E90Post
 


GetBMWParts
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > Proper Way to Jack BMW and my Prototype Jack Pads



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-05-2018, 10:55 AM   #23
mecheng77
Lieutenant
mecheng77's Avatar
117
Rep
553
Posts

Drives: 2007 328i JBlk , Volvo S70 T5
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Ontario Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Engineer View Post
So I drove all over town measuring floor jacks today trying to find one that is low enough to reach the front jacking point, 4" clearance by my measurements, to no avail. I have two jacks that each measure about 5 1/2" so a 2x4 should get me there...I'm wondering if anyone else has a floor jack in their possession that will get under the front of the car without the 2x4s that doesn't cost over $300 like the one referenced earlier in this thread.

I have a set of ramps too and they're too steep for this car. I've had this new intercooler sitting on my garage floor for 3 weeks now and I'm going to put it on tomorrow come hell or high water...
Yes, the harborfreight low profile steel jack I recently bought works great. I compare it to a standard trolley jack in this video including the science behind the rapid pump.

I made some custom jack adaptors at a machine shop from steel, I need to make a new video. They are amazing.

Appreciate 0
      07-05-2018, 04:17 PM   #24
Bimmer_Engineer
First Lieutenant
Bimmer_Engineer's Avatar
120
Rep
390
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Louisiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by mecheng77 View Post
Yes, the harborfreight low profile steel jack I recently bought works great. I compare it to a standard trolley jack in this video including the science behind the rapid pump.

I made some custom jack adaptors at a machine shop from steel, I need to make a new video. They are amazing.

I ended up using a low profile jack I already had that didn't quite fit and some wood under the front wheels to get some clearance. Power steering flush and diff fluid change went great...the intercooler swap is going less great. It didn't quite fit exactly so I had to drill a new hole and get some different screws...headed home to bolt it up now...wish me luck...
Appreciate 0
      07-05-2018, 09:46 PM   #25
cahme
Private First Class
45
Rep
153
Posts

Drives: '11 E90 335i Sport MT
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Texas

iTrader: (0)

I generally agree with what you have said, but ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Per the BMW TIS procedure I posted earlier, the correct way is to jack the car up from the center front and center rear jack points and set the car down on flat-topped jack stands.
In the pdf discussing the trolley jack, it doesn't say a "correct" way, but does state:
"The vehicle may be raised with a trolley jack only at the following jacking points!
1 Car jacking point on reinforcement strut (rearwheeldrive)
2 Side car jacking points
3 Rear differential"

I personally don't use the side jacking points to lift, but it clearly states they may be used.
Appreciate 0
      07-06-2018, 11:07 AM   #26
mecheng77
Lieutenant
mecheng77's Avatar
117
Rep
553
Posts

Drives: 2007 328i JBlk , Volvo S70 T5
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Ontario Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cahme View Post
I generally agree with what you have said, but ...


In the pdf discussing the trolley jack, it doesn't say a "correct" way, but does state:
"The vehicle may be raised with a trolley jack only at the following jacking points!
1 Car jacking point on reinforcement strut (rearwheeldrive)
2 Side car jacking points
3 Rear differential"

I personally don't use the side jacking points to lift, but it clearly states they may be used.
Where is item 1) the "reinforcement strut"?
Appreciate 0
      07-06-2018, 12:13 PM   #27
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
3471
Rep
10,882
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cahme View Post
I generally agree with what you have said, but ...


In the pdf discussing the trolley jack, it doesn't say a "correct" way, but does state:
"The vehicle may be raised with a trolley jack only at the following jacking points!
1 Car jacking point on reinforcement strut (rearwheeldrive)
2 Side car jacking points
3 Rear differential"

I personally don't use the side jacking points to lift, but it clearly states they may be used.
I said it was the correct way because the TIS is published by BMW, the manufacturer of the vehicle, so it is a fair position to take that if the manufacturer publishes technical information on how to lift and support the vehicle, then it is the correct way.

The correct way to raise the vehicle is published by BMW so to 1) prevent harm to the technician working on the vehicle, and 2) prevent damage to the vehicle. I've stated over and over in this thread and on the fourm the safest way to raise the E9X is to use the center-front jacking point and set the front down on flattopped jack stands, then lift the rear using the rear-center jacking point (the diff housing) and set the rear down of flattopped jack stands. The jack stands are placed under the side lifting points (the plastic blocks).

I use the side lifting points because they are placed there for use with commercial automotive lifts, which is what I have. The car can sit on the plastic blocks until the suspension fastening hardware rusts away and the wheels fall off

The side lift points are designed for the car to sit on when lifted.
Appreciate 0
      07-07-2018, 01:41 PM   #28
cahme
Private First Class
45
Rep
153
Posts

Drives: '11 E90 335i Sport MT
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Texas

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mecheng77 View Post
Where is item 1) the "reinforcement strut"?
It's in the PDF attached to Post #7:
https://www.e90post.com/forums/showp...04&postcount=7


Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh
I said it was the correct way because the TIS is published by BMW, the manufacturer of the vehicle, so it is a fair position to take that if the manufacturer publishes technical information on how to lift and support the vehicle, then it is the correct way.
My point in quoting the TIS was to re-enforce that lifting the car with a trolley jack at a side car jacking point is stated as an option, therefore is indeed a "correct" way to lift.

That is all, no hidden points behind it. I've read many who use it to gain access to the center jacking point, which seems to be within the guidelines set in the TIS posted.
Appreciate 0
      07-07-2018, 02:37 PM   #29
ThugzZ BunnY
Major
ThugzZ BunnY's Avatar
United_States
417
Rep
1,021
Posts

Drives: 2011 335i
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: BMW of Chattanooga

iTrader: (0)

you boys sure do like to talk about jacking
__________________
IG: @andy__wise
Appreciate 0
      07-08-2018, 07:33 AM   #30
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
3471
Rep
10,882
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cahme View Post
It's in the PDF attached to Post #7:
https://www.e90post.com/forums/showp...04&postcount=7



My point in quoting the TIS was to re-enforce that lifting the car with a trolley jack at a side car jacking point is stated as an option, therefore is indeed a "correct" way to lift.

That is all, no hidden points behind it. I've read many who use it to gain access to the center jacking point, which seems to be within the guidelines set in the TIS posted.
Okay, so I'll try this one last time. IIRC correctly the point of this thread was that the side lifting points , which is where the plastic lifting blocks are located, the plastic blocks get "easily" damaged, and several companies, and private owners, have devised various "adapter" devices to prevent damage to the plastic lifting blocks.

The point I made was adapters are not necessary to protect the plastic lifting blocks if the proper equipment and procedure is used to lift and then support the vehicle. In the link you posted, I provided examples of what the proper equipment is, a long-reach saddle jack and flat-topped jack stands. The .pdf is from the BMW TIS, which shows where jacking (lifting) and supporting equipment (i.e. jack stands) are to touch the chassis. Elsewhere in the thread I explained that the plastic lifting blocks get damaged because owners use cheap floor jacks that do not roll under the car while it is being lifted, which side-loads the walls of the plastic lifting block, thus damaging them. Also, I stated that if the incorrect jack stands are used under the plastic lifting blocks (i.e. axle jack stands) the narrow and curved head of the stand concentrates the weight of the vehicle on small areas of the walls of the plastic lifting blocks, which over-stresses the wall and deforms it, thus damaging the plastic lifting block. This same phenomenon happens when a floor jack is used on the plastic lifting block where the edges of the cup of the jack over-stresses the walls of the plastic lifting. So companies, and private owners, devise adapters to fit into the lifting block to fill the void and spread the load onto a flat sacrificial surface.

In TIS drawing, BMW shows the 3 different locations the chassis can be lifted from. 1 - is the front-center jacking point, where one uses a floor jack to lift the entire front of the vehicle; 2 - are the plastic lifting blocks; 3 - is the differential rear-center jacking point, where one uses a floor jack to lift the entire rear of the vehicle. I stated that the correct and safe way to lift and then support the vehicle is to use the front and rear center jacking points and then place flat-topped jack stands under the side plastic lifting blocks. Using the proper tools for this technique requires no adapters for the plastic lifting blocks.

The #2 side plastic lifting blocks are considered jacking points by BMW, but their primary purpose is to be used by commercial automotive lifts, such as a Bend-Pack, or Rotary lift.

Yes, you can use the side plastic lifting blocks to jack the chassis up. If you use the proper technique, which is allowing the floor jack to roll under the side of the car as it is being lifted will not damage the lifting block. The problem with that technique is most cheap floor jacks have small metal wheels that don't roll well under load, and thus the jack cup under the plastic lifting block pulls sideways on the walls of the plastic lifting block, which damages the block. The other issue with this method is once the car is lifted using the side plastic lifting block, there is then no place to place a jack stand to support the chassis. BMW expressly states in other documents (and in the Bentley Repair Manual) not to place jack stands under other parts of the chassis/suspension because that chassis/suspension may get damaged. So this indicates the correct way to lift and support the vehicle is to use the front/rear center jacking point method.

So... to prevent all of that stupid shit from happening and needing to use stupid adapters, just get the correct equipment and use the proper front-center/rear-center procedure to lift and support the vehicle.
__________________
A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission.

Last edited by Efthreeoh; 07-08-2018 at 07:39 AM.
Appreciate 0
      07-08-2018, 07:34 AM   #31
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
3471
Rep
10,882
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThugzZ BunnY View Post
you boys sure do like to talk about jacking
Well, it does give us all a lift now doesn't it.
__________________
A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission.
Appreciate 0
      07-09-2018, 12:00 PM   #32
mecheng77
Lieutenant
mecheng77's Avatar
117
Rep
553
Posts

Drives: 2007 328i JBlk , Volvo S70 T5
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Ontario Canada

iTrader: (0)

Efthreeoh You make many valid points, I agree jacking from the front and rear is better for the reasons you list. However, inside a garage it is hard to find the length in many garages, especially with the rapid pump jacks which have long poles. Something I outline in my video, they need more force to jack them up.

I would have to keep my garage door open to jack the rear of car and in the front it would be tight for room. That is the only reason I sometimes jack from the side but I make sure my jack rolls, I then put 1 jack stand and only do it when working for a small time duration (quick tire change), otherwise the car is on all 4 jack stands.
Appreciate 0
      07-09-2018, 08:28 PM   #33
lab_rat
Lieutenant
lab_rat's Avatar
United_States
163
Rep
447
Posts

Drives: E90 330i ZSP/ZPP/ZMT
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: San Antonio, TX

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Use the correct procedure and proper tools...

Most people do not know how to properly use a floor saddle jack.
In the pdf, the picture isn't very clear for me as far as the exact location on the rear diff to lift using the floor jack.

I assumed its the subframe, but it appears to point to the 'pumpkin' itself?

BTW, I have those exact stands, and an Arcan XL2T floor jack. Top notch equipment.
Appreciate 0
      07-27-2018, 11:00 AM   #34
Bimmer_Engineer
First Lieutenant
Bimmer_Engineer's Avatar
120
Rep
390
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Louisiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
So I was looking for some flat top jackstands and I found these...any reason these wouldn't work? They don't look nearly as sturdy as the ESCO jackstands...but they say they're rated to 3 tons....and they're a lot cheaper...

https://www.etrailer.com/Camper-Jack...BoCwg0QAvD_BwE
Appreciate 0
      07-28-2018, 07:24 AM   #35
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
3471
Rep
10,882
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Engineer View Post
So I was looking for some flat top jackstands and I found these...any reason these wouldn't work? They don't look nearly as sturdy as the ESCO jackstands...but they say they're rated to 3 tons....and they're a lot cheaper...

https://www.etrailer.com/Camper-Jack...BoCwg0QAvD_BwE
I think the pad would be troublesome mating up to the lifting block on the E9X. Using an adapter would help.
__________________
A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission.
Appreciate 0
      07-28-2018, 07:46 AM   #36
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
3471
Rep
10,882
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lab_rat View Post
In the pdf, the picture isn't very clear for me as far as the exact location on the rear diff to lift using the floor jack.

I assumed its the subframe, but it appears to point to the 'pumpkin' itself?

BTW, I have those exact stands, and an Arcan XL2T floor jack. Top notch equipment.
The TIS clearly states not to use the aluminum diff cover, which mean use the pumpkin.

I decided to reformat the TIS instructions:
Attached Images
File Type: pdf E90 Lifting with trolly jack2.pdf (68.0 KB, 24 views)
__________________
A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission.
Appreciate 0
      07-28-2018, 08:17 AM   #37
Bimmer_Engineer
First Lieutenant
Bimmer_Engineer's Avatar
120
Rep
390
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Louisiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
I think the pad would be troublesome mating up to the lifting block on the E9X. Using an adapter would help.
I just ordered a set of the stands and 4 hockey pucks to use as adapters...Iíll let yíall know how it goes.
Appreciate 0
      08-18-2018, 07:27 AM   #38
Bimmer_Engineer
First Lieutenant
Bimmer_Engineer's Avatar
120
Rep
390
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Louisiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Engineer View Post
So I was looking for some flat top jackstands and I found these...any reason these wouldn't work? They don't look nearly as sturdy as the ESCO jackstands...but they say they're rated to 3 tons....and they're a lot cheaper...

https://www.etrailer.com/Camper-Jack...BoCwg0QAvD_BwE
For anyone else looking for cheaper flat top jack stands...I bought these for $40 and 4 hockey pucks off of eBay for $11. I tried it out for the first time yesterday and it worked great...
Appreciate 0
      09-09-2018, 12:15 PM   #39
mecheng77
Lieutenant
mecheng77's Avatar
117
Rep
553
Posts

Drives: 2007 328i JBlk , Volvo S70 T5
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Ontario Canada

iTrader: (0)

Just Got the steel BMW jack stand pads from the machine shop. I try them out and show how I designed them.

What do you guys use for your jack stands?

Appreciate 0
      09-09-2018, 12:55 PM   #40
Bimmer_Engineer
First Lieutenant
Bimmer_Engineer's Avatar
120
Rep
390
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Louisiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Iím using these with 4 hockey pucks on top...hey work great! Iíve had the car on them for up to a week with no issues...

https://www.etrailer.com/Camper-Jack...BoCwg0QAvD_BwE
Appreciate 0
      09-09-2018, 01:05 PM   #41
TheMidnightNarwhal
Major
Canada
228
Rep
1,244
Posts

Drives: 2011 335is 6 speed
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Gatineau, Quebec

iTrader: (0)

Don't see why you need any adapter. I've raised the car without any and held it up on all 4s for 4 days with regular V jack stand.
Appreciate 0
      09-09-2018, 01:14 PM   #42
Bimmer_Engineer
First Lieutenant
Bimmer_Engineer's Avatar
120
Rep
390
Posts

Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Louisiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Duplicate post
Appreciate 0
      09-09-2018, 02:10 PM   #43
blueloco
Enlisted Member
12
Rep
47
Posts

Drives: 325xi
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Alaska

iTrader: (0)

Costco had a very similar to the HF trolley jack for less than $100. Works great on my XI with no need to drive up on 2x4 or ramps. Before that it was a pain to get onto the stands. I ordered new jack pads because the old ones were really torn up. The PO had the vehicle serviced by BMW or an indy shop and I have the 'complete' service history so it makes me wonder how they ended up that way.

Anyway, I am experimenting with a couple of acetal blocks I machined to fit inside of the BMW jack pad lift points. I milled them to fit flush with the jack pads except raised on the ends. This lets me set the car on the jackstands with the pad sitting in the U/saddle of the jack stand and the raised edges shouldn't allow the vehicle to slip off. Acetal/delrin is tough stuff, but I would feel better with aluminum. I really don't get what the engineers were intending with these things but they can be made to work. It is better than a pinch weld I guess.
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:34 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST