up a 2018 Carrera T manual at the start of the pandemic for a song, $85k w/5k miles. Hell of a deal. Carbon buckets were very uncomfortable and I blew out my knee training and decided to sell during the crazy free money times of 2021.

Eventually picked up a Taycan as a do everything DD, but it was missing soul, and the charging nonsense was not fun to deal with. The current market for high end luxury EV's is crashing by the day. So I made my mind and decided it has to go for another fun DD preferably with manual.

I love the Porsche community but right now everything worthwhile is overpriced, I was not going to overpay for a 911 so I put money down on another Carrera T at sticker. But based on the allocations and my number at the dealer, the prospect of getting one of them was almost nil.

I considered the M2, but those won't be available until April and I felt I needed to dump the Taycan before then and so after much consternation, I landed on a CT4 V Blackwing.

I pondered the CT5 Blackwing, but dealers are asking upwards of $25k over sticker (yes, even today) they are very hard to get right now, with over a year waitlist.

So after much deliberation, I decided that the CT4 V Blackwing would be the right size, and give me everything I wanted:
- great manual (Tremac TR6060)
- enough power (472hp twin turbo v6)
- great features (HUD, heated/cooled/massage seats, multiple drive modes and traction modes)
- SMOOTH leather seats (looking at you M2)
- just enough interior tech (I don't need much more than car play and decent stereo)
- incredible handling and magnetic ride dampers (touring mode ride quality is on par with my Taycan with air suspension, it's that good)
- Mature looking (very under the radar)
- Extremely rare (only about 1,600 total made in 2022, 675 in manual, and Caddy has already said this will be the last generation of manual cars - going full EV) - cars are all numbered - I am #625 of the manual CT4's made in 2022.


I found a 2022 leftover (late 2022 production) that a close-ish dealer was actually willing to deal on, they had 3 other CT4 BW's but all had $5k ADM (no thanks) and a used 2022 with 13k miles for over sticker. So I was able to get a couple grand off sticker, and they gave me more for my Taycan than Porsche was offering. Black wasn't my first choice but it was $10k cheaper than the other manual car available, no brainer.

I feel like I made the right call, this car is everything I could ever need and I am not left wanting for anything (except maybe a bit more noise, but I am still in break-in). There is not one squeak or rattle and everything seems very solid, I had rattles on day 1 with my Taycan and 911 that I could never completely fix.

We still have a Porsche in the garage so I'm not completely abandoning the Germans, wife drives a Panamera eHybrid that no one will ever be able to pry from her hands. But for the value (I paid $70k OTD) I don't see much else with 4 doors that can compete. Will update later with further impressions.

Congrats on the new whip. Sounds like you decided on the Caddy and the others were passing thoughts. Didnít see you mention Macan or Cayenne which punch some buttons you listed. Macan and Cayenne pricing as you probably know is not overheated. Letís hear how the Blackwing experience goes.
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 05:48 PM   #9
Silence*
Eh?
Silence*'s Avatar
225
Rep
79
Posts

Drives: 2015 435ix
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Alberta, Canada

iTrader: (0)

I'm not a huge GM fan these days but holy hell did they ever knock it out of the park with this car. I honestly think it looks downright sinister all blacked out too, congrats!
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 05:53 PM   #10
XutvJet
Major General
5248
Rep
5,255
Posts

Drives: 2011 Cayman Base, 2016 M235
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Kansas City

iTrader: (-1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
"You're going to get tired of this" Odd coming from a complete stranger.
I can tell he's an driving enthusiast given his car history and progression. It's hard to go with something pretty pedestrian after you drank the sports car Kool-Aid for so long.

