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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > N52 camshaft & crankshaft correlations faults



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      11-05-2019, 10:26 AM   #1
deropke
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N52 camshaft & crankshaft correlations faults

My n52 330i e92 is throwing the following fault codes:
2a82 - vanos intake
2a87 exhaust vanos variable camshaft timing
2a98 crankshaft intake camshaft
2a99 crankshaft exhaust camshaft
2e84 electric coolant pump missing
2f6c exhaust gas flap activation



Garage advised me onto doing oil flush and changing sparkplug, however I already done oil flush to get rid of famous tapping noise and spark plugs were already changed recently according to service book however previous owner used conventional oil, and used water as coolant so he probably skimped and bought used spark plugs.

Anyways the shop said if oil and sparkplugs already done, next is timing chain which he quoted £1500 including vvt pulleys.

The question is there anything i can do to before commiting at spending £1500.

The symptoms of the car, slow start when cold, rough idle at times, bad mpg, strong gas smell from exhaust, car sometimes but very rarelly stutters (4 times in 500 miles or so)

Last edited by deropke; 11-05-2019 at 11:39 AM..
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      11-05-2019, 11:00 AM   #2
gbalthrop
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deropke View Post
My n52 330i e92 is throwing the following fault codes:
Camshaft and crankshaft correlation [WHICH Camshaft: Intake or Exhaust?]
Limited vanos movement [WHICH VANOS: Intake or Exhaust?]
...
The symptoms of the car, slow start when cold, rough idle at times, bad mpg, strong gas smell from exhaust, car sometimes but very rarelly stutters (3 times in 500 miles or so)
What you have posted above are NOT "Fault Codes" -- those are "someone's" attempted definition of a P-code or Hex-code which are the actual "Fault Codes". The accuracy of those "definitions" depends upon the source of the definitions and/or the Scan Tool or Software used to Read Fault Codes. Also without Freeze Frame Data such as Engine Temp & RPM when the Fault Code was saved in DME (Engine Control Module) Memory, one cannot properly diagnose the issue.

So the question becomes HOW can you obtain ALL Fault Codes saved in ALL Modules (~ 20) in your vehicle, AND ALL Fault Code Definitions and Details, with Freeze Frame Data, saved in the DME or Engine Control Module. A shop with INPA or ISTA could do that in 10 minutes. A shop that REALLY knew what it was doing could even give you "ScreenPrints" of any such Fault Code Screens in jpg format on a thumb drive you provide, which you could then attach to a post here to get proper "2nd opinions."

If you have a Windows 10 Laptop, the best solution for getting proper diagnosis of your E9x BMW issues is to get a K+DCAN cable (~$45 US) to connect your laptop USB port to the vehicle OBD II Socket, get a FREE download of INPA, install, & learn how to Read Codes (and MUCH more when needed) with the help of the Forums.

So BEFORE even considering spending Thousands on a 14-year-old vehicle which appears to generally be functional, I would suggest planning a "Diagnostic Strategy" that makes sense for you, based upon such factors as your available time & interest in vehicle diagnostics, computer savvy, nearby reliable BMW Independent shop with INPA or ISTA, etc.

We can't help without Actual Fault Codes and supporting Definitions, FF Data & Details. ALL we can do is try to help you determine the best way YOU can get that information, and ATTACH that info HERE so we can help.

George
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      11-05-2019, 11:35 AM   #3
deropke
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Fixed the codes
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      11-05-2019, 12:26 PM   #4
gbalthrop
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deropke View Post
My n52 330i e92 is throwing the following fault codes:
2a82 - vanos intake
2a87 exhaust vanos variable camshaft timing
2a98 crankshaft intake camshaft
2a99 crankshaft exhaust camshaft
[Above are related to Cam Timing issues; codes below NOT addressed here]
2e84 electric coolant pump missing
2f6c exhaust gas flap activation
...
NOW we have SOMETHING to work with.
It WOULD be helpful however to know what Scan Tool or Software was used to Read those codes, and WHERE the definitions you list after the codes came from?

Here are Bentley Definitions for those codes:
P0012 | 2A82 | 'A' Camshaft Position Timing Over-Retarded (Bank 1)
P0015 | 2A87 | 'B' Camshaft Position Timing Over-Retarded (Bank 1)
P1554 | 2A98 | Engine Position System 'A' Performance (Bank 1)
P1553 | 2A99 | Engine Position System 'B' Performance (Bank 1)

BOTH the Intake Cam & Exhaust Cam are "Over-Retarded" (2A82 & 2A87). We don't know from the fault codes whether that is a CONSTANT situation, or intermittent, such as at HOT IDLE. Freeze Frame Data & Fault Details would help answer that question. The VANOS units on the front of the cams need Oil Pressure to properly advance the cam timing from its default "Retarded" position, and the Cam Position Sensors on the front of the engine send signals to the DME (Engine Control Module) to indicate Actual Cam Position. Best "next step" is to observe actual Cam Position Sensor signal as received by DME during engine operation, to see if retarded condition is ALWAYS present, is intermittent, or is engine/oil temp-related.

Also, the "2A98" & "2A99" codes indicate some undefined inconsistency between the Cam Position Sensor Signals and the Crankshaft Sensor signals. While that COULD be a mechanical issue in the timing chain, that is LESS likely than an electrical connector/ wiring issue in the Connectors and wiring between the Cam Sensors and the DME.

The elegant "next step" if you had INPA or other BMW-specific software or Scan Tool capable of reading Cam Position Parameters in "Real Time" would be to observe actual cam timing during engine operation, as described above.

If that equipment is NOT available, you can do the following simple checks yourself:
1) Remove the Connector from each Cam Position Sensor.
2) Inspect the Connector and the visible wiring near the sensor or on the front of the engine for any sign of failure or damage (such as from a broken serpentine belt).
3) Clean the pins/sockets of the Sensor & Connector with Electronic Contact Cleaner & reassemble.
4) Remove the Oil Filter Cover & inspect filter cartridge, spool on which it is mounted, and small o-ring at bottom of spool for any filter element collapse, or other issue. Oil Pressure is reduced if filter improperly installed, and that causes retarded Cam Timing, particularly at hot idle.
5) IF you have NEVER changed filter yourself: Get old rags, cover serpentine belt & alternator with rags or plastic to prevent oil damage, unscrew cover (preferably with proper tool so as NOT to damage Cover) with old rags handy to prevent oil from dripping; SLOWLY & carefully lift cover 2 or 3 centimeters and allow it to drain into housing for a minute or two. Then remove with drip pan or such catching remaining oil draining from filter & cap.

We have NO way of knowing if there is an issue with your oil filter, but there HAVE been similar reports of those first two codes which WERE caused by improper oil filter element assembly, and "Quicklube" places have been known to throw away the spool the filter element is mounted on, and just drop a new element in the hole and reinstall Cover. THAT results in LOW OIL PRESSURE.

Please let us know what you find,
George
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      11-05-2019, 12:44 PM   #5
deropke
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbalthrop View Post
NOW we have SOMETHING to work with.
It WOULD be helpful however to know what Scan Tool or Software was used to Read those codes, and WHERE the definitions you list after the codes came from?

Here are Bentley Definitions for those codes:
P0012 | 2A82 | 'A' Camshaft Position Timing Over-Retarded (Bank 1)
P0015 | 2A87 | 'B' Camshaft Position Timing Over-Retarded (Bank 1)
P1554 | 2A98 | Engine Position System 'A' Performance (Bank 1)
P1553 | 2A99 | Engine Position System 'B' Performance (Bank 1)

BOTH the Intake Cam & Exhaust Cam are "Over-Retarded" (2A82 & 2A87). We don't know from the fault codes whether that is a CONSTANT situation, or intermittent, such as at HOT IDLE. Freeze Frame Data & Fault Details would help answer that question. The VANOS units on the front of the cams need Oil Pressure to properly advance the cam timing from its default "Retarded" position, and the Cam Position Sensors on the front of the engine send signals to the DME (Engine Control Module) to indicate Actual Cam Position. Best "next step" is to observe actual Cam Position Sensor signal as received by DME during engine operation, to see if retarded condition is ALWAYS present, is intermittent, or is engine/oil temp-related.

Also, the "2A98" & "2A99" codes indicate some undefined inconsistency between the Cam Position Sensor Signals and the Crankshaft Sensor signals. While that COULD be a mechanical issue in the timing chain, that is LESS likely than an electrical connector/ wiring issue in the Connectors and wiring between the Cam Sensors and the DME.

The elegant "next step" if you had INPA or other BMW-specific software or Scan Tool capable of reading Cam Position Parameters in "Real Time" would be to observe actual cam timing during engine operation, as described above.

If that equipment is NOT available, you can do the following simple checks yourself:
1) Remove the Connector from each Cam Position Sensor.
2) Inspect the Connector and the visible wiring near the sensor or on the front of the engine for any sign of failure or damage (such as from a broken serpentine belt).
3) Clean the pins/sockets of the Sensor & Connector with Electronic Contact Cleaner & reassemble.
4) Remove the Oil Filter Cover & inspect filter cartridge, spool on which it is mounted, and small o-ring at bottom of spool for any filter element collapse, or other issue. Oil Pressure is reduced if filter improperly installed, and that causes retarded Cam Timing, particularly at hot idle.
5) IF you have NEVER changed filter yourself: Get old rags, cover serpentine belt & alternator with rags or plastic to prevent oil damage, unscrew cover (preferably with proper tool so as NOT to damage Cover) with old rags handy to prevent oil from dripping; SLOWLY & carefully lift cover 2 or 3 centimeters and allow it to drain into housing for a minute or two. Then remove with drip pan or such catching remaining oil draining from filter & cap.

We have NO way of knowing if there is an issue with your oil filter, but there HAVE been similar reports of those first two codes which WERE caused by improper oil filter element assembly, and "Quicklube" places have been known to throw away the spool the filter element is mounted on, and just drop a new element in the hole and reinstall Cover. THAT results in LOW OIL PRESSURE.

Please let us know what you find,
George
I didn't do the diagnostics, so I don't know what tools have been used. He suggested me that crankshaft is retarded most likely because of dirty engine, they removed oil filter and apparently oil was very dirty despite I flushed it 500 miles ago. When I did oil flush the oil filter oil cartridge was loose, but i managed to lock it in place again. O-ring seemed fine to me, it doesn't leak at least. I been suggested to do frequent oil flushes until engine is clean, because replacing timing chain while engine is dirty would be useless as new timing chain could go bad as well.
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      11-05-2019, 01:24 PM   #6
gbalthrop
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Oil Filter Cover SHOULD look like this!

Quote:
Originally Posted by deropke View Post
...When I did oil flush the oil filter oil cartridge was loose, but i managed to lock it in place again.
O-ring seemed fine to me, it doesn't leak at least. I been suggested to do frequent oil flushes until engine is clean,
because replacing timing chain while engine is dirty would be useless as new timing chain could go bad as well.
NOT sure what you mean "oil cartridge was loose": Oil Filter Cover should appear as shown in Photo attached.

Make sure you have the "Spool" that the fiter mounts on.
Make sure the spool has the SMALL green (in photo) o-ring at end of Spool.
If EITHER spool or small o-ring are missing, LOW oil pressure.
New Cap ~ $35 from various suppliers. Here's getbmwparts.com Genuine BMW part:
https://www.getbmwparts.com/oem-part...bC1sNi1nYXM%3D
Other Choices:
https://www.autohausaz.com/catalog/k...filter%20cover

When you say cover doesn't leak, THAT is the LARGE O-RING, NOT small o-ring.
Your concept of "timing chain going bad" and mine differ. Please explain.

Let's make sure you have the correct Oil Filter Cover assembly, small o-ring & spool. We can go from there.

George
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      11-05-2019, 01:35 PM   #7
gbalthrop
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Oil Filter Cover SHOULD look MORE like this!

Resized Photo to 25%:

George
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      11-05-2019, 02:41 PM   #8
deropke
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbalthrop View Post
Resized Photo to 25%:

George
I just remembered that i replaced both o rings.

What I meant is, you know that thing that holds oil filter, it wasn't attached to the oil cap when I was changing, so oil filter was floating basically, but I managed to attach it to oil cap when I did my oil flush

Last edited by deropke; 11-05-2019 at 02:50 PM..
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      11-05-2019, 07:55 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deropke View Post
I just remembered that i replaced both o rings.

What I meant is, you know that thing that holds oil filter, it wasn't attached to the oil cap when I was changing, so oil filter was floating basically, but I managed to attach it to oil cap when I did my oil flush
If your engine is dirty inside i would be checking the VANOS filters/check valves. Very easy job, and they do block up if the engine is dirty. They are on the exhaust side of the cylinder head, just in front of the exhaust manifold. Quite common for them to block and restrict oil pressure to the VANOS, resulting in fault codes/ engine running issues.

Edit; just thought i would add that timing chain issues for the N52 engine are extremely rare, so i would definitely not be letting them do the timing chain at this stage.
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Last edited by N52bigblock; 11-05-2019 at 10:42 PM..
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      11-06-2019, 12:21 AM   #10
deropke
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neilj35 View Post
If your engine is dirty inside i would be checking the VANOS filters/check valves. Very easy job, and they do block up if the engine is dirty. They are on the exhaust side of the cylinder head, just in front of the exhaust manifold. Quite common for them to block and restrict oil pressure to the VANOS, resulting in fault codes/ engine running issues.

Edit; just thought i would add that timing chain issues for the N52 engine are extremely rare, so i would definitely not be letting them do the timing chain at this stage.
Yeah I will check vanos solenoids and filters.

I doubt that its timing chain as well given its rarity and shouldnt the problem always occur, rough idle is not constant. Sometimes it idles fine. After I filled fuel to full tank (from half), it had rough idle so bad i though it gonna stall, but it lasted only for seconds and then it ran fine.

Last edited by deropke; 11-06-2019 at 12:35 AM..
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      11-06-2019, 02:58 AM   #11
deropke
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Cleaned vanos solenoids, didn't help :/

Last edited by deropke; 11-06-2019 at 12:40 PM..
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      09-17-2021, 11:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deropke View Post
Cleaned vanos solenoids, didn't help :/
Olá, você conseguiu resolver seu problema? estou encontrando o mesmo código de erro na minha 325i 2011
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      08-09-2022, 07:41 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deropke View Post
Yeah I will check vanos solenoids and filters.

I doubt that its timing chain as well given its rarity and shouldnt the problem always occur, rough idle is not constant. Sometimes it idles fine. After I filled fuel to full tank (from half), it had rough idle so bad i though it gonna stall, but it lasted only for seconds and then it ran fine.
Going to through the same issue from the people trying to charge me $1400 for VCG. I replaced ccv for idle issue. But still having codes I also didn’t have the spool but did replace that and did oil change. Any updates? My next would be to be replace vvt and cam and crank sensor
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