[Yotaismygame]

Here in Oregon we don't really have E85 stations. The nearest one to me is 40 minutes away which is 1 of 10 from what I can gather. But the other day i saw an ad on FB for barrels of E85. Which got me thinking I would love to run the e85 maps on occasion that MHD provides.

Doing some research it seems I should upgrade my LPFP which is fine since I'm still on the original one @ 57k. I was thinking the Fuel it stage 2 DIY would be good. Now what I'm really wondering is should I just mix it and go, or should I spend the money and add in a Flex fuel sensor and the Motive Box for MHD? Sure would be nice to just pump in some E85 in my garage and go. But looking at the cost of all the parts and the install is it worth it?

[Vivek.]

I may be biased since my ST car has Motiv Flex Fuel but I think it's definitely worth it--it is the 'do it once, do it right' way to go E85, IMO. Can't imagine having to estimate mixtures (this is hard because E85 is NOT spec'd as 85% ethanol, US spec is 51% to 83%), trying to run the tank as low as possible to get it all out, etc etc etc.

One thing to keep in mind is that E85 is unavoidably hard on certain seals, like the o-ring around the in-tank fuel pump under the driver's side of the back seat. Regular use will necessitate replacement every 2 years or so

[Yotaismygame]

Originally Posted by Vivek.

I may be biased since my ST car has Motiv Flex Fuel but I think it's definitely worth it--it is the 'do it once, do it right' way to go E85, IMO. Can't imagine having to estimate mixtures (this is hard because E85 is NOT spec'd as 85% ethanol, US spec is 51% to 83%), trying to run the tank as low as possible to get it all out, etc etc etc.

One thing to keep in mind is that E85 is unavoidably hard on certain seals, like the o-ring around the in-tank fuel pump under the driver's side of the back seat. Regular use will necessitate replacement every 2 years or so

I would be running at most e60 mix. I believe that's what I read. Fuel system wont keep up past that. Read stock at best e30ish but some have been able to get away with e50. I would not being running this every tank, and I don't drive the car all that much.

I'd like to hear from guys who run it just by calculating the mix. The motive way sounds best, agreed.

[NoGuru]

I have ran FF for a couple years and now just run an E45 mix and will be tuned for Full E soon.
I have zero issues calculating the mix. I have a Fuel IT Bluetooth Ethanol sensor and with the phone app you can say (I have X amount of fuel in the tank, and current Ethanol reading is X, and I want to be at X or E60) it will tell you put 4.5 gallons of E and 6 gallons of 93 or whatever you have set.
The FF setup broke and Motive spent a year with me trying to get it working and never did.
That's my 2 cents. Defiantly worth going E.

[Emilime75]

I think the need for having FF is diminished if you're buying E by the barrel. The content will remain constant throughout that barrel, so you only need to measure it once and use simple calculators after that. Having a content reader in the car would be helpful, though.

[Yotaismygame]

Thanks for the opinions so far. Keep em coming.

Maybe I should grab a 55gal barrel @ $4.00/gal and start with just hand calculating. It's about $900 to upgrade the LPFP, short line kit, FF sensor, and the motive box. So I'd be looking at over a grand to run Flex fuel. Worth it?

[pysical]

The flex fuel sensor is worth it. You may get a barrel that is X %E85 and then you run a tune set for that content. Then you get another barrel that is now a different % and now you need another tune for it.

Or say you have 1/4th tank of 93 but want to fill it up with E85 of X %. Now you are dealing with different percentages and different tunes. I would get the Flex Fuel sensor by Motiv so you don't have to deal with any of that. Then you get one tune made and it will scale everything based on the %. As far as the fuel pump I would get a Precision Raceworks pump. It is a nice bucket setup and allows you to upgrade in the future.

[iqraceworks]

If you are going to buy a barrel of it, you should be able to test it with an ethanol tester, and figure out the ethanol in it. Unlike getting it from the pump, the e content of your drum of e85 should be consistent.

If it was me, I would just mix it and go from there.

On a side note, make sure you don't have any regulations or restrictions in your town/neighborhood/etc/etc about storing that much fuel in your garage or shop. Also, keep in mind that a drum of e85 is going to weight around 360lbs....so it's going to be a pain to load/unload/move that drum of fuel around when it's full.

Just some other things to think about.....

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by Yotaismygame

Thanks for the opinions so far. Keep em coming.

Maybe I should grab a 55gal barrel @ $4.00/gal and start with just hand calculating. It's about $900 to upgrade the LPFP, short line kit, FF sensor, and the motive box. So I'd be looking at over a grand to run Flex fuel. Worth it?

If it was me, I would spend that money on a bigger set of turbos that will get you the same amount of power or more on 91/93 fuel. Especially since you don't have e85 in your area.

[Luis561]

An ethanol tester is cheap. That's what I use to test if the e85 really is e85 at gas stations, it's $2.5 a gallon here in Florida sometimes it goes down to $1.75

Check out this diy

https://bmw135iblog.wordpress.com/20...-pump-upgrade/

I did it a year ago and it's been running great so far, total $ in supplies was around 150.
Having a bucket is a huge plus, you can run low gas to reduce weight and suffer no fuel starvation
At 50% capacity, I run an e50 mix of 3.733 gal of 93 and 4.267 gal of e85

[Luis561]

Originally Posted by Luis561

An ethanol tester is cheap. That's what I use to test if the e85 really is e85 at gas stations, it's $2.5 a gallon here in Florida sometimes it goes down to $1.75

Check out this diy

https://bmw135iblog.wordpress.com/20...-pump-upgrade/

I did it a year ago and it's been running great so far, total $ in supplies was around 150.
Having a bucket is a huge plus, you can run low gas to reduce weight and suffer no fuel starvation
At 50% capacity, I run an e50 mix of 3.733 gal of 93 and 4.267 gal of e85

Also your mpg will down to around 10 lol

[Ozzie335i]

For an e50 blend in my area (DFW), I divide the amount of gas needed by 12 as my mix is 7 parts e85 to 5 parts of 93 oct. Then multiply by 7 for the e85, with the rest 93. If I am at 1/4 of a tank it comes out perfectly to 7 gallons of e85, and 5 gallons of 93. Using my formula I am always within +/- a point or two of e50.

I don't care about MPG.

[iqraceworks]

Yep...mine went from 27mpg on the highway to 16mpg on an E50 tune. I don't really care about the mpg/cost....but it seems like I'm having to fill the car up all the time!

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

For an e50 blend in my area (DFW), I divide the amount of gas needed by 12 as my mix is 7 parts e85 to 5 parts of 93 oct. Then multiply by 7 for the e85, with the rest 93. If I am at 1/4 of a tank it comes out perfectly to 7 gallons of e85, and 5 gallons of 93. Using my formula I am always within +/- a point or two of e50.

I don't care about MPG.

I use the "E85 Blend" app on my phone....super easy to dial in the right mix every time.

[Yotaismygame]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

If it was me, I would spend that money on a bigger set of turbos that will get you the same amount of power or more on 91/93 fuel. Especially since you don't have e85 in your area.

Problem with that is I'm not sure how long im going to keep this car. Throwing aftermarket turbo's on it will only diminish the value and make it harder to sell. I've already put more into this car then I should have. If I decided I'm going to keep it for at least a few years I'll go single turbo. On the fence right now. Do I need two fun vehicles? This supplier claims each barrel is consistent. My thought was if people agreed I could get away without a sensor then upgrading the LPFP which probably needs done eventually anyways I could just grab a barrel and gain a little HP when I wanted.

[ky0u]

I've been wanting the flex fluel monitor. But so far I haven't had issues making do with a 5 gallon can, a manual test tube and just doing ratio calculations.

Luckily, California is fairly consistent with it's e85 content. so the test tube is a bit of a formality for me. I guess it's only in certain regions where the 51-83% thing is an issue.

If youre getting a whole ass barrel, you should be okay with a the manual tester tbh. You can usually find them for like $10-15

[NoGuru]

Originally Posted by pysical

The flex fuel sensor is worth it. You may get a barrel that is X %E85 and then you run a tune set for that content. Then you get another barrel that is now a different % and now you need another tune for it.

Or say you have 1/4th tank of 93 but want to fill it up with E85 of X %. Now you are dealing with different percentages and different tunes. I would get the Flex Fuel sensor by Motiv so you don't have to deal with any of that. Then you get one tune made and it will scale everything based on the %. As far as the fuel pump I would get a Precision Raceworks pump. It is a nice bucket setup and allows you to upgrade in the future.

That's not how it works. You don't adjust the tune, you adjust the fuel ratio.
I currently have an E45 tune, and I can run anywhere from E40 to E50 with no issues at all. Actually, you get about a 30% range depending on the tune.

Here are two screen shots from my phone. If I were in my car and connected it would say like, E46. Now when I pull up to the pump I can swipe to the side and get this screen that does that calc for me.

[Ozzie335i]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

I use the "E85 Blend" app on my phone....super easy to dial in the right mix every time.

I've got the app. Oops, I never did the slide sideways thing, thus working it harder than I needed to.

[Soden82]

I'm going through the same issue myself. E85 is about 30 miles from me but I do want to run more power more consistently. I'm planning to buy one or two 14 gallon Amazon containers and fill those up at the pump in my truck and bring them home to store in my garage.

My friends do something similar with a bunch of 6 gallon jugs.

I'm going to upgrade to at least a stage 2 LPFP, the fuel it Bluetooth sensor with lines, and the motiv flex fuel kit.

You'll also need a 3.5 bar map sensor for anything over 20psi.

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by Yotaismygame

Problem with that is I'm not sure how long im going to keep this car. Throwing aftermarket turbo's on it will only diminish the value and make it harder to sell. I've already put more into this car then I should have. If I decided I'm going to keep it for at least a few years I'll go single turbo. On the fence right now. Do I need two fun vehicles? This supplier claims each barrel is consistent. My thought was if people agreed I could get away without a sensor then upgrading the LPFP which probably needs done eventually anyways I could just grab a barrel and gain a little HP when I wanted.

Not sure I would agree with that unless your OEM turbos are very low mileage. A newer set of "quality" aftermarket turbos would definitely add value to the car.

But it's a good chunk of money, so if your going to sell the car it's probably not worth it.

[Yotaismygame]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

Not sure I would agree with that unless your OEM turbos are very low mileage. A newer set of "quality" aftermarket turbos would definitely add value to the car.

But it's a good chunk of money, so if your going to sell the car it's probably not worth it.

Car only has 57k on it. What happens when you modify a car past a certain point the group of people willing to buy such a car gets smaller. Thus making it harder to sell, thus in general lowering the value.

What sells easier a completely stock car or a highly modified car?

[Yotaismygame]

Not sure what I'm going to do as far as E85 is concerned. Probably just a grab a barrel and do some math for now. No hurry though. I have plenty of things to keep me occupied. It would make more sense to get inlet and outlets plus a custom tune but right now I'm tired of working on this car. Nice to just enjoy it for a moment.