[Wingnutts]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

Simple answer: Install the front M3 arms. Get the car alligned at a good shop. Drive it.

No need to overthink this.

Don't overthink???

If I'm going to go lay on my garage floor for a day, I'm overthinking everything. I can only get up so many times.

[bbnks2]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

Alright, this took a turn that I didn't think it would. I always enjoy the opportunity to learn something new and everyone's input has been appreciated. But if I can maybe slow this down a bit though.


I liked the idea of upgrading the arms to the m3 arms since I thought it would be as simple as swapping them and then just dropping it off at the alignment shop and telling them what specs to use. I used to have an e46 m3, so the idea of my 335i handling a little more like the m3 seemed like a great idea. The last thing I want to do is have to deal with any issues and return trips to the shop.


So let me try and present my original question in a different way. With what Bbnks2 posted "The only thing that changes is front camber... You might have 1* of camber up front. Maybe more if you're lowered. That's it.

Front camber is not adjustable. It will be whatever it is and alignment tech isn't going to touch it.

There is not much different at all about an M3 and a 335i alignment... except the camber won't show red since M3 comes with camber in stock form.

Toe spec between both cars is pretty much the same range... M3 calls for .02-.15* toe-in up front. 335i calls for .05-.20* toe-in (more stability for a street oriented car). Same thing out back... M3 calls for
.04-.13* toe-in out back... 335i calls for .1-.2*. These are just ranges...
This to me sounds like a simple bolt on procedure and standard 335i alignment but with the m3 toe in specs (which are almost the same as the 335i).

Is this the simple answer? As for the camber, from what I have read here and elsewhere, it doesn't seem too hard, but not really worth it.

Thoughts?

Yes, it is simple. You must get re-aligned after the install. No you don't need to use any M3 alignment settings. They are just sportier settings. The thread you are referencing is an install error or something unrelated. The M3 arms are not going to magically cause any issues. Just torque them AT RIDE HEIGHT so the bushings are loaded properly.

[Wingnutts]

Well, I went back to fcpeuro this morning to order and they jumped the price since my first post in this thread to $724.77 before tax. With tax it's now $768.25. So it is essentially a $100 price increase. I called and asked if they would grandfather the price, but they only offered a $20 coupon for today only. So that great deal is now gone. Yes they have a lifetime warranty, but the last set of arms lasted 9 years and I don't expect to have this car in 9 years.

I spent some time looking around the web and the best I can find now is oem bimmerparts. You can buy the fronts as a kit and then the rears individually. They are all TRW parts. The only things not included is the headlight adjustment rod and the abs cable bracket. Shipped price is $659.40. I pulled the trigger.

Hopefully that helps someone.

[bbnks2]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

Well, I went back to fcpeuro this morning to order and they jumped the price since my first post in this thread to $724.77 before tax. With tax it's now $768.25. So it is essentially a $100 price increase. I called and asked if they would grandfather the price, but they only offered a $20 coupon for today only. So that great deal is now gone. Yes they have a lifetime warranty, but the last set of arms lasted 9 years and I don't expect to have this car in 9 years.

I spent some time looking around the web and the best I can find now is oem bimmerparts. You can buy the fronts as a kit and then the rears individually. They are all TRW parts. The only things not included is the headlight adjustment rod and the abs cable bracket. Shipped price is $659.40. I pulled the trigger.

Hopefully that helps someone.

You can get the arms on amazon for even cheaper if you know all the TRW numbers.

[Wingnutts]

Originally Posted by bbnks2

You can get the arms on amazon for even cheaper if you know all the TRW numbers.

I was there as well but I was getting a different result??? I literally started an excel spread sheet and used all of the part numbers listed on the fcpeuro site. From there I looked up all 8 parts numbers and made columns for each vendor and finished up with tax and shipping. The amazon pricing was close to oem bimmerparts, but they were tax free and offered free shipping. Maybe someone else can benefit though!

Update. 5-7 business day free shipping is arriving tomorrow. I'm liking this site even more now.

[hellokitty]

A few tips:

Add the item to the cart from FCP Euro and wait for a 5% off coupon code for "don't forget this item in your cart."

I would install aluminum monoballs to the front M3 arms before installation. They make a pretty huge difference compared to just doing the M3 arms because of the giant piece of rubber on the front arms. One thing to keep in mind is the M3 arms will require more arm strength for low speed turns. My monoballs helped return the steering effort back to normal.

[bbnks2]

Originally Posted by hellokitty

A few tips:

Add the item to the cart from FCP Euro and wait for a 5% off coupon code for "don't forget this item in your cart."

I would install aluminum monoballs to the front M3 arms before installation. They make a pretty huge difference compared to just doing the M3 arms because of the giant piece of rubber on the front arms. One thing to keep in mind is the M3 arms will require more arm strength for low speed turns. My monoballs helped return the steering effort back to normal.

Can you link to the ones you bought? I know Turner makes some but they are like $400 so I skipped considering doing that swap lol.

[hellokitty]

Originally Posted by bbnks2

Can you link to the ones you bought? I know Turner makes some but they are like $400 so I skipped considering doing that swap lol.

https://www.akgmotorsport.com/produc...0-e92-e93-e82/

[Wingnutts]

The m3 arms are now in front and rear. Hardest part of the job is torquing the nuts at right height, but easy job overall for those who are considering this upgrade.

I put the new summer tires on my 313's as well. 235 35 19 front and 275 30 19 Firestone Indy 500's. Alignment is scheduled for Monday.

I took it around the block a few times today and it is absolutely horrible. The steering is loose and it's all over the place. No rubbing with the slightly larger size though, but I wasn't expecting any after researching them. Monday can't come fast enough now to get everything dialed in.

