[FlyingBuckeye3]

Hi all,

Last week I was driving out of town and got the warning of my car overheating so I pulled over and learned the expansion tank burst and leaked coolant all over the engine. I had the car towed back to my house for a DIY on replacing the tank. I’ve replaced the tank and topped off the coolant. Im now trying to bleed the coolant lines but the fan keeps kicking on and cycling off the water pump. Im assuming the fan is kicking on because the last time the car was running, it was flashing an overheating signal. Any idea how to get the fan to stop turning on and interrupting the bleed process?

[Miller335]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

Hi all,

Last week I was driving out of town and got the warning of my car overheating so I pulled over and learned the expansion tank burst and leaked coolant all over the engine. I had the car towed back to my house for a DIY on replacing the tank. I’ve replaced the tank and topped off the coolant. Im now trying to bleed the coolant lines but the fan keeps kicking on and cycling off the water pump. Im assuming the fan is kicking on because the last time the car was running, it was flashing an overheating signal. Any idea how to get the fan to stop turning on and interrupting the bleed process?

It sounds like your expansion tank burst because your WP went out.
The fan running is usually a sign of this.

Time to pull codes to verify.

[Pladi]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

Hi all,

Last week I was driving out of town and got the warning of my car overheating so I pulled over and learned the expansion tank burst and leaked coolant all over the engine. I had the car towed back to my house for a DIY on replacing the tank. I’ve replaced the tank and topped off the coolant. Im now trying to bleed the coolant lines but the fan keeps kicking on and cycling off the water pump. Im assuming the fan is kicking on because the last time the car was running, it was flashing an overheating signal. Any idea how to get the fan to stop turning on and interrupting the bleed process?

Make sure the car is cool when ur doing the bleeding. Does the pump run when you start the bleeding procedure ?

If the fan is still kicking in even with the car off ( which doesnt make any sense) but if it does than ur pump could be bad but you should be pulling codes.

Agree with above post.

[FlyingBuckeye3]

I haven’t started the car since it overheated last week. The pump kicks on immediately when starting the bleed procedure. It runs for a minute or so, then the fan kicks on. It’s hard to tell if the pump cycles off immediately once the fan kicks on since the fan is so much louder. I don’t have anything to read codes but the car currently only signals a maintenance reminder to change my brake fluid (which I knew).

[FlyingBuckeye3]

Originally Posted by Pladi

Make sure the car is cool when ur doing the bleeding. Does the pump run when you start the bleeding procedure ?

If the fan is still kicking in even with the car off ( which doesnt make any sense) but if it does than ur pump could be bad but you should be pulling codes.

Agree with above post.

Would the car still be flashing a code if the water pump failed? When the ignition is on, the only thing is a maintenance reminder. And if the water pump failed, would it even kick on for the bleed process?

[e90yyc]

No. You’ll need to pull codes. It might not have outright failed yet, but if it’s on its way out, there is often something stored (electrical coolant pump speed deviation code, for example).

[banglenot]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

I haven’t started the car since it overheated last week. The pump kicks on immediately when starting the bleed procedure. It runs for a minute or so, then the fan kicks on. It’s hard to tell if the pump cycles off immediately once the fan kicks on since the fan is so much louder. I don’t have anything to read codes but the car currently only signals a maintenance reminder to change my brake fluid (which I knew).

The bleed cycles on and off for about 12 minutes. Completely normal to do that, but the fan doesn't come on. That might be related to the program expecting you're doing the bleed cold. If you're doing it hot, the start-stop of the pump might signal a temperature error condition for the pump when its in an off state. If the pump fails, one clear symptom is the fan coming on a very high speed.

I usually set the cap on the tank to avoid splashing.

[FlyingBuckeye3]

Originally Posted by e90yyc

No. You’ll need to pull codes. It might not have outright failed yet, but if it’s on its way out, there is often something stored (electrical coolant pump speed deviation code, for example).

In the interim, just to get the car running, could I disconnect the battery to erase any engine overheating code so that I could perform the bleed procedure? The radiator fan keeps disrupting the bleed procedure.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

Would the car still be flashing a code if the water pump failed? When the ignition is on, the only thing is a maintenance reminder. And if the water pump failed, would it even kick on for the bleed process?

