[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by rjahl

Absolutely, I must give credit where due. Large portions if not most of this came from your file. Thank you.

I got tired of making small incremental changes on my own and started taking large chunks from your maps. Piece by piece and ended up with something that's near identical. I have a list of things I would like to refine but the VVL issue is first on my list.

I sent you a copy of my BIN a few days back.

BTW, I have yet to see that "Torque Exceeding Expected Value" error.

yeah. I think that could be trans coding related, or it could possibly due to some sort of failure that is hard to detect. I haven't been able to reproduce it at all either.

[Taskmaster]

I'll test a tune if someone wants to send me one.

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by TheAxiom

I'll test a tune if someone wants to send me one.

Do you have any way to flash a custom file?

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by TheAxiom

I'll test a tune if someone wants to send me one.

MSV80... so far me and rjahl have only done MSV70. I could do it for MSV80 but the motivation for me hasn't been there since both of my cars run MSV70 (three N52s by the time I finish by engine build lol).

if you had an OFT or BT cable we could hook you up with something. But MSV80 is only flashable via OBD - the risk here is it's easier to brick it that way. if you buy an AA flash, they can warranty that. it can be mitigated of course, and I don't mean to blow it out of proportion - just keep that in mind that you're more on your own.

We're flashing MSV70 directly, and it's basically impossible to brick it (you could write complete garbage to the DME, and still be able to recover it). it's also quite a bit faster, not just because of the interface but because it only writes to the areas of the DME that have actually changed. This means we don't really need a battery charger if we're flashing it in the car, but you would want one because the biggest risk when flashing via OBD is a dead battery..

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by pheno

Nice graphs! How fast is the sampling rate in these logs ?

I guess TestO has worked quite OK ?

Yes, TestO is working well with the MSV70. Sample rates are in the 120-140 millisecond range. The logs are very informative.

I'm having problems with the GS19D file. Anytime I try to create a custom job with either the original or stand alone versions of TestO, it crashes. Standard jobs run but the process of creating a custom job kill it.

Trying to log the ZF Transmission.


Edit: I found your post on another thread where you indicated the GS19 TCU does not support selectable parameters.

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

MSV80... so far me and rjahl have only done MSV70. I could do it for MSV80 but the motivation for me hasn't been there since both of my cars run MSV70 (three N52s by the time I finish by engine build lol).

if you had an OFT or BT cable we could hook you up with something. But MSV80 is only flashable via OBD - the risk here is it's easier to brick it that way. if you buy an AA flash, they can warranty that. it can be mitigated of course, and I don't mean to blow it out of proportion - just keep that in mind that you're more on your own.

We're flashing MSV70 directly, and it's basically impossible to brick it (you could write complete garbage to the DME, and still be able to recover it). it's also quite a bit faster, not just because of the interface but because it only writes to the areas of the DME that have actually changed. This means we don't really need a battery charger if we're flashing it in the car, but you would want one because the biggest risk when flashing via OBD is a dead battery..

Ya, without the right tools. Tuning the MSV80 is not really a DYI sort of project.

[hassmaschine]

it can be done, it just depends on your comfort level - it has some significant downsides; no BDM so you can't recover a bricked DME, and you can't clone it so if you mess it up you need a whole new DME/CAS/Key set. But if you take precautions it should be fine, no more risky than flashing with the AA tool - you just don't have the support of AA in case something goes wrong.

technically it should be possible to enable boot mode on the tri-core CPU but the tools to do so are scarce..

[pheno]

Originally Posted by rjahl

Yes, TestO is working well with the MSV70. Sample rates are in the 120-140 millisecond range. The logs are very informative.

I'm having problems with the GS19D file. Anytime I try to create a custom job with either the original or stand alone versions of TestO, it crashes. Standard jobs run but the process of creating a custom job kill it.

Trying to log the ZF Transmission.


Edit: I found your post on another thread where you indicated the GS19 TCU does not support selectable parameters.

Thanks for the bug report. I'll fix that in the next version.

Yes, the GS19D does not support selectable params. I remember there's this job 'status_io_lesen' that returns the most common data.

[Taskmaster]

Bumping this, I want to try this out. I've never logged before, so what do I need to know?

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by TheAxiom

Bumping this, I want to try this out. I've never logged before, so what do I need to know?

Not much, Pheno has made this program pretty easy to use. Do you have a DCan cable? What Com port does it connect to. I can set up an MSV80 version and place it on a Mega server for you to download.

The stand alone version of Testo is pretty lean and does not need much to run.

Alternatively we can try to hook up sometime down town. I still make a commute through 275 into Largo each day. Next week end is tough, Wife's Birthday.

[Taskmaster]

Originally Posted by rjahl

Not much, Pheno has made this program pretty easy to use. Do you have a DCan cable? What Com port does it connect to. I can set up an MSV80 version and place it on a Mega server for you to download.

The stand alone version of Testo is pretty lean and does not need much to run.

Alternatively we can try to hook up sometime down town. I still make a commute through 275 into Largo each day. Next week end is tough, Wife's Birthday.

Well I downloaded both, but the standalone version doesn't have the MSV80 on the list. I have INPA...which barely works, so that's probably why it's not working.
I work in St Pete, right by the Ray's stadium and my weekends are pretty open. Just let me know

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by TheAxiom

Well I downloaded both, but the standalone version doesn't have the MSV80 on the list. I have INPA...which barely works, so that's probably why it's not working.
I work in St Pete, right by the Ray's stadium and my weekends are pretty open. Just let me know

Got busy this week but you can download the MSV80.PRG and the custom jobs file from here

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/11vwm0u8y...4CmSlZAza?dl=0

MSV80.prg should be placed in the testo\ecu folder
customjobs.xml should be placed in the testo\config folder

Start here, if the data rate is slow, then we need to make a small change in the testo.ini file. All MSV70s need this change but I think the MSV80 is faster and won't need the change.

