Smokey start up

am335i · 08-18-2018, 09:01 AM

Hi Everyone,

Looking to see if anyone can provide any feedback on this issue that i'm having.

So everyone morning at startup i notice heavy white smoke coming out of my exhaust and this only happens in the morning, assuming whatever is burning collects overnight. Looking to see what your thoughts on this may be?

I do have a coolant leak somewhere but its doesn't seem to be a lot as i can go almost 2 1/2 months before i get low coolant warning. I was told it was the expansion tank that was the cause of the leak, repaired and looks like it wasn't the cause. Being told it could be the radiator or hoses. Not sure i want to move forward with the repairs just yet. ($2k-2500k) Also water pump was replaced at about 120k miles, i'm at 185k now.

I also have a minor oil housing gasket leak, i put in maybe a quart of oil in every 2 months or so. I've had this replaced it seems every few years, guess its a known issue.

With these two leaks, i never see it on the ground so i'm guessing its entering the engine and then burns off? I did have all 6 fuel injectors replaced in Jan 2018 and i started noticing the smoke about a month later. The dealer replaced the injectors and they scanned the car and found no faults so they are saying its not the injectors.

At this point, after owning the car for 11 years, 185k miles am i just better off driving the car until it dies? Or would it be worth spending say $3k on fixing the above items, hope that solves the smoke issue and the car runs fine thereafter? Or sell the car for hmmm maybe $5k kbb says its worth? Right now its my daily commuter to work which is 90miles round trip.

Suggestions, feedback, comments most welcome!!

DJtoad · 08-19-2018, 08:41 AM

If it only happens at startup after sitting overnight, chances are it's valve stem seals and they're not cheap to replace. I'm not sure how much money I would invest in an N54 that has 185K miles on it, especially if you're still on the original turbos.

MTK24 · 08-19-2018, 03:36 PM

Hard to say without codes. Your turbos could be on their way out

am335i · 08-19-2018, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJtoad

If it only happens at startup after sitting overnight, chances are it's valve stem seals and they're not cheap to replace. I'm not sure how much money I would invest in an N54 that has 185K miles on it, especially if you're still on the original turbos.

Thanks! Yup still on the original turbos, at this point i'm hopeful i can still drive until 200k before it quits on me. Sad because the car is like new both inside and out, no dings or scratches and smooth clean paint.

arkie6 · 08-19-2018, 10:41 PM

That looks like oil burning smoke. Oil = light blue smoke. Fuel = black smoke. Water = white smoke/vapor.

Valve guide seals are a possibility. They will also tend to cause blue smoke when you are decelerating down a hill (causes high engine vacuum that tends to pull the oil down the value stems) and then when you get back on the throttle at the bottom of the hill you will get a puff of blue smoke. If you have a long hill nearby you might get a friend or family member to follow you in another vehicle and note what they see when you are driving (or get video).

ferocity02 · 08-19-2018, 10:41 PM

Valve stems, I don't think leaking turbos would burn smoke that instantly on a cold start.

arkie6 · 08-20-2018, 06:40 AM

There are ways to change valve guide seals without removing the head. This generally requires the following: put piston at top dead center, apply compressed air to spark plug hole to hold valves up, use special tool to remove valve spring retainer clips, replace rubber stem seals. If it does look like it is the valve stem seals leaking, you might check with some independent BMW shops about replacement. With experience and the right tools, it shouldn't take more than half a day to replace the seals. And I doubt the seals are that expensive.

mecheng77 · 08-20-2018, 09:04 AM

I had the exact problem on my Volvo and it was not worth replacing valve guide seals. I tried this and it works. It reguivinates the hard rubber

ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B000NVW1LM/..._TNSEBb0KG68JT

am335i · 08-20-2018, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

I had the exact problem on my Volvo and it was not worth replacing valve guide seals. I tried this and it works. It reguivinates the hard rubber

ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B000NVW1LM/..._TNSEBb0KG68JT

Thanks! Going to try this, nothing to lose at this point but if it works on my car it will be huge win.

The consensus seems to be the valve stems, thanks to everyone that chimed in.

mecheng77 · 08-20-2018, 03:44 PM

Post back after you try it

Pladi · 08-20-2018, 04:06 PM

Valve seals leak is visible during closed throttle. So if u see this smoke during deacceleration at higher rpm its not ur turbo. If you dont see this smoke during the drive under throttle closure then its probably ur turbo seals..

am335i · 09-03-2018, 12:47 PM

no luck with the atp250, still smokey

mecheng77 · 09-06-2018, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by am335i

no luck with the atp250, still smokey

You have to drive for x amount of miles for it to work.

am335i · 09-24-2018, 11:55 PM

So I found its my coolant that was causing the Smokey startups. I tried this bar’s leak product and well it didn’t help and found this under the hood with a small puddle of coolant on the ground after a 44mile, 1hr commute. Radiator or hoses? If it’s a big project time to put this car down as I’m not very handy nor have the time to learn and work on it.