You need to scan the car for code 2E81, which is low speed warning for the pump, or code 2E82, stopped pump. These two are the most common. 2E83 or 84 is the non- communication code. The code can only be read by a BMW scan tool. An OBD2 scan tool will not pick them up.

If you find any WP codes, then the pump is going bad.

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

In the interim, just to get the car running, could I disconnect the battery to erase any engine overheating code so that I could perform the bleed procedure? The radiator fan keeps disrupting the bleed procedure.

Unfortunately not. The memory in these modules is non-volatile, so an interruption in power won’t clear the codes.

A scan tool or cable is the single best investment you can make for these cars. Since time is of the essence for you, I’d suggest trying to find a cheap cable on Amazon, get it shipped as fast as possible, and read/reset codes tomorrow.

Sorry if you’ve already mentioned this, but are you following the bleed procedure to the letter?

[FlyingBuckeye3]

Originally Posted by e90yyc

Unfortunately not. The memory in these modules is non-volatile, so an interruption in power won’t clear the codes.

A scan tool or cable is the single best investment you can make for these cars. Since time is of the essence for you, I’d suggest trying to find a cheap cable on Amazon, get it shipped as fast as possible, and read/reset codes tomorrow.

Sorry if you’ve already mentioned this, but are you following the bleed procedure to the letter?

I’ll look in to the cable. I’m fairly computer savvy, but is the software user friendly?

As far as I know I’m following it step by step, I did it 6 months ago and it worked. I closed off the bleed valve and screwed on the cap. I went in to the car, put the key in and pushed the start button twice to bring up the accessories. I turned the heat to 84 and on the lowest fan setting. Then I held the gas down for 10-12 seconds until the pump kicked on. It starts flushing the coolant like normal till the radiator fan kicks on. I’m going to try turning the accessories on without running the bleed procedure to see if the fan kicks on. I have some time to play with it.

Thanks for your help so far in this!

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

I’ll look in to the cable. I’m fairly computer savvy, but is the software user friendly?

As far as I know I’m following it step by step, I did it 6 months ago and it worked. I closed off the bleed valve and screwed on the cap. I went in to the car, put the key in and pushed the start button twice to bring up the accessories. I turned the heat to 84 and on the lowest fan setting. Then I held the gas down for 10-12 seconds until the pump kicked on. It starts flushing the coolant like normal till the radiator fan kicks on. I’m going to try turning the accessories on without running the bleed procedure to see if the fan kicks on. I have some time to play with it.

Thanks for your help so far in this!

Sounds like you're doing it correctly!

If you're tech savvy you'll be fine. INPA (which I use) doesn't have the greatest interface and is kind of buggy, but it gets the job done. ISTA is better from what I hear, but I haven't used it. Finally, if all you're looking to do is read or clear codes, Dr. Gini, which is included in the BimmerGeeks BMW software package (free), is really easy to use.

[smass]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

I’ll look in to the cable. I’m fairly computer savvy, but is the software user friendly?

As far as I know I’m following it step by step, I did it 6 months ago and it worked. I closed off the bleed valve and screwed on the cap. I went in to the car, put the key in and pushed the start button twice to bring up the accessories. I turned the heat to 84 and on the lowest fan setting. Then I held the gas down for 10-12 seconds until the pump kicked on. It starts flushing the coolant like normal till the radiator fan kicks on. I’m going to try turning the accessories on without running the bleed procedure to see if the fan kicks on. I have some time to play with it.

Thanks for your help so far in this!

Software and info are here.
https://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sh....php?t=1023698

[FlyingBuckeye3]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

You need to scan the car for code 2E81, which is low speed warning for the pump, or code 2E82, stopped pump. These two are the most common. 2E83 or 84 is the non- communication code. The code can only be read by a BMW scan tool. An OBD2 scan tool will not pick them up.

If you find any WP codes, then the pump is going bad.

Thanks for the advice. I bought a cable and pulled the codes via INPA below:

DME - 2 errors stored, 377A and 3792.

After a quick search it appears both codes are related to the cooling system. Is there a chance they're caused by the expansion tank bursting and leaking fluid, causing the overheat? Is it possible to clear the codes and try the bleed procedure? I'm just not convinced the water pump is 100% gone since it kicks on at the beginning of the bleed. I just want to be able to drive the car to a repair facility to replace the water pump since it sounds like it's going bad anyway.

[FlyingBuckeye3]

So I couldn't get the bleed procedure to complete without the radiator fan kicking on, so I pulled the fuse on the fan. Once I pulled the fuse on the fan and initiated the bleed procedure, the water pump kicked on and ran without a hiccup. The only concern is the pump ran for 15-16 minutes before I turned it off. Any idea why the pump would run so long?

[Seanjohn004]

Crazy because the exact same thing i am experiencing now. Was driving then i started smelling coolant. Pulled over saw steam coming from hood. Weird because my hood for some reason wasnt closed all the way.
Saw coolant all over engine and hood. Checked hoses and didnt see anything ruptured but heard coolant boiling in ofh.
Poured a half a gallon in tank and tried to bleed. Pump started then fan came on. Everytime i try same thing. Saw all the coolant pooling on underbody tray. Guessing its the radiator and wondering if i should spend the money on a pump and thermo as well. Hope you get it figured out im in the same boat. No cooling system codes found when checked with mhd. Need to use INPA today.

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

So I couldn't get the bleed procedure to complete without the radiator fan kicking on, so I pulled the fuse on the fan. Once I pulled the fuse on the fan and initiated the bleed procedure, the water pump kicked on and ran without a hiccup. The only concern is the pump ran for 15-16 minutes before I turned it off. Any idea why the pump would run so long?

15-16 minutes is perfectly normal. This is about how long the procedure takes.

[gbalthrop]

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

... I bought a cable and pulled the codes via INPA below: DME - 2 errors stored, 377A and 3792.

After a quick search it appears both codes are related to the cooling system. Is there a chance they're caused by the expansion tank bursting and leaking fluid, causing the overheat? Is it possible to clear the codes and try the bleed procedure? I'm just not convinced the water pump is 100% gone since it kicks on at the beginning of the bleed. I just want to be able to drive the car to a repair facility to replace the water pump since it sounds like it's going bad anyway.

Originally Posted by FlyingBuckeye3

So I couldn't get the bleed procedure to complete without the radiator fan kicking on, so I pulled the fuse on the fan. Once I pulled the fuse on the fan and initiated the bleed procedure, the water pump kicked on and ran without a hiccup. The only concern is the pump ran for 15-16 minutes before I turned it off. Any idea why the pump would run so long?

I had NOT replied to your thread previously as you did NOT identify Model Year or Engine of your "335." If you are unaware of how to get (1) Fault Code Definition, and (2) Details including Freeze Frame Data related to each code using INPA, let me know and I will explain. It would appear you simply read Fault Code numbers from "Functional Jobs" and did NOT connect to the DME to Read Fault Codes with FF Data, and do other testing using F6 Activations (Steuern), which is best way to test Coolant Pump as opposed to just running Bleed Procedure. If you would like me to walk you through that procedure, let me know.

From your description of the events (Expansion Tank Rupture causing overheat), it is POSSIBLE that fragments of tank plastic jammed the pump, at least momentarily. INPA tells you whether a particular Fault is "Currently Present" or NOT. You have to connect to the DME and read Fault Details (NOT just use Functional Jobs to read code numbers) to do that.

It COULD be (particularly if you hear pump running when doing "Bleed" procedure) that you could CLEAR both those codes and that would fix the problem. HOWEVER, before you do that, you want to read and SAVE ALL related Fault Code Details and Freeze Frame Data now saved in the DME, and also do tests (Activation) of your Coolant Pump. Don't just throw parts at it. You have INPA and if used properly, you can diagnose the issue as well or better than a shop (since it's YOUR car and you can take time a shop can't).

Apparently from the Code numbers you posted, you have a 2011 or later 335i/xi with N55 Engine and "mevd17xx" DME? Here are the Fault Code Definitions from "BMW Fault Code Lookup":
377A | Engine cooling system: coolant pump switched off due to blockage | mevd17kw
3792 | Engine cooling system: Coolant pump speed outside of tolerance | mevd17kw

I would suggest using INPA, F6 Activations > Coolant Pump (Wasserpumpe) to monitor SetSpeed vs. Actual Speed (Pump Speed Deviation). The Fault Codes suggest the pump impeller WAS jammed and the motor COULD NOT turn, causing excessive current draw/heat, and causing the DME to cease activation of the Pump. Those conditions, and the Faults described by the codes may NOT BE PRESENT at this time.

INPA will tell you "Fehler momentan nicht vorhanden" which means THE FAULT IS NOT CURRENTLY PRESENT if the pump was momentarily jammed, but operating properly NOW.

Many people would just replace the pump based upon those two codes, but I would suggest using INPA to make sure, BEFORE replacing. Even if (1) Faults described by the Codes ARE currently present, and return after Clearing, and (2) the Activation test confirms Pump will NOT run, you at least have learned something about use of INPA which will be valuable in the future.

Please let us know what you find,
George

[FlyingBuckeye3]

Originally Posted by gbalthrop

I had NOT replied to your thread previously as you did NOT identify Model Year or Engine of your "335." If you are unaware of how to get (1) Fault Code Definition, and (2) Details including Freeze Frame Data related to each code using INPA, let me know and I will explain. It would appear you simply read Fault Code numbers from "Functional Jobs" and did NOT connect to the DME to Read Fault Codes with FF Data, and do other testing using F6 Activations (Steuern), which is best way to test Coolant Pump as opposed to just running Bleed Procedure. If you would like me to walk you through that procedure, let me know.

From your description of the events (Expansion Tank Rupture causing overheat), it is POSSIBLE that fragments of tank plastic jammed the pump, at least momentarily. INPA tells you whether a particular Fault is "Currently Present" or NOT. You have to connect to the DME and read Fault Details (NOT just use Functional Jobs to read code numbers) to do that.

It COULD be (particularly if you hear pump running when doing "Bleed" procedure) that you could CLEAR both those codes and that would fix the problem. HOWEVER, before you do that, you want to read and SAVE ALL related Fault Code Details and Freeze Frame Data now saved in the DME, and also do tests (Activation) of your Coolant Pump. Don't just throw parts at it. You have INPA and if used properly, you can diagnose the issue as well or better than a shop (since it's YOUR car and you can take time a shop can't).

Apparently from the Code numbers you posted, you have a 2011 or later 335i/xi with N55 Engine and "mevd17xx" DME? Here are the Fault Code Definitions from "BMW Fault Code Lookup":
377A | Engine cooling system: coolant pump switched off due to blockage | mevd17kw
3792 | Engine cooling system: Coolant pump speed outside of tolerance | mevd17kw

I would suggest using INPA, F6 Activations > Coolant Pump (Wasserpumpe) to monitor SetSpeed vs. Actual Speed (Pump Speed Deviation). The Fault Codes suggest the pump impeller WAS jammed and the motor COULD NOT turn, causing excessive current draw/heat, and causing the DME to cease activation of the Pump. Those conditions, and the Faults described by the codes may NOT BE PRESENT at this time.

INPA will tell you "Fehler momentan nicht vorhanden" which means THE FAULT IS NOT CURRENTLY PRESENT if the pump was momentarily jammed, but operating properly NOW.

Many people would just replace the pump based upon those two codes, but I would suggest using INPA to make sure, BEFORE replacing. Even if (1) Faults described by the Codes ARE currently present, and return after Clearing, and (2) the Activation test confirms Pump will NOT run, you at least have learned something about use of INPA which will be valuable in the future.

Please let us know what you find,
George

Holy smokes! I'm sorry I'm just now seeing this but thank you so much for the reply. I'll admit, I'm 100% new on how to properly use INPA. I'll search how to better utilize it, but if you're able to point me in the right direction as to how to connect to the DME and use F6 activations, that'd be great.

So I thought the car was fixed for a couple weeks, it ran fine with no overheating issues around town. Last week though I headed out on a 3 hr trip and halfway in, the car overheated. I nursed the car another 30-40 miles over the course of 2 hours, then just elected to have it towed to my destination. I don't have a computer to read the codes now (I'm 2.5 hrs from the car now), but am having a water pump/thermostat installed tomorrow. I'm just not sure why the car operates fine around town and overheats after 1.5 hour drive.

This time around I can tell it's not leaking coolant. I could turn on the heat in the car and drive 40-50mph and the car wouldn't overheat, so it would seem the thermostat is functioning properly.

You're correct, the car is a 2011 with the N55. I'm hoping the new thermostat/waterpump fix the issue, but the car has almost 90k miles on the original waterpump, so I'd likely need/want to replace it soon anyhow.

If you're able to help me better understand INPA, or if there's a forum that explains it, that would be great. I searched and didn't see anything, but I could've just missed it too.