BTW, I have created a custom job for the MSV80 that matches the logging file that I use for the MSV70, also included. I have no way of testing the custom jobs on a MSV80, but I'm hopeful it will work.

[Taskmaster]

Originally Posted by rjahl

Got busy this week but you can download the MSV80.PRG and the custom jobs file from here

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/11vwm0u8y...4CmSlZAza?dl=0

MSV80.prg should be placed in the testo\ecu folder
customjobs.xml should be placed in the testo\config folder

Start here, if the data rate is slow, then we need to make a small change in the testo.ini file. All MSV70s need this change but I think the MSV80 is faster and won't need the change.

BTW, I have created a custom job for the MSV80 that matches the logging file that I use for the MSV70, also included. I have no way of testing the custom jobs on a MSV80, but I'm hopeful it will work.

Thank you, hopefully I can test it out this weekend and report back my findings.

[drc38]

If it's of interest I've captured a TestO run on a stock BMW 130i manual. It was with DTC on and not the quickest 0-100 km/h but it shows the torque limiting in 1st gear from about 1000 rpm to 2000 rpm at 150Nm and then 250Nm up to around 4700 rpm. It looks like this is limited from 2000 rpm upwards by the Maximum Torque map at 57EF8. The relative desired torque map may also be kicking in although the %ages in the map don't quite line up with the observed values.

Stock map 2016-12-05-180012-post.zip

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by drc38

If it's of interest I've captured a TestO run on a stock BMW 130i manual. It was with DTC on and not the quickest 0-100 km/h but it shows the torque limiting in 1st gear from about 1000 rpm to 2000 rpm at 150Nm and then 250Nm up to around 4700 rpm. It looks like this is limited from 2000 rpm upwards by the Maximum Torque map at 57EF8. The relative desired torque map may also be kicking in although the %ages in the map don't quite line up with the observed values.

Attachment 1538074

Can you post the log?

[drc38]

The raw csv or something else? 2016-12-05-180012 post.zip

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by drc38

The raw csv or something else? Attachment 1538090

Raw csv works for me but a picture of the graph Looks good in the post.??

[drc38]

A couple more charts that may be of interest, I added the pedal and throttle angle positions to rahl's e90 post xml. These runs were in rather wet conditions and so you can see where I backed off with loss of traction in first. The second is with pedal flat to the floor in 2nd gear from about 25km/h. Interestingly the pedal value reported max's out at 65 and throttle position at 81 but in the first chart the pedal request only gets to just over 40 to achieve full throttle, which makes me wonder if that is how the DME limits torque? Also whether there is another value which is the direct voltage reading from the pedal to interrogate?

[rjahl]

Originally Posted by drc38

A couple more charts that may be of interest, I added the pedal and throttle angle positions to rahl's e90 post xml. These runs were in rather wet conditions and so you can see where I backed off with loss of traction in first. The second is with pedal flat to the floor in 2nd gear from about 25km/h. Interestingly the pedal value reported max's out at 65 and throttle position at 81 but in the first chart the pedal request only gets to just over 40 to achieve full throttle, which makes me wonder if that is how the DME limits torque? Also whether there is another value which is the direct voltage reading from the pedal to interrogate?

Attachment 1539581

Attachment 1539582

What is your X axis or time scale?



These DME takes the pedal input and converts that to a requested torque value. From there it sorts out valve lift. Timing, labda , vanos. Throttle plate being one of the least significant items.

I'd look at the engine load, valve lift/ eccentric cam angle and timing advance.

What is your data frame rate like? You should be around 130 milliseconds per frame.

Can you post the raw log? They are small if trimmed to just the important time segments.

Edit: sorry I did not see the attachments on my phone

[drc38]

The x-axis is the data sample number and the sample rate is around 50ms. I have added the target torque to the attached file, which is typically 50-100 Nm higher than the reported torque, so I assumed the output was being limited by some other variable. I started from first principles in looking at the throttle angle which is the first DME controlled device in the air intake. So provided the throttle angle is not overly restricting air flow, then as you say the others are far more influential.

As an aside, from others comments I was expecting to see a delay when you come off the pedal, but the graph shows a very quick response. There is however a reasonable delay in the throttle and torque ramping up to a pedal request of around 700-800ms. Is this able to be altered to give better response?

I haven't started on tuning yet as I think I will wait and get a BDM reader first for peace of mind, but the TestO tool appears to be a great way to analyse what is going on.

stock DTC pressed 2016-12-10-114218.zip

[rjahl]

Yes TestO is great tool. It's all in your hands now. If you transpose this data and compared it against your DME tune it would all match. Except the timing. That's a little more complex.

I found I had better data if I would get onto an on-ramp or other safe road, and set myself of for a logging pull starting at around 2,000 in second gear and just run full throttle until mid third. I have an auto, so catching the action during the shift was important to me. Stop the log right after you cut the throttle. A similar run through 3rd would be great but I don't have the roads for that.

I have logged a few part throttle events but they are tough. TestO has a 3d mapping feature that lets your run around town and fill in a full map. It's pretty cool.

BTW, your data speed is great what cable to you have? It's double that I get.

Edit: transpose the data with RPM being one axis.

[rjahl]

One more thing, the torque calculations are also very complex. It easy to get lost in the various torque values. The DME calculates a gross torque then subtracts calculated losses such as friction and loads from alternators and such.

I don't think your engine uses the Max torque to limit power in stock trim. I tried adjusting those values and it made no change to anything I could log.