Has anyone contacted BMW regarding 29.2 and lag?

Odan.be · 05-16-2014, 03:07 PM

Sorry for this necro post.

I own a 01/2007 335i (euro), and i strongly suspect i got a software version with the waste gate ratle fix ( leaving 1 waste gate a bit open a lower rpm)
If you look at my dyno you can see it builds torque till 3000 opm and then hitting full boost...
does the latest software version gets rid of this issue ? Or how do i ask bmw to get rid of this abbomination ?

ThatRWD · 05-16-2014, 06:09 PM

Is there a way to get our cars back to the 2007 software?

ihc95 · 05-17-2014, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThatRWD

Is there a way to get our cars back to the 2007 software?

Get a tune...

Odan.be · 05-18-2014, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihc95

Get a tune...

that is not true,

A tuner can not acces the wastegate solenoid management.
A tuner can acces things like boost, fuel, timings etc...
Pre 2007, one waste gaste was always closed during WOT on low rpm's. The newer software always leaves both waste gates a bit open, thus introducing less torque wich is perceived as lag, because at 3000 rpm the waste gate behavior is normal again. (you can see it clearly on my dyno)

I was just wondering if even the most recent updates still have this "wastegate fix"

mankytron · 05-18-2014, 08:49 AM

As far as I understand, BMW has a flash to fix the lag, there is a TSB about it. I have not verified this but one of these days I will go to BMW to get rid of the 29.2...I would rather have rattle and deal with that other ways.

davidkotok · 05-20-2014, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Odan.be

that is not true,

A tuner can not acces the wastegate solenoid management.
A tuner can acces things like boost, fuel, timings etc...
Pre 2007, one waste gaste was always closed during WOT on low rpm's. The newer software always leaves both waste gates a bit open, thus introducing less torque wich is perceived as lag, because at 3000 rpm the waste gate behavior is normal again. (you can see it clearly on my dyno)

I was just wondering if even the most recent updates still have this "wastegate fix"

first of all you can absolutely affect the position of the wastegates with a number of the piggybacks and/ or obd flashed tunes.

secondly - if you want your car back to performance prior to 29.2 you need to go tell your service advisor you are not happy with the responsiveness of the new (this is years old already) DME version and that you want them to plug in the car and click the "revert wastegate operation" button. i had this whole experience years ago and 29.2 is a real let down until you have them undo the wastegate "fix"

Odan.be · 05-20-2014, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davidkotok

]first of all you can absolutely affect the position of the wastegates with a number of the piggybacks and/ or obd flashed tunes.

secondly - if you want your car back to performance prior to 29.2 you need to go tell your service advisor you are not happy with the responsiveness of the new (this is years old already) DME version and that you want them to plug in the car and click the "revert wastegate operation" button. i had this whole experience years ago and 29.2 is a real let down until you have them undo the wastegate "fix"

And even the latest update ( dunno the number) always installs the "waste gate fix" ?
Or did they remove that in the latest versions ? Or do you still have to remove it .. even with the latest and most current versions ?

Grtz !

ThatRWD · 05-20-2014, 01:42 PM

So when everything is perfect how does the turbo lag feel ?

Quisp · 05-29-2014, 07:38 AM

When everything is perfect you ask yourself, what is this turbo lag people are talking about because you do not have it. Very few people are still around that have experienced the car in its original state prior to BMW fixing it by inducing the lag.
As far as the Dyno posted above, if you compare it to the original BMW Sales brochure Dyno you are doing better because the original dyno torque peaked at 1500 and stayed there. Your dyno has the initial spike at the beginning(about 250 rpm late but then continues to climb and your HP has a steady increase.
Scroll down this page to see the original Dyno that BMW used to sell the cars.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ht=v30&page=36

A lag dyno would look pretty similar but shift to the right on the rpm axis so the spike hits at 3000 rpm or above. that is lag. Hit the gas, wait for it to hit 3000 rpm or more then feel it pull.
Not lag: hit the gas and be shoved back in your seat before 2000 rpm

Quisp · 05-29-2014, 08:12 AM

The rattle that accompanies the problem is due to the wastegates not closing completely and they flap. The wastegates not closing will result in the turbos not functioning properly and a serious power reduction. If anyone has eve had Limp mode, you know the feeling. When they close is when you feel the surge. I am not aware that they can be partially open. From what I know of them they are either open or closed or flapping in the breeze but they cant be open partially. The amount of time and when they open can be controlled by the software but not how much they are open.

ThatRWD · 06-14-2014, 08:36 PM

Going in for the fix and jerky transmission shifts from a cold stop on Monday will report back

07chupacabra · 01-22-2015, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThatRWD

Going in for the fix and jerky transmission shifts from a cold stop on Monday will report back

Well last time I took it in, the tech/sa apparently wasn't listening and only did the TCU update. Taking it in again to BMW of Fairfax this time, hopefully things get resolved. Will post an update

.

No one replied last time so I figured there wasn't much interest but enthusiasts and people who care about their car shouldn't let this thread die!

07chupacabra · 01-23-2015, 09:04 PM

Hmm Alexandria just seems to be wasting my time, guess I'll be doing it myself.

Chapman1 · 06-30-2015, 02:41 AM

any extra lag thgen dude?

mxchris727 · 09-23-2015, 07:16 PM

Just wanted to let everyone know that there is an option in ISTA /P for "wategate conversion," which programs them to function as on the pre-29.2 software.

iScream · 11-11-2015, 02:11 PM

Checking in for old time's sake.

Hope everyone is non-laggy and doing well.

Wonder if this old thread will ever hit 5000?

Dackelone · 11-11-2015, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iScream

Checking in for old time's sake.

Hope everyone is non-laggy and doing well.

Wonder if this old thread will ever hit 5000?

I ended up just getting a Stage II sw tune from a German company. That solved all my problems.

BMWnPorsche · 01-31-2016, 01:05 PM

How can I tell if I have 29.2 or not? Is that the version of the update?

meyergru · 01-31-2016, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWnPorsche

How can I tell if I have 29.2 or not? Is that the version of the update?

You cannot. No.

Read this. Come back if you have a question that is not covered in the FAQ.

zl0ca · 10-14-2016, 02:27 PM

I've been chasing an issue with boost lag for weeks now and I believe the conclusion is that I fall in this category. I stopped by the dealership to see what they have to say and it turns out that I'm outside of warranty and they will not cover this service bulletin. Can somebody tell me if anyone has successfully programed the ECU at home?
Thanks

Dackelone · 11-04-2016, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zl0ca

I've been chasing an issue with boost lag for weeks now and I believe the conclusion is that I fall in this category. I stopped by the dealership to see what they have to say and it turns out that I'm outside of warranty and they will not cover this service bulletin. Can somebody tell me if anyone has successfully programed the ECU at home?
Thanks

Most dealers WILL update your engine's SW for an hour or two's labor rate(ie $120 to 240 USd). Tell them that you will pay for the SW update... that should be music to their ears.

808AWD325xi · 12-13-2016, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWnPorsche

How can I tell if I have 29.2 or not? Is that the version of the update?

29.2 simply refers to the BMW software version in use at the time to reprogram control modules (i.e. Progman V29.2).

To determine which software version your vehicle was last reprogrammed with, you first need to know its current integration level.

During development of a given chassis (i.e. E90) and subsequent upgrades and/or fixes, integration levels are defined. An integration level is a defined vehicle configuration from an electrical standpoint (hardware and software) that is validated by BMW. There are three integration level states:

Plant -- the integration level of the vehicle when it left the factory
Dealer -- the current integration level
Backup -- the last integration level

The integration level designation is comprised of the system reference, SOP date (SOP=Start Of Production) and the I-level.

Example: "E89X-13-07-501"

E89X: System reference
13: Year of introduction
07: Month of introduction
501: I-level of the system reference

If you have a K+DCAN cable, you can use INPA or ISTA/D to display the integration level. Alternatively, you could ask your BMW dealer or indy to look it up for you.

To display your current (dealer) integration level with INPA, go to E90 -> Select E90 -> Functional Jobs -> <Shift> + <F2> Vehicle data:

Integration levels correlate to Progman (older) and ISTA/P (current) software versions. Google bmw group ista/p version and i-level overview and examine a chart. Here is an example from ISTA/P P3.57.0:

If your current integration level is "E89X-14-11-501", the vehicle was last reprogrammed with ISTA/P P2.54.3. In which case your vehicle is "post 29.2".

Another example:

If your current integration level is "E89X-08-03-510" or earlier, the vehicle is "pre 29.2".

Quote:

Originally Posted by zl0ca

I've been chasing an issue with boost lag for weeks now and I believe the conclusion is that I fall in this category. I stopped by the dealership to see what they have to say and it turns out that I'm outside of warranty and they will not cover this service bulletin. Can somebody tell me if anyone has successfully programed the ECU at home?
Thanks

You can use WinKFP expert mode to downgrade your DME to whichever software revision you wish.

See this thread for an overview of the process:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1259232

My post in that thread includes a link to the WinKFP expert mode programming guide.

SP daten 29.0 contains all of the "pre 29.2" software revisions for the MSD80 and MSD81. It aligns with integration level E89X-08-03-510.

MSD80.DAT:

Code:

$ PS10INIT N00000000000000000000000000000000000000 B
$ VERSIONKFCONF: kfconf10.dat
;Zusbauvorschrift vom 14.01.2008 11:55
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MSD81.DAT:

Code:

$ PS10INIT N000000000000000000000000x0000000000000 B
$ VERSIONKFCONF: kfconf10.dat
;Zusbauvorschrift vom 26.11.2007 11:44
;SG-TYP: MSD81
;ZB-NR  TYP-NR  HW-NR  IX SW-NR     AM          PIN S CS
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05-16-2014, 03:07 PM	#4907
Odan.be Private First Class 26 Rep 84 Posts Drives: Bmw E91 3351 Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Belgium iTrader: (0)	Sorry for this necro post. I own a 01/2007 335i (euro), and i strongly suspect i got a software version with the waste gate ratle fix ( leaving 1 waste gate a bit open a lower rpm) If you look at my dyno you can see it builds torque till 3000 opm and then hitting full boost... does the latest software version gets rid of this issue ? Or how do i ask bmw to get rid of this abbomination ?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-16-2014, 06:09 PM	#4908
ThatRWD Major 109 Rep 1,062 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Northern VA iTrader: (0)	Is there a way to get our cars back to the 2007 software?
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05-18-2014, 08:49 AM	#4911
mankytron Private First Class 20 Rep 120 Posts Drives: 335 coupe Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: ontario canada iTrader: (0)	As far as I understand, BMW has a flash to fix the lag, there is a TSB about it. I have not verified this but one of these days I will go to BMW to get rid of the 29.2...I would rather have rattle and deal with that other ways.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-20-2014, 01:42 PM	#4914
ThatRWD Major 109 Rep 1,062 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Northern VA iTrader: (0)	So when everything is perfect how does the turbo lag feel ?
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05-29-2014, 07:38 AM	#4915
Quisp Does not play well with others 80 Rep 1,787 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Arizona iTrader: (4)	When everything is perfect you ask yourself, what is this turbo lag people are talking about because you do not have it. Very few people are still around that have experienced the car in its original state prior to BMW fixing it by inducing the lag. As far as the Dyno posted above, if you compare it to the original BMW Sales brochure Dyno you are doing better because the original dyno torque peaked at 1500 and stayed there. Your dyno has the initial spike at the beginning(about 250 rpm late but then continues to climb and your HP has a steady increase. Scroll down this page to see the original Dyno that BMW used to sell the cars. http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ht=v30&page=36 A lag dyno would look pretty similar but shift to the right on the rpm axis so the spike hits at 3000 rpm or above. that is lag. Hit the gas, wait for it to hit 3000 rpm or more then feel it pull. Not lag: hit the gas and be shoved back in your seat before 2000 rpm __________________
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05-29-2014, 08:12 AM	#4916
Quisp Does not play well with others 80 Rep 1,787 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Arizona iTrader: (4)	The rattle that accompanies the problem is due to the wastegates not closing completely and they flap. The wastegates not closing will result in the turbos not functioning properly and a serious power reduction. If anyone has eve had Limp mode, you know the feeling. When they close is when you feel the surge. I am not aware that they can be partially open. From what I know of them they are either open or closed or flapping in the breeze but they cant be open partially. The amount of time and when they open can be controlled by the software but not how much they are open. __________________
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06-14-2014, 08:36 PM	#4917
ThatRWD Major 109 Rep 1,062 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Northern VA iTrader: (0)	Going in for the fix and jerky transmission shifts from a cold stop on Monday will report back
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01-23-2015, 09:04 PM	#4919
07chupacabra First Lieutenant 41 Rep 354 Posts Drives: 07 E92 335i Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Northern VA iTrader: (0)	Hmm Alexandria just seems to be wasting my time, guess I'll be doing it myself.
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06-30-2015, 02:41 AM	#4920
Chapman1 New Member 0 Rep 8 Posts Drives: 5 wheels with 5 doors Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Pittsburgh iTrader: (0)	any extra lag thgen dude?
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09-23-2015, 07:16 PM	#4921
mxchris727 Captain 193 Rep 666 Posts Drives: '03 M5, '06 325i, '12 M3 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Westport, CT iTrader: (0)	Just wanted to let everyone know that there is an option in ISTA /P for "wategate conversion," which programs them to function as on the pre-29.2 software. __________________ BMW GT1 (INPA, DIS, WinKFP, ect..), ISTA/P & /D is up and running! PM me if you want to stop by and code your car.
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11-11-2015, 02:11 PM	#4922
iScream solid @ 153, no, 155mph! 15 Rep 335 Posts Drives: '07/'09/'13 335, '16 340ix Join Date: May 2008 Location: Washington, DC iTrader: (0)	Checking in for old time's sake. Hope everyone is non-laggy and doing well. Wonder if this old thread will ever hit 5000? __________________
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01-31-2016, 01:05 PM	#4924
BMWnPorsche Registered 5 Rep 3 Posts Drives: 2007 BMW 335i Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Pacific Northwest, USA iTrader: (0)	How can I tell if I have 29.2 or not? Is that the version of the update?
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10-14-2016, 02:27 PM	#4926
zl0ca Enlisted Member 2 Rep 35 Posts Drives: 335i Sedan Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Vestal, NY iTrader: (0)	I've been chasing an issue with boost lag for weeks now and I believe the conclusion is that I fall in this category. I stopped by the dealership to see what they have to say and it turns out that I'm outside of warranty and they will not cover this service bulletin. Can somebody tell me if anyone has successfully programed the ECU at home? Thanks
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