I do agree with your statement that Germany has abandoned us. There's absolutely nothing from BMW that interests me. The Porsche sports cars are amazing, but like OP noted, the prices are stupid.
__________________
The forest was shrinking, but the Trees kept voting for the Axe, for the Axe was clever and convinced the Trees that because his handle was made of wood, he was one of them.
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 07:03 PM   #11
Schn3ll
Captain
Schn3ll's Avatar
359
Rep
711
Posts

Drives: '24 Carrera T
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Greenville, SC

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2009 135  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Nice. Germany abandoned us, so...
I'd have to ppf that thing. Swirls are coming after it sitting in the dealer bay.

"You're going to get tired of this"
Odd coming from a complete stranger.

The newer color, sterling, is quite catchy.
To be honest, These are better looking than the 5. But that brute power!

Grats.
Thank you.

I have a paint correction and ceramic coating scheduled for next week. I am on the fence on PPF, I don't do highway much and don't follow closely but it would be nice piece of mind...
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 07:09 PM   #12
Burrcold
Brigadier General
Canada
4601
Rep
3,603
Posts

Drives: 2022 Audi RS5 Sportback
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Great choice!
__________________
Current: 2022 Audi RS5 / 2022 Audi Q7
Gone: 2020 BMW M340i / 2019 Audi RS5
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 07:38 PM   #13
StradaRedlands
Colonel
StradaRedlands's Avatar
United_States
3092
Rep
2,158
Posts

Drives: 2006 BMW 330i MT
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2013 BMW X5 35i  [7.50]
2011 BMW 528i  [8.75]
2006 BMW 330i  [8.75]
2006 Mazda3  [0.00]
Congratulations! Looks great and I don't think there's really anything like that out there.
I'm not a huge V6 fan, but wouldn't turn it down :-)
Wondering does it have EPS or mechanical hydraulic?
Nice post tags!
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 08:14 PM   #14
Schn3ll
Captain
Schn3ll's Avatar
359
Rep
711
Posts

Drives: '24 Carrera T
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Greenville, SC

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2009 135  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by StradaRedlands View Post
Congratulations! Looks great and I don't think there's really anything like that out there.
I'm not a huge V6 fan, but wouldn't turn it down :-)
Wondering does it have EPS or mechanical hydraulic?
Nice post tags!
It has EPS, but a good one. Not quite the same level of feel as a 991.2 or 992, but close and you can customize the steering feel (3 levels I believe). Itís way better than BMW, I recently tracked the G80 M3 and it was not the best steering, which is well documented on the forum as well. I just think this car is a great package. Itís a spiritual successor to the e39 M5 (roughly the same size) and it out-BMWís BMW in many ways.
Appreciate 2
      01-03-2023, 08:50 PM   #15
StradaRedlands
Colonel
StradaRedlands's Avatar
United_States
3092
Rep
2,158
Posts

Drives: 2006 BMW 330i MT
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2013 BMW X5 35i  [7.50]
2011 BMW 528i  [8.75]
2006 BMW 330i  [8.75]
2006 Mazda3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schn3ll View Post
It has EPS, but a good one. Not quite the same level of feel as a 991.2 or 992, but close and you can customize the steering feel (3 levels I believe). Itís way better than BMW, I recently tracked the G80 M3 and it was not the best steering, which is well documented on the forum as well. I just think this car is a great package. Itís a spiritual successor to the e39 M5 (roughly the same size) and it out-BMWís BMW in many ways.
Ohhhh, E39 comparisons... you're speaking my language!
I'd settle for a 530i analog at this point!
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 09:13 PM   #16
NickyC
Lieutenant General
NickyC's Avatar
16646
Rep
10,321
Posts

Drives: M4 CS. Former G82, x2 F82, F80
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Jacked out of my mind

iTrader: (23)

Blackwings are nice, enjoy!
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 09:13 PM   #17
mecheng77
Colonel
mecheng77's Avatar
Canada
976
Rep
2,228
Posts

Drives: 2007 328i / 2014 M235i
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Ontario Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
  [0.00]
  [0.00]
Congrats looks nice and they are great cars. Porsches are way overpriced and the 911, cayman, boxster while great driving cars and impractical and not good for long cruises. How did you like the GTI?
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 11:21 PM   #18
RM7
Brigadier General
RM7's Avatar
2769
Rep
3,347
Posts

Drives: Camaro SS 1LE
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Alaska

iTrader: (0)

These are brilliant cars and GM chassis tuning is top notch.
__________________
Current: 2018 Camaro SS 1LE, 2022 Kia Stinger. Former: BMW 428i Gran Coupe.
Appreciate 0
      01-03-2023, 11:22 PM   #19
RM7
Brigadier General
RM7's Avatar
2769
Rep
3,347
Posts

Drives: Camaro SS 1LE
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Alaska

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by StradaRedlands View Post
Congratulations! Looks great and I don't think there's really anything like that out there.
I'm not a huge V6 fan, but wouldn't turn it down :-)
Wondering does it have EPS or mechanical hydraulic?
Nice post tags!
All the modern GM stuff is EPS, including mine, but unlike BMW and like Porsche, GM actually does it well across most models.
__________________
Current: 2018 Camaro SS 1LE, 2022 Kia Stinger. Former: BMW 428i Gran Coupe.
Appreciate 1
      01-04-2023, 02:12 AM   #20
Germanauto
Major General
Germanauto's Avatar
United_States
9531
Rep
6,022
Posts

Drives: Alfa Romeo Giulia, Rosso
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: LA

iTrader: (0)

Congrats. Did you ever look at the Giulia QV?

Agreed that Porsche pricing has become absurd. One dealer was trying to convince me to drop $90K on a dull black 4 cyl Boxster S.

On the BMW side of things, only the M2 could win me back. Some reviews have said the M3 is better than the CT4-BW, but the M3 is just too large and heavy a car now.

Mercedes and Audi...not even once.
__________________
Former
-2008 E90 328 black/brown
-2012 Lexus IS250 black/black
Appreciate 0
      01-04-2023, 05:27 AM   #21
Schn3ll
Captain
Schn3ll's Avatar
359
Rep
711
Posts

Drives: '24 Carrera T
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Greenville, SC

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2009 135  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
Congrats. Did you ever look at the Giulia QV?

Agreed that Porsche pricing has become absurd. One dealer was trying to convince me to drop $90K on a dull black 4 cyl Boxster S.

On the BMW side of things, only the M2 could win me back. Some reviews have said the M3 is better than the CT4-BW, but the M3 is just too large and heavy a car now.

Mercedes and Audi...not even once.
I did, and that was on the short list. What made me not go for one is the lack of manual, the older tech, distance to a local Alfa dealer (20+ miles), price is above what I paid for the BW, and the lack of customization options in the driving dynamics.

Don't get me wrong, it's a phenomenal car and I would love one, it's just Alfa should already be on gen 2 and the company seems to be a bit neglected, but for driving dynamics it's right there with the BW and definitely has a better engine/sound/auto transmission.

They are both underappreciated cars, so they have that in common!
Appreciate 2
      01-04-2023, 06:48 AM   #22
Joachim
Private First Class
Joachim's Avatar
Germany
296
Rep
127
Posts

Drives: M4 Competition X-Drive
Join Date: Sep 2022
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

@Schn3ll, thank you for your report about your CT4 V and the impressive photos! I feel that a committed driver and a modern, driver-oriented car fell in love with each other. Some German car manufacturers should learn from it what computers on wheels and what ugly looking monsters or tiny Kindergarten toys they have in their portfolio, only to curry favor with the contemporary "Zeitgeist".
Only todo: Get somehow rid of two doors.

Wake up the "sleeper" and enjoy! This machine can do it!
__________________
The fact is I don't drive just to get from A to B. I enjoy feeling the car's reactions, becoming part of it.
Enzo Ferrari
Appreciate 1
Schn3ll358.50
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
blackwing, bmw, cadillac, ct4, ct4-v, i have a car addiction, manual, porsche

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:06 PM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST