[DarkAnt335i]

Originally Posted by rabble

mainly to do with lifestyle i think. alot of people i work with are on average £20k - £25k combined salary and manage kids, bills, car etc...

i think more money you have the more expensive your lifestyle is (bigger house, expensive cars, higher bills etc...)

Did you mean what you said £20k - £25k COMBINED or EACH?

[BGM]

Originally Posted by DarkAnt335i

On the mortgage thing. We had a 3yr fixed starting May 2008 @ 6.45% which was just above average for the time of taking out our mortgage.... but it then went onto a tracker of 1% above BOE base..... so now we are free to pay as much as we want above our monthly amount with no penalty

I would be smashing the shit out of that then, cos when rates do rise you'll want a great LTV in order to hop onto the best avail product... smash smash smash

[wheelie good]

Yer but if you're still living at home you get free dindins off yer mam, which shirley is worth another £5K per yer at least

[MEGA]

Originally Posted by DarkAnt335i

Did you mean what you said £20k - £25k COMBINED or EACH?

Minimum wage is around 12k. Average salary is 22k or so at the moment.

So one working other looking after kids or both working shite jobs and this is very possibly.

A horrifying thought. And to those of us discussing whether or not it's sensible to blow £500/month (half of a minimum wage takehome) on a car; quite humbling.

[DarkAnt335i]

Originally Posted by MEGA

Minimum wage is around 12k. Average salary is 22k or so at the moment.

So one working other looking after kids or both working shite jobs and this is very possibly.

A horrifying thought. And to those of us discussing whether or not it's sensible to blow £500/month (half of a minimum wage takehome) on a car; quite humbling.

Should have worded my post better.

It was less whether 2 people could have a combined wage of £25k, which i knew was possible, but managing that with a housing, car and children etc would be tuff.... assuming that it's 'un-assisted living'. Also i guess it is dependant somewhat on where you live in the country. Anyway guess we are getting off topic.

I think 25-30% is reasonable depending on your other outgoings. Much like others on here, when i was at home and on a lesser salary i'm pretty sure about 40% of my salary went on my car and the other 60% holidays and going out and gadgets.... seeing as my parents didn't ask for rent.

[DarkAnt335i]

Originally Posted by BGM

I would be smashing the shit out of that then, cos when rates do rise you'll want a great LTV in order to hop onto the best avail product... smash smash smash

We do pay a fair about over approx. an additional 40% if i remember correctly. Roughly if the rate continued as it is @ .5% (1.5% to us) we could pay off this mortgage in about 7.5 years. Unlikely though as i think it will begin to climb towards the end of 2013. We could actually pay a lot more, but i'm all for living for the now TBH.... holidays,cars, our recent wedding and trips away make up a large proportion of our spending!

All swings and round about though as our property has lost about 20% of its value since 2008! Hoping by time the interest rates go up, so will the value of the property..... wishful thinking but you never know

[MEGA]

You're very fortunate to be in the position to overpay by so much and without repercussions Ant. I'd be taking it with both hands and getting mortgage free as soon as poss!

[wheelie good]

Sorry for bragging guys

I do not have a mortgage now

[Vaheed1]

Originally Posted by Palmnuts

And so Roger, you'll be surprised to hear that IMO, 25% of total GROSS income is too much....particularly if you've got a mortgage, bills, family etc.

However, 25% of net take home probably isn't excessive although it may be a little outside of the 'comfortable' zone. The main thing is what other outgoings you're committed to...if you have no mortgage, few bills, no debt etc, then to spend 25% of your net income on something that is your passion is hardly a crime that you should get shot for. And if you can do that and have your holidays, and live the lifestyle that you want AND save £1k/month then whats the problem?

Also, looking at your figures and as other have commented on, you're being very prudent with your forecasted spend and I reckon you could knock a couple of k's off that annual sum.

We all know I'm not shy of spending a few quid on a car so heres how I look at it....if I have to think about it or if it gets in the way of me living the lifestyle I want then it's too much. If not....game on

One more thing....a 335d costing £523/month? Really? You surely wouldn't buy a new one at this stage of the e92's(?) life and as they're plentiful at around the £20-25k mark you should be at £450 tops (assuming a PCP is the preferred form of purchase)?

Going by your previous posts - it looks like you have the right idea about life. You love cars and driving - so what better way to spend your own hard earned cash?

I'm 32 this year and soo wish I had done so much more before I got married, had kids and took on a mortgage. Life is too short. Fucking enjoy it and worry about the money you pissed down the drain, once you're retired

[Vaheed1]

Originally Posted by MEGA

Off topic but..

Back in January I paid 27k for mine, an LCI (July '10) with 19k of the clock - pretty much every option ticked, brand new 313s fitted and a host of other sweeteners. It was around 1k above guide trade price so I was happy enough.

But I'm on HP not PCP. I have been stung by PCP before and will never do so again.

PCP is pretty straight forward, no? deposit - payments - keep car or return car after hire period. What went wrong?

I think HP is a better option if you're keeping the car for a good few years - but £530 p/m for 5 years (which I presume is the term) can become a burden - considering that 5 years is a long time and you never know what's going to happen in that length of time.

[Kerr]

Originally Posted by Vaheed1

PCP is pretty straight forward, no? deposit - payments - keep car or return car after hire period. What went wrong?

I think HP is a better option if you're keeping the car for a good few years - but £530 p/m for 5 years (which I presume is the term) can become a burden - considering that 5 years is a long time and you never know what's going to happen in that length of time.

Remember with HP you can hand the car back after you have paid half the finance back.

Technically only 2.5 years to worry about and if the car depreciates less than payments you will be ok throughout.

[gIzzE]

10% max for me these days.

I have the E350cdi estate and after insurance and fuel etc. it works out around 10% of my take home.
I honestly can't afford any more than that.

At one point I had the CSL and 535d sport touring plus Fionas Mini and that was around 25% of my take home, but I was getting bigger dividends then so still had more spare cash each month, not that I spent it wisely!

[MEGA]

Vaheed. you haven't mentioned the balloon payment? It somewhat changes the game. PCP you can pay almost double the interest. As they put interest on the GFV too and spread it over the term.. And you always owe the balloon which means the time it takes to hand back without cost is much higher.

PCP pretty much forces private sale about 65% of the way through the term, private sale at completion, or voluntary termination with the knock on affects that has.

with HP it's your choice. And after half of the term chances are you're building up equity as you'll be paying the car off significantly faster than it's depreciating.

I see the car as a backwards saving scheme. I get X % of what I put in when I sell the car. But at least I haven't blown it like I otherwise would

Just checked what I owe versus car value and it's not bad. First 6 months. Car is now 2 years old. It's worth 24k trade value to toss now. I've pad off 3k so shortfall would only be £1000..

That's another benefit of HP over PCP is you're clearing more of the car faster rather than delaying it to the end ..


Bear in mind I always assumed that this would be a car I keep for a good 60-70k miles IE 4-5 years. Why would I change it (Unless Sytner REALLY twist my arm with a used F10 M5 in about 2 years )

[Kerr]

I remember in the past HP used to have the interest loaded earlier in the repayment schedule.

For the first while you are only covering interest plus a little of the loan value.

Is this still the same?

Better still, does someone have the formula used with HP?

[gIzzE]

http://www.dynamic-webs.co.uk/inform...alculator.html

Personal loans are front loaded but with massive discounts which equate to pretty much getting everything back for the period you have not borrowed for yet.

Business loans are different, front loaded on fixed rate, interest calculated each month on variable rate.

[gIzzE]

PCP VS HIRE PURCHASE is hardly any different these days for the reason explained about.

It is all about the APR really, this simply tells yo everything about what it will cost.

At the moment new cars are around 4-6% rate compared with used at 8-12%.
This is why buying new can cost you hardly anything more than used if you get a nice discount as well.

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by Kerr

Remember with HP you can hand the car back after you have paid half the finance back.

Technically only 2.5 years to worry about and if the car depreciates less than payments you will be ok throughout.

Half the payment, not half the term.
Be careful.

Borrow £30k and have a balloon of 45% after 48 months and you will owe £13500 at the end, however, the point you can throw the keys back at is £15k, half the amount borrowed.
This will happen at around month 45, so hardly worth doing.

It is not listed as a negative on your credit history, but it is recorded and will be taken into account next time you take finance out with them.

[Kerr]

I didn't realise that HP was anything but a simple straight up monthly payment where all payments add up to the full loan amount.

I was referring to that and not an agreement with balloon payments.

I was aware that half the total amount with interest had to be paid back and obviously that couldn't be at half way if there was a balloon payment at the end.

[BGM]

Originally Posted by Kerr

I didn't realise that HP was anything but a simple straight up monthly payment where all payments add up to the full loan amount.

I was referring to that and not an agreement with balloon payments.

I was aware that half the total amount with interest had to be paid back and obviously that couldn't be at half way if there was a balloon payment at the end.

Well, the people doing the lending have to make money somewhere

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by Kerr

I didn't realise that HP was anything but a simple straight up monthly payment where all payments add up to the full loan amount.

I was referring to that and not an agreement with balloon payments.

I was aware that half the total amount with interest had to be paid back and obviously that couldn't be at half way if there was a balloon payment at the end.

Yeah, that is right, but with an HP agreement, straight repayment (but it is the loan amount plus interest, so borrow £30k with an 8% apr over 60 months and you will owe £36500), as with a mortgage for the first 2/3 of the loan you are paying far more interest.
So it is not till you get close to the end that you have paid half off.

[mowflow]

My brain is hurty.

[Kerr]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

Yeah, that is right, but with an HP agreement, straight repayment (but it is the loan amount plus interest, so borrow £30k with an 8% apr over 60 months and you will owe £36500), as with a mortgage for the first 2/3 of the loan you are paying far more interest.
So it is not till you get close to the end that you have paid half off.

You have me confused now.

My understanding is you have to get to halfway in total amount repayable.

I've read a few examples given on sites like money supermarket and the advice did seem clear before unless those advisors are wrong.

Essentially they are saying if the loan is 30k and total repayable is 36.5k, once you have paid 18.25k you are at halfway and can terminate.

It was all relevent to the total repayable and not top heavy interest.