[The Nightman]

Your front toe is out to lunch with the M3 wishbones. Post back with your before and after alignment

[Wingnutts]

Originally Posted by freedomfries

Your front toe is out to lunch with the M3 wishbones. Post back with your before and after alignment

Alignment is done and I don't have any numbers... I asked for before and after, but their printer is apparently not working. They said I could stop back next week after they get it fixed and they'll put it on the rack again for me. I'm a little annoyed, but they have always taken good care of me in the past with all of my vehicles.

First impressions, the steering does not feel any tighter than before. I almost want to say it's a little lighter. The quickness of how fast it turns now is incredibly faster now. There is no sneezing on the highway now for sure. I took the long way home to find some twisty roads and the difference is nice. So for now I'm pleased, but until I get some number to look at, I really don't know if it can get any better.

[NoGuru]

Following.

[CALWATERBOY]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

First impressions, the steering does not feel any tighter than before. I almost want to say it's a little lighter. The quickness of how fast it turns now is incredibly faster now. There is no sneezing on the highway now for sure. I took the long way home to find some twisty roads and the difference is nice. So for now I'm pleased, but until I get some number to look at, I really don't know if it can get any better.

Well, have some experience with this -- recommend:

• Install Koni Special Reds or Koni Yellows + Eibach Linear Springs. For the last, consult a knowledgeable shop such as Ground Control or HP Autosports for desired spring & damper rates. How old are your dampers? Stock suspension = compromise for rft's. Not good.
  
• Install M3 front sway bar.
  
• Install M3 rear subframe bushings.

That'll tighten yer nuts laddie! Do NOT install M3 rear sway w/o LSD - you'll be sorry if ya do.

Consider M3 rear camber arm which betcha you have not installed - if you go that route you'll need longer toe arms too, and an adjustment noted in the link above. That install will allow you to dial in radical camber for superb handling and premature tire wear. Ah, well, you play, you pay.

'Course can't realize truly excellent handling w/o more front camber, for which you'll need plates.

LSD will add magic to your ride....

Sound expensive? Yep. Promising more than it delivers? Nope! You'll like the result.





.

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by Wingnutts

Alignment is done and I don't have any numbers... I asked for before and after, but their printer is apparently not working. They said I could stop back next week after they get it fixed and they'll put it on the rack again for me. I'm a little annoyed, but they have always taken good care of me in the past with all of my vehicles.

First impressions, the steering does not feel any tighter than before. I almost want to say it's a little lighter. The quickness of how fast it turns now is incredibly faster now. There is no sneezing on the highway now for sure. I took the long way home to find some twisty roads and the difference is nice. So for now I'm pleased, but until I get some number to look at, I really don't know if it can get any better.

This could be a function of toe is less than it was before you did the M arms. The toe before and after on this alignment is meaningless b/c the arms really mess with toe.

For the sake of anyone reading this who is getting ready to do the M arms, just turn the tie rod on each side out about 3 1/2 turns. This will get the car to where it's at least safe to drive to get an alignment.

[Wingnutts]

I tried to get the numbers for the alignment yesterday after work, but the rack was not available.. The temps are dropping back down to below freezing temps so I had to put the winter tires back on for now. So when it gets warmer and I can put the firestones back on, I'll get it back for the numbers and I'll post them here. Until then.......

[cvc 22349a]

Originally Posted by hellokitty

A few tips:

Add the item to the cart from FCP Euro and wait for a 5% off coupon code for "don't forget this item in your cart."

I would install aluminum monoballs to the front M3 arms before installation. They make a pretty huge difference compared to just doing the M3 arms because of the giant piece of rubber on the front arms. One thing to keep in mind is the M3 arms will require more arm strength for low speed turns. My monoballs helped return the steering effort back to normal.

Really? That's been my complaint about the M3 tension struts. An alignment with more camber and less toe in has helped but I'd love to reduce slow speed steering wheel effort. Any downsides? Looks like they're listed as a racing, track product.

[hellokitty]

Originally Posted by cvc 22349a

Really? That's been my complaint about the M3 tension struts. An alignment with more camber and less toe in has helped but I'd love to reduce slow speed steering wheel effort. Any downsides? Looks like they're listed as a racing, track product.

I've done pretty much everything AKG designated as "track" parts. IMO, just because it is considered a track only product doesn't mean your car is going to feel like a hardcore race car after the mod in terms of addition of NVH.

The aluminum diff bushings added the most noise but nothing I can't live with. The monoballs on the other hand make things much more precise in terms of steering. Very little input needed after the change to make the car steer.

lol at peeps being scared of an itty bitty alignment pin. Why anyone would spend an entire day out in the garage and almost a grand on suspension bits, with the goal being to increase camber, but not take ~10 min to remove the stock pin (while you're already in the there anyway) is beyond me.

[rothwem]

Originally Posted by FCobra94

lol at peeps being scared of an itty bitty alignment pin. Why anyone would spend an entire day out in the garage and almost a grand on suspension bits, with the goal being to increase camber, but not take ~10 min to remove the stock pin (while you're already in the there anyway) is beyond me.

Its way cooler to tell people you have M3 parts on your car than to tell people you pulled the alignment pins. I mean, is it really a mod if you don't spend a bunch of money on it?

[hellokitty]

Originally Posted by rothwem

Its way cooler to tell people you have M3 parts on your car than to tell people you pulled the alignment pins. I mean, is it really a mod if you don't spend a bunch of money on it?

In my case, the alignment pin was broken lol

Regardless, I would suggest camber plates even if running moderate camber. Your alignment tech will thank you for it. It was difficult to dial-in my alignment before camber plates.

Originally Posted by hellokitty

It was difficult to dial-in my alignment before camber plates.

How so?

[hellokitty]

Originally Posted by FCobra94

How so?

My car is slammed lol