Ps it doesn’t smoke anymore lol

am335i · 09-25-2018, 12:05 AM

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View post on imgur.com

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Quote:

Originally Posted by am335i

So I found its my coolant that was causing the Smokey startups. I tried this bar's leak product and well it didn't help and found this under the hood with a small puddle of coolant on the ground after a 44mile, 1hr commute. Radiator or hoses? If it's a big project time to put this car down as I'm not very handy nor have the time to learn and work on it.

bluewater328 · 09-25-2018, 01:32 AM

Without doing a proper pressure test theres no way to know for sure, but I tell you that area is a common failure near that plastic joint. For me, ended up being just that thin reservoir line with similar effected spray area. Sorry no pics as I rinsed it with distilled water as soon as I could.
Hope that's it because frankly its one of the easiest to replace.

You could probably start there but be sure to check codes so you know that your pump/thermostat didn't or isn't about to die. Then a good pressure test to confirm.

No other spray areas? If so you might be lucky.

Bimmer_Engineer · 02-03-2019, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

I had the exact problem on my Volvo and it was not worth replacing valve guide seals. I tried this and it works. It reguivinates the hard rubber

ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B000NVW1LM/..._TNSEBb0KG68JT

How long did it last for the Volvo? I left mine parked for a few days and when I started it up it was Smokey for a few mins...

mecheng77 · 02-04-2019, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bimmer_Engineer

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

I had the exact problem on my Volvo and it was not worth replacing valve guide seals. I tried this and it works. It reguivinates the hard rubber

ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B000NVW1LM/..._TNSEBb0KG68JT

How long did it last for the Volvo? I left mine parked for a few days and when I started it up it was Smokey for a few mins...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bimmer_Engineer

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

I had the exact problem on my Volvo and it was not worth replacing valve guide seals. I tried this and it works. It reguivinates the hard rubber

ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B000NVW1LM/..._TNSEBb0KG68JT

How long did it last for the Volvo? I left mine parked for a few days and when I started it up it was Smokey for a few mins...

I kept the car 2yrs after and it was still running strong.

Bimmer_Engineer · 03-01-2019, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

I kept the car 2yrs after and it was still running strong.

Any idea how long you should leave this in the oil? I was surprised at how thin the product was. There’s not a lot in there but it definitely would have an effect on the viscosity of the oil...

mecheng77 · 03-02-2019, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bimmer_Engineer

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

I kept the car 2yrs after and it was still running strong.

Any idea how long you should leave this in the oil? I was surprised at how thin the product was. There’s not a lot in there but it definitely would have an effect on the viscosity of the oil...

Until your next oil change, the longer the better it needs time and heat to work with some long drives

Bimmer_Engineer · 06-01-2019, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mecheng77

Until your next oil change, the longer the better it needs time and heat to work with some long drives

Well it looks like its worked...the Smokey start ups have virtually disappeared...I still used a quart in 750 miles though with no visible leaks. I’ve got an external pcv kit that I’m going to install in a few weeks...

Bimmer_Engineer · 02-07-2020, 01:35 PM

So I've made it almost a year with much reduced oil usage and virtually no oil smoking...so the AT205 seems to have worked. Question now is do I add it to my next oil change as well? I've been running it since March of last year...about 2,000 miles driven...

08-18-2018, 09:01 AM	#1
am335i New Member 5 Rep 24 Posts Drives: 2008 335i Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Sac iTrader: (0)	Smokey start up Hi Everyone, Looking to see if anyone can provide any feedback on this issue that i'm having. So everyone morning at startup i notice heavy white smoke coming out of my exhaust and this only happens in the morning, assuming whatever is burning collects overnight. Looking to see what your thoughts on this may be? I do have a coolant leak somewhere but its doesn't seem to be a lot as i can go almost 2 1/2 months before i get low coolant warning. I was told it was the expansion tank that was the cause of the leak, repaired and looks like it wasn't the cause. Being told it could be the radiator or hoses. Not sure i want to move forward with the repairs just yet. ($2k-2500k) Also water pump was replaced at about 120k miles, i'm at 185k now. I also have a minor oil housing gasket leak, i put in maybe a quart of oil in every 2 months or so. I've had this replaced it seems every few years, guess its a known issue. With these two leaks, i never see it on the ground so i'm guessing its entering the engine and then burns off? I did have all 6 fuel injectors replaced in Jan 2018 and i started noticing the smoke about a month later. The dealer replaced the injectors and they scanned the car and found no faults so they are saying its not the injectors. At this point, after owning the car for 11 years, 185k miles am i just better off driving the car until it dies? Or would it be worth spending say $3k on fixing the above items, hope that solves the smoke issue and the car runs fine thereafter? Or sell the car for hmmm maybe $5k kbb says its worth? Right now its my daily commuter to work which is 90miles round trip. Suggestions, feedback, comments most welcome!!
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08-19-2018, 08:41 AM	#2
DJtoad Captain 58 Rep 665 Posts Drives: 2010 535i M Sport Join Date: May 2008 Location: Ellicott City, MD iTrader: (2)	If it only happens at startup after sitting overnight, chances are it's valve stem seals and they're not cheap to replace. I'm not sure how much money I would invest in an N54 that has 185K miles on it, especially if you're still on the original turbos. __________________ 2010 535i M Sport - Platinum Gray/Dakota Black/Anthracite Bamboo 2016 Jaguar F-Type S AWD - Polar White/Cirrus
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08-19-2018, 03:36 PM	#3
MTK24 Lieutenant 485 Rep 599 Posts Drives: 2011 335I X Drive Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Seattle iTrader: (0)	Hard to say without codes. Your turbos could be on their way out __________________ Vermillion Red
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08-19-2018, 10:41 PM	#5
arkie6 Lieutenant 397 Rep 433 Posts Drives: 2008 BMW 335i sedan Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Russellville, AR iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 BMW 335i [0.00]	That looks like oil burning smoke. Oil = light blue smoke. Fuel = black smoke. Water = white smoke/vapor. Valve guide seals are a possibility. They will also tend to cause blue smoke when you are decelerating down a hill (causes high engine vacuum that tends to pull the oil down the value stems) and then when you get back on the throttle at the bottom of the hill you will get a puff of blue smoke. If you have a long hill nearby you might get a friend or family member to follow you in another vehicle and note what they see when you are driving (or get video). Last edited by arkie6; 08-19-2018 at 10:46 PM..
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08-19-2018, 10:41 PM	#6
ferocity02 Colonel 530 Rep 2,083 Posts Drives: 2013 135is Join Date: May 2014 Location: USA iTrader: (8)	Valve stems, I don't think leaking turbos would burn smoke that instantly on a cold start.
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08-20-2018, 06:40 AM	#7
arkie6 Lieutenant 397 Rep 433 Posts Drives: 2008 BMW 335i sedan Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Russellville, AR iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 BMW 335i [0.00]	There are ways to change valve guide seals without removing the head. This generally requires the following: put piston at top dead center, apply compressed air to spark plug hole to hold valves up, use special tool to remove valve spring retainer clips, replace rubber stem seals. If it does look like it is the valve stem seals leaking, you might check with some independent BMW shops about replacement. With experience and the right tools, it shouldn't take more than half a day to replace the seals. And I doubt the seals are that expensive.
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08-20-2018, 09:04 AM	#8
mecheng77 Colonel 1006 Rep 2,243 Posts Drives: 2007 328i / 2014 M235i Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Ontario Canada iTrader: (0) Garage List [0.00] [0.00]	I had the exact problem on my Volvo and it was not worth replacing valve guide seals. I tried this and it works. It reguivinates the hard rubber ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B000NVW1LM/..._TNSEBb0KG68JT
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08-20-2018, 03:44 PM	#10
mecheng77 Colonel 1006 Rep 2,243 Posts Drives: 2007 328i / 2014 M235i Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Ontario Canada iTrader: (0) Garage List [0.00] [0.00]	Post back after you try it
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08-20-2018, 04:06 PM	#11
Pladi Lieutenant Colonel 718 Rep 1,753 Posts Drives: 2011 335i xdrive Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Waterloo, ON Canada iTrader: (0)	Valve seals leak is visible during closed throttle. So if u see this smoke during deacceleration at higher rpm its not ur turbo. If you dont see this smoke during the drive under throttle closure then its probably ur turbo seals..
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09-03-2018, 12:47 PM	#12
am335i New Member 5 Rep 24 Posts Drives: 2008 335i Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Sac iTrader: (0)	no luck with the atp250, still smokey
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09-24-2018, 11:55 PM	#14
am335i New Member 5 Rep 24 Posts Drives: 2008 335i Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Sac iTrader: (0)	So I found its my coolant that was causing the Smokey startups. I tried this bar’s leak product and well it didn’t help and found this under the hood with a small puddle of coolant on the ground after a 44mile, 1hr commute. Radiator or hoses? If it’s a big project time to put this car down as I’m not very handy nor have the time to learn and work on it. Ps it doesn’t smoke anymore lol Last edited by am335i; 09-25-2018 at 12:17 AM..
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09-25-2018, 01:32 AM	#16
bluewater328 Colonel 626 Rep 2,100 Posts Drives: 2011 bluewater 328i LCI sedan Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Hawaii iTrader: (0)	Without doing a proper pressure test theres no way to know for sure, but I tell you that area is a common failure near that plastic joint. For me, ended up being just that thin reservoir line with similar effected spray area. Sorry no pics as I rinsed it with distilled water as soon as I could. Hope that's it because frankly its one of the easiest to replace. You could probably start there but be sure to check codes so you know that your pump/thermostat didn't or isn't about to die. Then a good pressure test to confirm. No other spray areas? If so you might be lucky.
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02-07-2020, 01:35 PM	#22
Bimmer_Engineer Lieutenant Colonel 1044 Rep 1,667 Posts Drives: 2007 335i Join Date: May 2018 Location: Louisiana iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 Porsche Boxster [0.00] 2016 Mercedes Benz ... [0.00] 2007 BMW 335i [9.50]	So I've made it almost a year with much reduced oil usage and virtually no oil smoking...so the AT205 seems to have worked. Question now is do I add it to my next oil change as well? I've been running it since March of last year...about 2,000 miles driven...
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