[robnitro]

Positive pole to ground is not a good test, you're reading through loads, some have diodes etc. Some meters can read through diodes better than others, depending on how much output voltage they use. Just not a useful test...

Do you have corrosion on any injector nuts or the lines by the injector? If there was a grounded injector you would be getting less than 100kOhm to ground on a pin or both pins. A good injector is like 500kOhm and up.

Speaking of that, make sure your meter is in auto range or the proper range to read something like that... you can test the ohm meter by wetting your fingers and holding each probe metal... I just did it and got 240k ohm.

[rkstar9]

Originally Posted by robnitro

Positive pole to ground is not a good test, you're reading through loads, some have diodes etc. Some meters can read through diodes better than others, depending on how much output voltage they use. Just not a useful test...

Ok! that makes sense that's why the ohms jump around a lot.

Originally Posted by robnitro

Do you have corrosion on any injector nuts or the lines by the injector? If there was a grounded injector you would be getting less than 100kOhm to ground on a pin or both pins. A good injector is like 500kOhm and up.

There is for sure

This is injector 1

Originally Posted by robnitro

Speaking of that, make sure your meter is in auto range or the proper range to read something like that... you can test the ohm meter by wetting your fingers and holding each probe metal... I just did it and got 240k ohm.

Ok both set to auto range

This new meter seems slightly more accurate.




So Previous injector test was a fail because the particular alligator clips i used for it had intermittent issues.

Here are the proper readings:

Cyl 1 183.3​ Open loop to ground both pins
Cyl 2 181.4 Open loop to ground both pins
Cyl 3 181.6 Open loop to ground both pins
Cyl 4 181.3 Open loop to ground both pins
Cyl 5 178.5 and 2.3 ohms to ground from each pin
Cyl 6 181.1 Open loop to ground both pins


So it looks like Injector 6 is pretty much shorted? upon plugging in the probes it starts at 1.7 ohms and rises from there to 2.3 where it stabilizes. Both pins behave the same way.

That's pretty much whereabouts the electric arcing sound comes from too.

This sounds like it could be it.

Post related:

Originally Posted by torqueisking

Not sure how you're testing them but I suggest three resistance measurements per injector.

1) Pin 1 to Pin 2
2) Pin 1 to ground (metal casing of injector)
3) Pin 2 to ground (metal casing of injector)

I had an injector fail with almost a dead short from one of the pins (can't remember which one) to ground due to corrosion. The DDE current protection saved the injector drivers by shutting down the engine.

Found some metal shavings around the injector head. Not sure if they are from me, second injector does not have any.

[robnitro]

Whichever injector had that low a reading yeah, try unplugging it and cranking.. Actually I'm surprised you didn't get any injector codes (or a bank 2 inj code if the short is on the common wire).

You can start on 5 cylinders with the bad injector unplugged.. Just would get a code for that one.

As for inj 1, it tests good so probably just surface corrosion...

[rkstar9]

Originally Posted by robnitro

Whichever injector had that low a reading yeah, try unplugging it and cranking.. Actually I'm surprised you didn't get any injector codes (or a bank 2 inj code if the short is on the common wire).

You can start on 5 cylinders with the bad injector unplugged.. Just would get a code for that one.

As for inj 1, it tests good so probably just surface corrosion...

I would have to put the manifold back in correct? Or should I crank it as it sits?

Dreading putting the manifold back and then remove it again to install new injector.

would dielectic grease or even RTV silicone around corroded area be a good idea to keep rust away?

[robnitro]

I never started with manifold off but I think some have, with being sure to keep nothing loose by the ports that can go into the valves. Sorry I'm not sure maybe someone else has done it. Of course it will set off other codes for maf, etc.

[Mik325tds]

Some tuners hide injector codes - bad practice in my eyes. Ask your tuner if he does. A short injector should definitely be diagnosable.
As for starting without manifold on, I wouldn't do it. Yet, I don't have a good reason why not. Just wait for your new injector and do it then. While engines run on 5 cylinders, it isn't really liking it either.

[rkstar9]

Originally Posted by robnitro

I never started with manifold off but I think some have, with being sure to keep nothing loose by the ports that can go into the valves. Sorry I'm not sure maybe someone else has done it. Of course it will set off other codes for maf, etc.

Ill just secure 4 bolts just to start the car.

Originally Posted by Mik325tds

Some tuners hide injector codes - bad practice in my eyes. Ask your tuner if he does. A short injector should definitely be diagnosable.
As for starting without manifold on, I wouldn't do it. Yet, I don't have a good reason why not. Just wait for your new injector and do it then. While engines run on 5 cylinders, it isn't really liking it either.

Thanks for the suggestion. Not an Issue with DUDMD



--------------------

Pulled the injector looking like this:



The engine port also had a nice solid ring of ice around it.



So it turns out the injector now does not appear to be shorted from either pin and the pin to pin read outs are more consistent with the other ones. I checked it when i had just pulled it and it was still shorted, but 24 hours later after sitting indoors it test out good.

It's possible just needed to defrost.

I do ride with no engine cover on... just the rear foam. Which i think could be the culprit as it does not let water evaporate.








Broke one of the fuel llines Add 5 hours to the job.

[robnitro]

Still replace that injector. As soon as it's in a humid place or after cool down condensation, it will fail again. That's how some injectors pass at times and then just die out there.

[rkstar9]

Put the car back together today and when pressing unlock on my key fob heard the Arcing sound again. No bueno. For the first time without even cranking the car.

reinstalled with the same injector that is no longer shorted = No start
Unplugged said inejctor = no start and no codes for the injector either.
still not rpms when crankin, rail pressure valve activation values where working.

this code keeps coming back
0042E2 DDE: Changeover, rail pressure control

Pressure sensor is a common fault and has never showed fuel pressure. by that token Id go with that next.

Pressure regulating valve on the other hand is not a common fault, yet is most likely a culprit behind no rpms when cranking.

what ever it is appears to be shorted to ground.

the saga continues...

[rkstar9]

Installed pressure sensor from X5.
Installed new pressure regulator.

X5 cranked a lot longer than the 335, Suspect something electrical is messed up.

So basically none of the codes ISTA has provided until now have been accurate.

[rkstar9]

Changed the ground strap / no change

getting 2 new codes

0093b2 dsc traction control no comunication with module (unable to clear code)
0093FB No Message (vehicle speed)from DSC. ACSM receiver/mrs5, DSC transmitter.


Ran ISTA test for DSC module = DSC comunication OK! says ISTA

so i go to unplug the DSC module and the wipers come on full speed and I cannot turn them off.

this has happened 3 times now. where the wipers will only come off if i remove the key from the ignition.

Something somewhere must be shorted out.

[Mik325tds]

Originally Posted by rkstar9

Changed the ground strap / no change

getting 2 new codes

0093b2 dsc traction control no comunication with module (unable to clear code)
0093FB No Message (vehicle speed)from DSC. ACSM receiver/mrs5, DSC transmitter.


Ran ISTA test for DSC module = DSC comunication OK! says ISTA

so i go to unplug the DSC module and the wipers come on full speed and I cannot turn them off.

this has happened 3 times now. where the wipers will only come off if i remove the key from the ignition.

Something somewhere must be shorted out.

No this is normal. DSC doesn't boot up as fast as DDE and other modules after disconnect, so other modules set a no comm fault against it. When you unplug the DSC, the wiper signals are missing from the steering column module. It acts as a gateway for the SCM. As a safety measure, wipers come on.

Keep looking for missing crankshaft signals. Have you tried unplugging that from your X5?
Also exchange maybe the Glowplug module from the x5 to the 335d. It does heat up the engine a bit when you open the doors or the car wakes up so it doesn't take so long when you crank.

[rkstar9]

Originally Posted by Mik325tds

No this is normal. DSC doesn't boot up as fast as DDE and other modules after disconnect, so other modules set a no comm fault against it. When you unplug the DSC, the wiper signals are missing from the steering column module. It acts as a gateway for the SCM. As a safety measure, wipers come on.

Keep looking for missing crankshaft signals. Have you tried unplugging that from your X5?
Also exchange maybe the Glowplug module from the x5 to the 335d. It does heat up the engine a bit when you open the doors or the car wakes up so it doesn't take so long when you crank.

Thanks for that explanation, that makes sense.

Well before going into that things have gone in a different direction now, noticed relay 30G gets up to 90 degrees shortly after unlocking the car. (per infrared thermometer)



Not being sure if this is normal I removed the relay and ran the following test:

with ecu unpluged, terminal B+ removed (starter alternator positive cable), and almost every electronic in the engine compartment disconnected.

Multimiter ohm tested junction box electronics terminal 30g (positive feed ) port to ground.
Got 0.0 ohms..increasing to 0.2 ohms.

No way the ground and positive terminals can have so little resistance.


So the entire car is shorted to ground somehwere, even after removing frm.


Next, with battery positive terminal connected to car, I plugged in a 12 v strip light between negative terminal on battery and negative battery cable from car.

The strip light lights up, not fully bright but about 80% capacity.

According to the internet, this is conclusive evidence the car is shorted. Esp with all the things I have disconnected.

I proceeded to remove every fuse one by one and the LED light did not go off.

Meaning the short is not caused by a component, rather most likely a wire harness or the junction box electronics itself.

....... should get it off today....

a thermal camera sure would come in handy right about now..

Update:

Good news is that battery to Junction box wire is not shorted, and neither is the Junction box itself.

I have identified the following plug as the culprit



Each one of the pins is pulling voltage,

For some ungodly reason TIS does not have fuse pin out so I am using an external resource here (https://imgvehicle.com/bmw/e90/fuse-box)



The shorted pins are identified as:

82 DSC, driver, pass seat adjustment
81 Door module/ body gateway
86 electronic ride height control/ rain headlight sensor
84 electronic ride height control/ rain headlight sensor

HMMM insteresting! removing the fuses did nothing because the entire circuit is shorted.

finally getting somewhere...Suspect harness to those units is at fault...time for some wiggle testing.

[rkstar9]

Traced the source of the short to the FRM, (what i had disconnected before was the control module for the junction box)

Only connector that ended the short was the one coming from the junction box. All other connectors did not.

I proceeded to test all the pins on the cable coming from the junction box after removing FRM and did not find any shorts.

Took the FRM apart and there appears to be nothing wrong visually.




OHM testing pin 1 to other pins shows 1 ohm of resistance I presume this to be a short circuit.

So I think this is the culprit right Here.

[Mik325tds]

Originally Posted by rkstar9

Thanks for that explanation, that makes sense.

Well before going into that things have gone in a different direction now, noticed relay 30G gets up to 90 degrees shortly after unlocking the car. (per infrared thermometer).

Wow, that is some smart testing. Kudos!
If it is your FRM being short, wouldn't you be able to see some pretty big amps going through one of the 3 feeds?
Me still thinks it is the glow plugs / or glow plug module, but a main B+ cable rubbing on the frames also sounds feasible.

[robnitro]

It's not a short circuit. A meter will read any reasonable load as a very low resistance. Your light bulb test 80% brightness shows it's not the full draw even of that bulb which is a few amps max.

Try the same test with the battery and bulb on the x5 and you will see the same and that's not a legit test for grounding.

As for the relay, a bad relay can create a huge voltage drop. With things switched on, your battery let's say was 10 volts, if at the front you were getting 7volts than yes the relay could have a bad contact (voltage drop). Can you measure voltage at the dde and compare it to the battery terminals to verify if it's good or not?

[rkstar9]

Originally Posted by Mik325tds

Wow, that is some smart testing. Kudos!
If it is your FRM being short, wouldn't you be able to see some pretty big amps going through one of the 3 feeds?
Me still thinks it is the glow plugs / or glow plug module, but a main B+ cable rubbing on the frames also sounds feasible.

That's what does not fit here, the relay heating up could be normal operation. The FRM drawing amps could as well.

Read that when the FRM senses a number of shorts in the system (such as by maybe the previously shorted injector) it shuts down to prevent a fire and prevents the car from starting. It's possible the amp draw I am registering is that safety system telling the rest of the car not to wake up.

To add on evidence to your glow plug module theory here is a video attempting to start the car with FRM disconnected.
listen for arcing sound still present from engine compartment.

Originally Posted by robnitro

It's not a short circuit. A meter will read any reasonable load as a very low resistance. Your light bulb test 80% brightness shows it's not the full draw even of that bulb which is a few amps max.

Try the same test with the battery and bulb on the x5 and you will see the same and that's not a legit test for grounding.

Agree that its not much of a short if it is one at all.
I think what the test proves is that the FRM module is the only component drawing electricity consistently.

To make sure there where no other components interfering I removed the junction box and when everything was disconnected the 12v test light went off. This is how I know only the FRM is the culprit. Then later leaving the frm cables plugged into the junction box only...the test light came back on and only went off after disconnecting the FRM itself at the driver side. Disconnecting the additional connections to other components from FRM did not cause the test light to go off. So from that I conclude that the frm is the only component leaking voltage to ground.

It would be quite difficult to duplicate the same test on the x5 because everything needs to be disconnected to ensure nothing else is drawing electricity. Junction box would probably have to be removed as well.

Or I would just have to remove the FRM on x5 and test the leads in the back to see if they leak the same amount of resistance. Hearing how delicate FRM's are id say it's a risky proposition.

Originally Posted by robnitro

As for the relay, a bad relay can create a huge voltage drop. With things switched on, your battery let's say was 10 volts, if at the front you were getting 7volts than yes the relay could have a bad contact (voltage drop). Can you measure voltage at the dde and compare it to the battery terminals to verify if it's good or not?

Voltage readings:
With FRM removed:
Battery positive to battery negative = 12.72
Engine GND to pin 6 on ECU power plug with accessory on =12.57
attempted start =11.02

With FRM connected:
Battery positive to battery negative = 12.28
Engine GND to pin 6 on ECU power plug with accessory on =11.08
attempted start =11.08 (car did not crank possibly need to reset codes, but arcing sound was present.)


EDIT:
Here is another clue from yesterday.
I attempted to start the car not realizing the DDE was completely disconnected, (and the frm too), the wiper blades came on again. What the hell, I thought the FRM needs to be connected for that???

Ok I think it's time for the glow plug module to get pulled for inspection....Going to start the car without it..see If we get any arcing.

[rkstar9]

I removed glow plug module and disconnected glow plugs still arcing.

Then removed every injector connector and arcing went away.

connecting injector 1 only produces the following modified arcing sound. This time when accessory is on. Not when cranking the car.

Took multiple videos to see if i could get closer to the sound.

DDE has some screws half way threaded, it appears it has been opened. I do not see any sealant. Can I open the ECU? maybe I can look for a spark when it's open.


I also tested injector wiring pin 1 and 2 from injector to ecu = 0 ohms.

Testing each injector pin to ground shows they have open loop to ground. So they are not shorting.

[robnitro]

An injector can be shorted internally, not to ground and kill the power from the ecu.
Can you try to crank/start with the offending injector unplugged?

The ecu was probably opened to do the tune.

[rkstar9]

Originally Posted by robnitro

An injector can be shorted internally, not to ground and kill the power from the ecu.
Can you try to crank/start with the offending injector unplugged?

The ecu was probably opened to do the tune.

Car wont start anymore lol
The following faults are now present and unable to be cleared:










This screen looks quite useful helps you find where the short is, I tried unpluging frm and terminal 30g. Status did not change.



So basically every component on the line bus is showing codes.

[rkstar9]

After spending 3 hours tracing every LIN bus pin and testing to verify they are not shorted. I Decided to continue to trace the arcing sound since essentially ISTA is crazy and all the codes so far have been complete bull ****.


with the manifold removed the sound seems to come from ...the effin starter.

At this point Im almost certain I messed up the connection when I installed the ckp sensor.

So I pull it out and look at this piece of work:

Ohm test

Sometimes it would show 0.0 ohms.

[Mik325tds]

Originally Posted by rkstar9

I removed glow plug module and disconnected glow plugs still arcing.

Then removed every injector connector and arcing went away.

Okay, I'm convinced now that the glow plug module / glow plugs is not your problem. Sorry. Did you plug the module back in when you got your LIN bus fault? Sometimes the glow plug module itself would cause the LIN bus fault when it goes bad.